Talk:Hate crime

Iran

I have a concern with this section. The individual country sections are detailing hate crime laws/legislation in those countries, where the entry for Iran talks about actions of the state against homosexuals. This material seems much more suited to Human rights in Iran. Kevin (talk) 21:18, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

If there are no objections I will move/merge the material as above. Kevin (talk) 22:39, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Obviously I object. It's relevant because of Iran's presence in the media regarding their hate crimes against gays. Their own President saying "There aren't any homosexuals in Iran" was all over the news, world wide. The section on Iran's torture and killing of gay Iranians speaks to how it deals with hate crimes. - ✰ALLST☆R✰ ^echo 23:18, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Is there a source describing their actions as a hate crime, rather than a human rights abuse? My view of hate crime is more related to individuals and/or groups actions toward others, rather than a governments actions toward it's citizens. Kevin (talk) 23:27, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Anyone else? Kevin (talk) 03:23, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

It sounds like it would be relevant to both topics to me. LadyofShalott 05:51, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Has it already been moved or is it the last paragraph with many refs on it? -- Banjeboi 15:18, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

It's the last paragraph with many refs on it. - ℅ ✰ALLST☆R✰ ^echo 17:12, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

I have a concern with the entire section. It is supposed to be a section that describes the laws in the nation dealing specifically with hate crimes. None of the sentences do that, neither the ones referencing the constitution nor the ones that describe Iran's human rights record.

Look at all the other nation's entries. Each describes the state of hate crime enhancement laws, or the lack thereof, in the country. Iran just looks like someone added the consitution entries to make Iran look good in this light, and then others added the human rights record to debate that. Really, all of this material should be removed and replaced with specific information on hate crime punishment in Iran, of whatever form they might have.--joeOnSunset (talk) 04:58, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Okay, I pared down the whole section. Most of the consitution references don't deal with hate crimes. I kept the one that came the closest, so as not to have to blank the entire section. I have been unable to source any material that deals directly with the topic of hate crimes protections in Iran. --joeOnSunset (talk) 03:15, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Change to lede: perceived membership

I have changed the following sentence in the lead:

Hate crimes (also known as bias-motivated crimes) occur when a perpetrator targets a victim because of his or her membership in a certain social group,

to

Hate crimes (also known as bias-motivated crimes) occur when a perpetrator targets a victim because of his or her perceived membership in a certain social group,

Hate crimes are generally defined according to motive. A gay-bashing does not become less a crime directed against gay people, for instance, just because the victim is a heterosexual mistaken for a homosexual. --TS 00:29, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Israel

Why isn't Israel on the list? http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1104506.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcovitaly (talk • contribs) 03:56, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

Canada in Eurasia

Got to be merged with Canada in its right place. 217.195.19.145 (talk) 13:25, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

• Merged Canada into North America section. Per WP:CYCLE, I've made a few adjustments to the use of double and single quotes and attached references to each quote. I felt the two sentences regarding Section 319 were redundant and have merged them together as well. Feel free to re-word. Ruodyssey (talk) 01:29, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Homeless

I removed the section about hate crimes against homeless persons (added here) for several reasons, none challenging its validity. All of its links are now dead, so it lacks a Reliable Source. This subsection was copied and pasted into both this article and Hate crime laws in the United States, where it would be more appropriate anyway. Hate crime#US is meant to be a Summary, so this just adds Undue Weight. More to the point, the section was added by the indefinitely banned sockpuppet Drutton57 and can be removed for this reason alone. - Ruodyssey (talk) 09:07, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

White-On-White Hate Crimes

A court in the United States has found that a white-on-white (or any same-race) crime can still be prosecuted as a racially motivated incident if the attacker was motivated by the victim's being in an interracial relationship. I'm not quite sure how to work this in, though (should it get its own section in this article, or should there be a separate article for same-race racially motivated violence?) Any advice would be welcome.[1] [2] Stonemason89 (talk) 17:24, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

The second ref may not be an RS, so it's a shame the first is so short. I'd recommend adding this tidbit into a subsection of Hate crime laws in the United States instead of here once we have some more informative refs -- maybe as this case plays out. Ruodyssey (talk) 04:27, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

There has been an increase of what would be called "hate crime" incidents over other social group status: Italians, Polish people, Mormons, French speaking Canadians, Southerners and Irish people. For example, to make an ethnic joke or claim "these people are so and so" can qualify as "hate speech" therefore an act of racial, sociocultural or ethnic group hatred. I'm not joking around here, this is serious since a person comes up to you and make fun of your group/background like they are "mafioso, polacks, polygamous or wackos, too stupid to speak English, rednecks or drunks/pagans". + 71.102.7.77 (talk) 00:19, 12 March 2010 (UTC)

Is "hate speech" a "hate crime"? No.

Hate crime

Hate speech

A "hate crime" is a criminal matter. A "hate crime" has two elements: (1) a subsumed crime, e.g., assault, and (2) the perpetrator's hatred of the victim. The perpetrator hates the victim because the victim belongs (or is believed to belong) to some hated group. The perpetrator's hatred may be manifested by "hateful speech," by his graffiti, by his tattoos, or by other means. A "hate crime" has a higher penalty than the subsumed crime.

"Hate speech," in matters of law, is not the same as "hateful speech." Hate speech is an offense which may be a criminal matter or a civil wrong or both. Where hate speech is an offense, it is an offense by itself; hate speech does not need any other criminal behavior to accompany it. Hate speech is any speech, gesture or conduct, writing, or display which is offensive to some group that the law protects. Hateful speech does not amount to hate speech unless a protected group takes offense.

PYRRHON  talk   23:00, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Canada

I removed the opinion which introduced the section on Canada because "An encyclopedia is a collection of facts" not opinions (See WP:Writing better articles.), and because the opinion deals with hate speech although this article is about hate crime. I removed the information about hate propaganda because that information is a matter of hate speech not hate crime. (Matters of hate speech are at Hate speech laws in Canada.) I quoted the hate crime provision of Canada's Criminal Code to show how hate crime provisions are worded. I deleted the mention of Canada's civil laws against discrimination because those laws are not a matter of hate crime. PYRRHON  talk   16:18, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Hate crime debate

I just visited this page for the first time, and noticed up front two comments about "Multiple issues." They were "Tagged since June, 2010." As I write this, the date is May 19, 2010. How can anything be tagged "since" a date in the future? George Hannauer georgehannauer@oberlin.net 208.66.211.248 (talk) 23:45, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

Proposed Merge

The article Hate crimes against white people contains some useful information. However, we don't have articles about Hate crimes against black people, or Hate crimes against Asians, and I don't think that hate crimes against whites deserve their own article either; it just isn't done on Wikipedia. Rather, the contents of that article should be merged, where appropriate, into the established articles Hate crime (general), Hate crimes in the United States (the section on the US) and South African farm attacks (the section on South Africa). Any thoughts? Stonemason89 (talk) 03:55, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

That's right. I agree. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 06:39, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

Following the discussion, I have merged contents to Hate crime laws in the United States and South African farm attacks, but I did not find any material to merge here. Thanks. --FormerIP (talk) 12:49, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

Critiquing reliance on the prison industrial complex

This subsection of Opposition is completely unsourced (by reliable sources) and puts undue weight on that particular argument. --70.128.125.237 (talk) 08:56, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Undisclosed COI

While James Cantor was contesting[3][4] my removal of an EL that he had added to his coworker, I looked into some of the many other ELs that he has added, and found that many of them were to his own blog, those of coworkers and, or colleagues. The EL to Gregory M. Herek's blog, which James Cantor added to two pages[5][6] seemed not to be conflicted until I noticed that both Herek and Cantor were editors of the same magazine[7]. Thoughts? BitterGrey (talk) 21:41, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

Doing the Math

Hi everyone,

I found the following article from Southern Poverty Law Center to be interesting:

• <ref>"Anti-Gay Hate Crimes: Doing the Math". Intelligence Report. Southern Poverty Law Center. 2010. Retrieved 2010-11-28.</ref>

It gives total victimization of target groups in the U.S. population for 1995-2008.

Here are its results in table format:

targeted group	percentage of U.S. population (A)	hate crimes against persons (B)	percentage of hate crimes against persons (C: B/(sum B))	ratio (C/A)
homosexuals	2.1%	15,351	17.4%	8.3
Jews	2.2%	not given	7.7%	3.5
blacks	12.9%	not given	41%	3.2
Muslims	0.8%	not given	1.5%	1.9
Latinos	15.8%	not given	8.8%	0.6
whites	65.1%	not given	13.3%	0.2
total		88,463

--Kevinkor2 (talk) 15:03, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Color of Crime

The New Century Foundation's pamphlet The Color of Crime, does not deserve a section in this article - it has no relevance to the subject, represent a fringe POV and even mentioning it here is probably undue weight. ·Maunus·ƛ· 15:09, 28 April 2011 (UTC)

So it's okay to commit crimes for fun?

But it's not okay if you have a reason? 71.212.210.137 (talk) 19:28, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

says who? Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 19:30, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

Examples section

I would question whether a well-written, well-referenced section on examples of incidents described as hate crimes would add anything to the article. The 'Examples' section being added to the article is far from that- I'm not about to go out and buy a book, just to find what page either of the dubious examples is discussed on, if they are discussed at all. The silliness about banning intimidation by the homeless as a hate crime is unacceptable without a direct quote. And the section on 'Kick a ginger day' says nothing about any of these incidents being described as hate crimes. Most coloured people I've spoken to about this episode had a sense of humor about it. Nevard (talk) 04:23, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

Moreover, despite the fact that the RCMP reportedly investigated the kid who started the group to determine whether he had actually committed a hate crime, he was never charged. Nevard (talk) 04:34, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

Context on a quote in the "Canada" section

Would someone please check over the concern voiced over on Yahoo! Answers? The sentence is a quote, so it's probably relevant to include, but it seems POV when out-of-context—which it currently is in the article. I don't have immediate access to the source (not on Google Books :P ) and am somewhat too busy to look for a physical copy—would someone please either improve on the context for that sentence, or remove it? I've already tagged the sentence in question with a hidden note and a {{context-inline}}. Thanks, {{Nihiltres|talk|edits|⚡}} 14:05, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

RfC

BAn RfC: Which descriptor, if any, can be added in front of Southern Poverty Law Center when referenced in other articles? has been posted at the Southern Poverty Law Center talk page. Your participation is welcomed. – MrX 16:46, 22 September 2012 (UTC)

Strangely worded sentence.

"The term "hate crime" is now used more often than in the past mainly because the groups that used to have official endorsement under with intergovernmental and/or armed forces involvement." There's clearly a problem here, but I cant figure out what exactly to change to fix it. 74.132.249.206 (talk) 12:53, 4 October 2012 (UTC)