Talk:Romulan

Parallels

I think that the Federation could be argued to be the Soviet Russians, they have no cash and work for personal growth and the benfit of society. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mozza1979 (talk • contribs) 15:48, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

Romulan/Chinese parallels

Um, I think it's pretty obvious that the Romulans were the ones we were supposed to associate with Russia. Go back to the very first ever appearance of Romulans, episode #9 of TOS, "Balance of Terror." They have red color schemes and call each other "Comrade." User:Yesspaz

"were written to resemble the opinion of the Americans of that time towards the Chinese government." I don't think I've ever heard this said before, can you exemplify this? How were the TOS Romulans similar to the Chinese? Pomegranate

Talk:Star Trek has a discussion going about alien species' relation to Terran societies, which may be germane here. The closest connection I'd seen between Romulus and China was the writers' use of Chinese names, such as Shinzon, which I hear is Mandarin for "heart". Anville 22:03, 16 Aug 2004 (UTC)

"Heart" in Mandarin is xinzang (pronounced somewhat like "Shin-zong"). Close, but may be coincidentally, since as far as I remember (years of ST-watching), ST draws very little from Chinese culture. It in fact draws much more from the neighbouring Japanese and Korean cultures.

I never heard the Romanulans compared to the Chinese. One of the other ST articles on WP also compared the TOS Klingon to the Chinese. Neither comparison makes sense to me. >:-) --Menchi 03:00, 17 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I remember John Logan (writer of NEMESIS) explaining somewhere the connection between the Chinese and the Romulans, but I can't find it. I specifically remember him mentioning something similar to the comments above for his naming Shinzon.--StAkAr Karnak 20:54, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)

This is all very interesting, but this is only a theory (I haven't seen a single quotation from Roddenberry so far) that has nothing to do with an encyclopaedia. Next time, try to be relevant. Good day.--Stormy Ordos 09:50, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

I think it's more likely to be the Romans. Romulus and Remus are just a couple of reasons why. Dave (talk) 03:52, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Chinese, East Asians, Romulans, and the Cold War

Put it this way: the Original Series Star Trek is in some ways supposed to be modeled after the Cold War. The Klingons are supposed to be the Cold War equivalent of the Russians. The Americans (and its allies) are supposed to be the equivalent of the Federation. The Romulans are the equivalent to the Chinese Communists. The Vulcans represent the Cold War US allies in East Asia including Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, and South Vietnam. Many Americans still cannot tell the difference between Japanese, Koreans, Chinese, Vietnamnese, and Chinese Minnan (Taiwanese). Just look at all those Hollywood movies and TV shows: Chinese being cast as Japanese; Japanese being cast as Chinese; Koreans being cast as Taiwanese! Even the Chinese movie Promise has Japanese and Korean actors playing Chinese. In the Original Series, an Enterprise crew member began to show prejudice against Spock when he discovered that Vulcans and Romulans apparently look alike and started to think that Spock had to be Romulan.

We Asians generally are able to distinguish ourselves, but 25% of the time we might mistake a Chinese to be a Japanese or Korean or vice versa. This might be the equivalent of Spock being viewed without suspicion in the Next Generation Romulus even though he did not sport the standard Romulan forehead ridge. (Personally, I hated the Romulan forehead ridge because it created a very confusing continuity problem between the Original Series and the Next Generation.)

The point here is that from the Original Series point of view, the best way to distingush a Romulan from a Vulcan is from the person's emotions, attitude, and behavior; otherwise, from an untrained eye they look alike. The same could be said for the different East Asian races/ political communities.

Vulcan had an isolationist movement that wanted nothing to do with the Federation. Many East Asian countries traditionally allied to the US do have movements against American involvment in their region.

Star Trek: The Undiscovered Country represented the end of the Cold War between the United States and Russia. Only the United States and China has some subtle form of rivalry and competition. The Chinese current nationalistic emphasis on the greatness of its civilization resembles the Romulan belief that it innovated everything in the universe. The fact that the Romulans never attack first but test the opponents resolve is equivalent to Chinese generals asking the US generals if they are willing to defend Taiwan if the Chinese dropped a neutron bomb in Los Angeles. Allentchang 17:01, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

Here are a variety of articles found in the Internet about this subject, including one directly from the Star Trek website. Because of this, I've decided to restore the Romulan/Chinese analogy. http://www.itaweb.it/startrek/papers/coldwar.html

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Shinzon

http://scifi.about.com/od/reviews/a/kirshararev.htm

http://www.startrek.com/startrek/view/community/chat/archive/transcript/1355.html

http://hypatia.slashcity.org/trekshack/racetrk1.html

Quotation from the article :

'The Romulans were created by Paul Schneider, saying "it was a matter of developing a good Romanesque set of admirable antagonists . . . an extension of the Roman civilization to the point of space travel."'

Which makes me wonder how on earth some people could have thought (just because John Logan said so) that there was a connection between the Romulans and the Asian cultures (which brings another interesting point : Asians are NOT extraterrestrials; but obviously the author of this notice seems to think of his "people" as a special kind of humans that have nothing to do with the others).

Names in Star Trek and Connections to Real-World

It is very shaky ground to take a single (or a few) names in Star Trek and try to link them to real-world nations. This is because there are so many examples of names in Star Trek that closely resemble real world names, but that could not reasonably establish a connection.

For example, if Shinzon (sounds like Chinese for "heart") indicates that the Romulans are Star Trek's equivalent of Chinese, would General Chang (whose name sounds like the English for a common Chinese surname) establish that the Klingons are also Chinese?

Also:

1. Captain Tong - Klingon K'tinga sleeper ship captain from TNG. Tong is a Vietnamese/Chinese surname.

2. IKS Ning'tao and IKS Ch'tang (two Klingon Birds of Prey) - sounds Chinese

3. Prakesh (a Cardassian Galor-class cruiser) - an Asian Indian surname

4. Kumari (Andorian cruiser class) - possibly Indian also? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 162.84.203.198 (talk) 02:10, August 21, 2007 (UTC)

Romulan/Roman connection

I'm not sure whether "unintentional" is the right word to describe to similarity between the Romulan and Roman Empires. As I've noted in the article, the government has similar titles: Proconsul, Praetor, Senator. So there is obviously some intent to draw on the image of Roman-style imperialism. Perhaps "analogous similarity" or something would be more apropriate. Your call, whoever wrote it originally... Pomegranate

Actually, the Star Trek web site had once postulated a theory about this. In Who Mourns for Adonais? the ancient Greek and Roman gods were revealed to be aliens that had visited Earth thousands of years ago. The theory was that these aliens visited a number of other worlds as well, including Vulcan, and perhaps Romulus as well. And I believe that would explain a great deal about why you have a planet and a race named after the god Vulcan, a society built upon the Roman Empire, and why the two homeworlds of the Romulans are named after the brothers held to be the founders of Rome

JesseG 02:52, May 5, 2005 (UTC)

Black Romulans?

Another contributor claims to have seen a Black Romulan on an episode of DS9. Can anybody confirm this? Are we sure that it was a Romulan and not a Vulcan? The only kind of Romulans I've ever seen are the typical "Eurasian" looking kind. Your thoughts and memories please. 25 February 2005

The Black Romulan I saw was in the DS9 episode, "The Visionary" and was named Ruwon. According to Feitclub there was another Black Romulan in the TNG episode, "The Pegasus." -- Old Right 19:01, 25 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Actor Michael Mack (IMDb) played Commander Sirol (Entry at Memory Alpha). I tried to find a photo online but I failed. Trust me, he's Black. --Feitclub 06:04, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)

Romulan emblem

Has it ever been established which part of the Romulan emblem represents which planet? Is Romulus green and Remus blue, or the other way around? — JIP | Talk 19:22, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)

After watching Nemesis, I think it's safe to say Remus is anything but blue or green.

Nemesis was written by Berman and Braga (neither of them ST experts-- or masters of continuity) while the emblem was designed way back during the second season of TNG, when Remus was still undefined. Noclevername 03:57, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Green is used for ch'Rihan (Romulus) and Blue for ch'Havran (Remus). It is best to put any references from Nemesis out of your mind since the Remans in that movie have nothing to do with the 'real' Remans.

Split article

This article should be separated into the Star Trek race page for Romulans and the Star Trek governments page for Romulan Star Empire.... 132.205.45.148 18:02, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Valcun/Romulan split

Valcun and Romulan split around 400 A.D, this would suggest they have warp technology around that time, so shouldn't the Romulan technology be a lot more advanced than Human's?

They may have used slower than light sleeper ships, generation ships, etc. Besides, Romulus is a very conservative culture; they don't change anything unless they have to, probably including technology. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Noclevername (talk • contribs) 04:01, 20 December 2006 (UTC).

Physical strength

Does the vulcan physical strength stem from the planet having a stronger gravity than Earth? I seem to recall this being stated in TOS. If Romulus has a more similar gravity to Earth then over two thousand years their strength would have naturally deteriorated out of lack of use. Rayfire 19:27, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

That's what I thought. But I remember episodes with humans landing and walking on Vulcan and they were fine. Maybe I missed the part where they were injected with something or had to stay in some pressurized cabin to get used to the planet or something.

-G —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 134.117.157.7 (talk) 06:18, 29 January 2007 (UTC).

Humans = 1 Klingons = .9 (Untrained) Vulcan and Rihannsu = 3 Evolved physiology does not atrophy, and it would take millenia for the Rihannsu to lose their "Vulcanoid" muscle advantage. There is also the fact that all of the races have long since removed themselves from physical evolution (this happens when a race starts using its intelligence to build habitats).

If you only base yourself on the episodes from the various shows, it is commonly demonstrated that Vulcans have superior physical strength (shown in TOS,enterprise, DS9,etc...). That frail looking vulcan in Enterprise lifts captain archer as if he was a kid, Spock demonstrates similar capacities in TOS. Romulans on the other hand, are almost always depicted as physically weak. They seem to always be on the losing side when fighting a human. Even Laforge managed to defeat a romulan soldier in one-on-one combat in a TNG episode. Just my 2cents. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.248.85.66 (talk) 04:49, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Star Trek Nemesis is not canon

The policy of Paramount and the Trek producers is that all films and episodes that are produced are considered canon with no exception. It is not the policy of this encyclopedia to alter the facts of definitions on biased personal disagreements with a particular movie.

Yeah and the historically accurate Spartans were straight men. In other words, when something goes against everything that is known about a race it can be dismissed as non-canon, policies of Paramount and its Producers don't change the fact that the movie did not represent the Romulans accurately (nevermind the Rihannsu). Using Nemesis as canon will always get you into trouble. ~S*D

I don't see anything in Nemesis that's not canon (except Deck 29 and the name Shinzon maybe). You could perhaps tell us what isn't Romulan with these Romulans...--Stormy Ordos 09:57, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Well get the DVD, put it in, note the time. When you are finished, note the time again. The period in between does not reflect the Romulan people, never mind the Rihannsu. The story, premise and execution wouldn't work for a children's book. It simply is fiction from a fictional universe. S*D

This is S*D's opinion, not actually backed up by anything in Star Trek canon. So he doesn't like Nemesis—fine, he's entitled to that point of view. But there was nothing about the film that contradicted established "facts" about the Romulans (not including anything "established" in novels), and it certainly is canon.--Antodav2007 (talk) 02:44, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Empathic?

The article states that the Romulan commander from the Enterprise Incident was able to "commune either telepathically or empathically" when she touched Spock's fingers. Huh? Where did that come from? I think I'll delete that, as it's pure speculation. Noclevername 04:15, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Empress?

The novel trilogy Star Trek Voyage: Dark Matters features a triumvirate ruling the Romulan Empire: an Empress, a Praetor and a Proconsul. The article does not mention an Emperor or an Empress. Has one ever appeared in canon, or was this invented in the novel trilogy? JIP | Talk 13:26, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Q mentions an Empress in "The Q and the Grey", apparently. Morwen - Talk 13:30, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

There was the Ruling Queen, who was responsible for the death of S'task. And the only Empress was the great Rihanha (Ael i-Mhiessan t'Rllaillieu) who liberated the Rihannsu from the enemies of mnhei'sahe. These events were chronicled in the Empty Chair by Diane Duane~S*D

Gray Heart

Is the Romulan heart literally gray? I heard Garak say that: "[On Romulus]You'll find the predominate color to be gray- the buildings, the clothes, the people. Did you know that the Romulan heart itself is gray?" but I didn't think it was literal-he was making fun of them.--Filippo Argenti 02:24, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Pro-"Rihannsu" bias?

This quote from the Books section about the non-canon Rihannsu novels of Dian Duane, as well as a listing of military ranks seems problematic in the Military section: "These books, like most of the other Trek novels, are not canon. Though they are highly respected and preferred when referring to the Romulans (Rihannsu)." -- 76.24.22.102 12:11, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

The military ranks as given in the second part are correct (arrain, Riov, khre'Riov etc), Canon never came up with a coherent system. S*D

TNG/DS9 era pictures?

Both of the pictures are of TOS-era Romulans. Can we add/replace one with the new Romulan look from the later series? It would seem to compliment the text better since most of the Romulan aesthetics discussed in the article are not illustrated by the pictures. (DrZarkov 22:04, 15 May 2007 (UTC))

These will be provided by the Rihannsu who are now monitoring this page. It bears saying that any (continued) unauthorized tampering with this page will result in a military response. ~S*D

What is this about Romulan marijuana in Popular Cultur section?

What the heck is this about in the "In Popular Culture" section that there is a type of marijuana called Romulan. That has nothing to do with the Star Trek Romulans nor does it have any relevance to them. Maybe it was named after them but it still have no relevance. It is very out of place. It should be moved to the marijuana article. Azn Clayjar 04:14, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Merge in Romulus and Remus

Resolved

It is a very short, in-universe article that would add more material to this one and make it more complete. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 23:56, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

Done, but I'm not sure about the redirect I have in place at the old article, would somebody mind checking it for me? Alastairward (talk) 19:58, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

It's perfect, good job :) Judgesurreal777 (talk) 21:46, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Merge in Tal Shiar and Reman

They have zero notability on their own, and would make this article more comprehensive, and eliminate two stubs, so a win-win all around. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 22:59, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Please do not bring Canon/Non-Canon fights to this page

It's time to add a section on Nero in the new Star Trek movie.

Please do not bring Canon/Non-Canon fights to this page

Greetings,

I am writing to implore people to not bring the Canonical battles to wiki. This is *NOT* a Star Trek forum, but a place for people to find information, in this case about the Romulan people. ALL information should be contained in an encyclopedia and should not be removed, edited or otherwise abused.

Thanks in advance for your cooperation.

Jolan'tru and Mnhei'sahe!

Yours in Ongoing Rihannsu Plasma, Star*Dagger, khre'Riov, Blackwing —Preceding unsigned comment added by Star*Dagger (talk • contribs) 13:43, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Agreed. And all information should be cited to a reliable source. --EEMIV (talk) 13:45, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Kobiyashi Maru

This segment of the article, while interesting (and eerily similar to a short story idea I once had but never wrote), is not canon:

A year later Admiral Valdore attempted once again to cause conflict in the region. This time using "Telecapture", designed to take over and control enemy ships. Using three Klingon vessels, Valdore attacked Coalition of Planets allies hoping to weaken or destroy two enemies of the Romulan Star Empire by provoking a war. Captain Archer was eventually able to provide evidence of this Romulan deception. This was followed by yet another unsuccessful attempt to break apart the alliance which involved using telecaptured Vulcan cruisers against Proxima Centauri (a recent coalition member). The event that finally sparked the Coalition's declaration of war against the Romulans was the destruction of the Earth freighter Kobayashi Maru.

I understand this is from one of the novels, which are as we all know not considered canon. The article contains plenty of other non-canon information from novels, which is fine, but this paragraph is not clearly identified as being from a novel, which would lead one to think that this occurred in an Enterprise episode. I am clarifying this with a header and brief explanation.--Antodav2007 (talk) 02:59, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

"Smarter and better looking"

The material in this edit is trivial at best. I think we can do without it. Chris Cunningham (not at work) - talk 21:33, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

I agree. It's not canon, it's not particularly accurate, etc.--SarekOfVulcan (talk) 16:12, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

Destruction of Romulus

Romulus is destroyed in the 2009 Star Trek movie at somtimke in the 24th century. I think this should be mentioned in the article. --MrBurns (talk) 20:06, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

From what I remember the year of the destruction of Romulus is 2379. --MrBurns (talk) 20:10, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

The Countdown comic says it was 2387. Spock says that "in 129 years time" Romulus will be destroyed. That makes it 2258. Dave (talk) 22:35, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

The movie is set in 2258 also because kirk was born 2233, which is also the year of the destruction of the USS Kelvin in the timeline of the movie, which is an altrernate tmeline of the star trek universe. And there are 25 years between the destruction of the USS Kelvin and the destruction of the Vulcan in this timeline. --MrBurns (talk) 14:22, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Actually, the main plot of Star Trek (2009) is set in 2258, because James T. Kirk was born 2233 and it is mentioned, that there are 25 years between the date of the destruction of the USS Kelvin and the destruction of Vulkan (which are both events, which only take place in the alternate timline, which is used in this movie). --MrBurns (talk) 20:17, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

Isolation?

I found the following set of statements in the Isolation section rather questionable...

“In 2311, an event known as the Tomed Incident occurred between the Romulans and the Federation, costing thousands of lives…” “For the next fifty years, the Neutral Zone was quiet. There was no direct contact between the Federation and the Empire, nor were there any further Romulan incursions.” “In 2344, four Romulan Warbirds attacked the Klingon outpost at Narendra III. The USS Enterprise (NCC-1701-C) responded to the outpost's distress call…”

Even if it is how it was delivered in continuity it still doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I think there should be some qualifier in the sentence that declares that there was no contact for fifty years when there was clearly contact in 2311 and 2344. Satyrquaze (talk) 17:06, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

An explanation is Needed Please

The article needs to explain why in the new JJ Abrams film, Romulans are just as strong as the Vulcans, when, traditionally in the Star Trek cannon, unless I haven't been paying attention or just plain dumb, far as I know, the Romulans, physical strength wise, were only on the same level as humans. Then all of a sudden in the Abrams film, a Romulan picks up Kirk by the neck as if though he were a little kid. Please expand the article to cover that major hole, or someone please answer the question. I posted this thing on the Vulcan article discussion page too; the subject is related so I thought it appropriate. Please expand the article.

67.148.120.100 (talk) 21:20, 20 May 2009 (UTC)stardingo747