Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cort Webber

Cort Webber

Cort Webber (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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Bobby "Fatboy" Roberts (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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Procedural nomination. These articles are about the co-hosts of a podcast that has been deleted following AfD: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cort and Fatboy. Deletion was upheld at deletion review (Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2011 April 10). Both articles use content from the deleted article (see [1]), which is a violation of the copyright of our contributors unless the history is restored. However, history should not be restored if the material is inappropriate. Bringing it here for review, as either this must go, or that must come back. Note that there is evidently more content from the deleted version in Cort Webber than Bobby "Fatboy" Roberts. Moonriddengirl ^(talk) 13:37, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

It's not a podcast, it's a radio show. -- —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.21.199.70 (talk) 17:19, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Radio-related deletion discussions. — • Gene93k (talk) 14:19, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. — • Gene93k (talk) 14:20, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

• Delete both as coverage in reliable third-party sources is either glancing or minimal and so the articles fail to cross the notability threshold. As in the previous joint article, the URLs had been omitted from the newspaper references making review of the sources more difficult for the reader. I have restored these references to completeness. - Dravecky (talk) 14:31, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

A 3,000 word interview on AOL is "minimal"? -- —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.21.199.70 (talk) 17:19, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

• Delete: These are significant copies of the deleted C&F article that provide no sourced content beyond that article. Hasteur (talk) 15:42, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Not quite. Isn't this new? 'Get the Look: Portland's Bobby "Fatboy" Roberts". 2011-04-04. Retrieved 10 May 2011.' —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.134.136.15 (talk) 03:34, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

• Keep Both: These articles are still being built. Making a decision at this point would be premature. The articles should be allowed to grow for a period before any decision is made. It is also interesting to note that many of both of them have coworkers, both from their KUFO days, as well as at Cascadia.fm, as well as most of their guest, who have full articles in Wikipedia. TEG (talk) 21:19, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

• Delete both- I agree with Dravecky that the coverage in reliable third-party sources is marginal at best. We've had several AfDs and DRVs on this topic already and the people defending it have been unable to demonstrate notablity. Reyk _YO! 21:36, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
• 3,000 word interview on AOL. *ahem* -- —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.21.199.70 (talk) 17:19, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

• Keep Both: If only to piss off Dravecky, who seems to have a strange vendetta against these two guys. Poor dude. I wonder if he's ever felt the soft, warm embrace of sunlight. We can only hope. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.193.196.252 (talk) 21:40, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Struck vote of vandalous troll. Reyk _YO! 22:07, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
• Delete both, but then either incubate or userfy to TEG24601, who feels this material is improvable. TEG24601 should get the opportunity to improve it if he wants. This will mean that the userfying admin will need to fix the history for licencing purposes. (This need not be complex. It will be in order just to place the list of contributors on the userfied article's talk page and leave an edit summary indicating that this has been done.)—S Marshall T/C 22:45, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
• Keep Both content is valid and notoriety has passed reasonable threshold for inclusion in an online wiki such as Wikipedia. Both figures are well know within the greater Portland, OR area as well as people across the world. Articles makes references to known, reliable third party publications.Aadain (talk) 23:08, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
• Keep Both Anyone who questions the "reliability" of both articles' sources clearly lacks knowledge of Portland and Oregon. The Oregonian's the big daily paper here. Willamette Week has a weekly circulation of 80K+. The Portland Mercury is always widely read up and down the I-5 corridor. They've also appeared on shows like Outlook Portland and many times on television news stations like KGW. They may not be known in Virginia, but they're big here locally. The original article's page shouldn't have been deleted and neither should the pages for Webber and Roberts. The naysayers here are being both ruthless and nitpicky. The recent string of pranking vandals should, if anything, bespeak of the hosts' popularity....if little of the maturity of their listeners/fanbase. If only they were more willing to drudge up citations. That said, no amount of citations will ever appease the, to be it nicely, "pedantic" among us. Hawthornestreetblues (talk) 00:18, 19 May 2011 (UTC) — Hawthornestreetblues (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
• Delete both "local" notability doesn't cut it. And The Weeks' circulation numbers are a moot point in this discussion.   ArcAngel   (talk) ) 01:02, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

• Keep Both The hosts have been covered in the AP, they're on TV and they keep getting into the top 100 on iTunes. Where's the problem? As for what ArcAngel says, there's plenty of Wikipedia articles with backbones built entirely on local coverage. If you really want to get into it, isn't the New York Times "local"? The Oregonian is up there in stature. Their staff has won Pulitzers and it's one of the biggest publications in the NW. 64.134.136.15 (talk) 03:32, 19 May 2011 (UTC) — 64.134.136.15 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

• Comment Where's the problem? Where's the sources to back up your claims? Where are they on TV at? Sources! Also, iTunes charting also doesn't confer notability.   ArcAngel   (talk) ) 04:13, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

• • 3,000 words on AOL doesn't cut it? Take a look at the comment below, which points out that KGW doesn't archive their content past 90 days. The Oregonian and the AOL interview should be more than enough to establish notability.

• Delete both: coverage is thin, local and generally fairly tangential. Also this recreation-from-deleted-content has more than a little of a G4 Speedy rationale. Hrafn^Talk_Stalk(P) 04:02, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
• Delete both lacking reliable sources to meet notability. the fact that only multiple single purpose editors are voting keep says something. LibStar (talk) 06:36, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
  • The fact that people who don't do Wikipedia are on here, trying to save the article, speaks volumes. Sorry, I don't really know all that much about the cite but you guys are all hung up on "reliability." If major dailies and internet sources aren't reliable, what is?

• Keep Both are people just parroting "lacking reliable sources" to ensure adherence to the letter of wikipedia guidelines as opposed to intent? AOL's film site Cinematical.com conducted an over 3000 word interview with Roberts about his Geek: Remixed project, and Hats.com conducted another almost 2000 word interview with him as well. Neither of these mentions could or should be considered "glancing." The TV appearances on the Portland affiliate of the CW were sourced, and the Portland affiliate of NBC notes that they were featured guests, however their archives automatically reset after what appears to be 90 days. The Geek: Remixed project mention in the Mercury, the various other mentions in the Oregonian and the Willamette Week...I'm not sure where this "reliable sources" conflict keeps cropping up, unless you take into account the people making these judgments have literally no knowledge of the subject they're claiming to be policing. In which case it then makes perfect sense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.105.172.223 (talk) 15:22, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Reply Nobody is questioning the reliability of the Willamette Week but their only mention in the cited article is noting a failed attempt by a few fans to file "more than 900 fraudulent votes" in the survey. The "Shake-up at KUFO" article from The Oregonian is great but the only mention of either man is this: "KUFO's afternoon hosts, Cort and Fatboy, also were let go Friday." That's glancing coverage, at best. The rate only a single paragraph in the article about pdx.fm in The Oregonian and the "Dude Keeps Abiding" text is a single mention (as hosts of a movie screening) in a calendar of local events. The problem is not with the sources but with the content in those sources. Personally, I wish there were enough articles in which the duo are the focus to make keeping them possible, but there's not. - Dravecky (talk) 18:16, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

• 'Keep Both i hope I'm doing this right. Sorry, if I'm botching the format. The comment above, really, says it all. The CW, KGW, The Oregonian, Willamette Week, AOL....There's nine citations in the article, all from credible sources. This is ridiculous. The AOL article only should cut through any questions of notability.While you're all attacking Webber and Roberts, dozens of incredibly bad Wiki-articles are probably getting on here. -- —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.21.199.70 (talk) 17:19, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

• Delete, nothing here that wasn't in the deleted Cort and Fatboy article. This is an attempt to sneak in the same material under different names. NawlinWiki (talk) 18:05, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes, there are more than a few articles that are listed in both pages that weren't on the initial Cort and Fatboy page. Again, this seems to be speaking to the idea that the people pushing for deletion are both unfamiliar with the subject they're trying to erase, and not actually reading the articles they're claiming to clean up. Nobody pushing for deletion has yet to explain why they consider AOL.com, The Oregonian, The Portland Mercury, The Portland affiliates of The CW and NBC, Hats.com and The Willamette Week to be unreliable sources beyond flatly stating "they're unreliable sources." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.92.163.253 (talk) 18:16, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
    • See my reply above. Many of the listed sources are notable and reliable but the coverage of the duo is glancing at best. Unconfirmable appearances as guests on a local TV show do not contribute to notability. - Dravecky (talk) 18:20, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
      • coverage of the duo is confirmable re: both the KGW and CW appearance, the CW appearance readily found on Youtube. The KGW appearance isn't readily viewable, but the KGW site does confirm they were featured guests. Besides which, this isn't a duo issue: the individual pages of both Webber and Roberts contain new articles that feature coverage that in no way could be considered "glancing," and would be apparent had you looked at them. It's hard to consider how the Mercury and AOL's coverage of Roberts' "Geek: Remixed" project, or the Hats.com interview with Roberts could be considered "glancing." This is becoming slightly ridiculous, and more than a little labored/tortured on behalf of those pushing the notability argument, especially considering there are people with valid, uncontested wikipedia pages using both Webber and Roberts as evidence of their own notability. If wikipedia is willing to use both of these people as a valid media cite to the notability of others, how is it they themselves, either as individuals or as a group, are not notable? That question is secondary, of course, to the accusations that 3000 word interviews by AOL are in and of themselves "glancing" mentions and not worthy of inclusion.