Talk:Human

Bad example

Given the bodymods, the current 'adult man' image (pataxo001.jpg) doesn't seem like the best choice to me. 92.15.59.131 (talk) 22:53, 23 November 2012 (UTC)

Why not? Body modification is natural and common human behavior, just like kempt beards, dreadlocks, baseball caps, eyeglasses and earrings.·ʍaunus·snunɐw· 22:56, 23 November 2012 (UTC)

I'm inclined to agree. Since the purpose of the section is to show the human lifecycle, it might be more appropriate to make this selection of images less diverese (in terms of race and dress) to better focus on the differences associated with aging. 94.6.15.243 (talk) 20:54, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Ideally, to show aging, we'd have images taken over many decades of the same person (or persons). Unfortunately, that's a tall order. (Although if we start now . . .) As long as we can't do that, I don't see that the diversity really renders the concept less clear. Rivertorch (talk) 05:48, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

I agree only on the grounds that his face is significantly less clear than the faces of the children, woman, or elderly people, as in you cannot tell his age group as easily as the others by looking at just his face. TreboniusArtorius (talk) 19:58, 11 December 2012 (UTC)

Feel free to improve upon it if you can, but it's the best we have at the moment. Chrisrus (talk) 00:13, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

Further to Chrisrus's comment, it is actually more difficult than it seems to find an image of a "typical" human male. Most images available are of people who are famous for some reason (sports people, politicians etc) which isn't ideal. Unnachamois (talk) 09:25, 3 April 2013 (UTC)

I agree, the example should be of a less modified adult male. Alistoriv (talk) 21:19, 29 April 2013 (UTC)Alistoriv

Grammar Issue

Correct me if I'm wrong, but under Culture-Language where it says 'Humans are the only animal species who is able to ask questions' shouldn't it be 'Humans are the only animal species who are able to ask questions' as neither 'Humans' nor 'Species' is in its singular form therefore the verb 'to be' shouldn't take a singular form of 'is' and instead 'are'. Alternatively the sentence could read 'Humans are the only animal species able to ask questions' — Preceding unsigned comment added by Googolplexity (talk • contribs) 16:45, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Better still, "Humans are the only species able to ask questions". I've changed it to that. If anyone knows of plants or fungi or whatever that justify inclusion of the word "animal", feel free to correct me! Rivertorch (talk) 20:22, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Population density

I think that a map of the human population density could be put along with (or in the place of) the map of human range. It seems to be more informative. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.136.207.220 (talk) 16:14, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

Living or extant?

Regarding this well-intentioned change, while the meaning remains reasonably clear, the words are not quite synonymous (and in fact do not appear in each other's entry in either of my thesauri). Extant, meaning "surviving" or "still in existence" (my emphasis, obviously), carries the implication that other, comparable species have become extinct. It is a word that's frequently used in reference to species, and I don't think it's esoteric in the least. (I'm pretty sure I first encountered it in primary school.) While it's often a good idea to avoid a ten-dollar word when a ten-cent word will do, the downside of simplifying any article's vocabulary too much is that it eliminates opportunities for learning. Carry that to its logical conclusion and we're left not only with dumbed-down articles but dumbed-down readers. If this were the Simple English Wikipedia, I wouldn't object. Since it's not, how about restoring extant along with a nice interwiki link to the precise word in Wiktionary? Rivertorch (talk) 23:12, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

(Noting that another editor has reverted to extant) How about the Wiktionary link? Does anyone else think that might be helpful? Rivertorch (talk) 23:34, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

I am sure the change was made in good faith but, as you say, there is a subtle difference in meaning between 'living' and 'extant' which you have explained above. As another example of the difference in meaning we can have extant types of rock for example although these are not living. Another way to describe the word is as the opposite of 'extinct', which is not quite the same as 'dead'. I would have no objection to the wictionary link. Martin Hogbin (talk) 15:46, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

 Done. Rivertorch (talk) 22:22, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

humans are primates?

I disagree with the first sentence. For over 500,000 years we have struggled to answer this question. Saying that we are primates negates all of that. It's a scientific opinion, true, but very materialistic. We operate primate bodies, but saying we are primates is like saying that since we drive vehicles, we are the vehicles. Forgot to sign it: 71.22.155.114 (talk) 12:40, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

This is not a forum, we go by sources. Oh and we are primates, whether you like it or not. Dbrodbeck (talk) 15:52, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

Do you have a proposed rewording? Wikipedia articles should clearly state the obvious and give appropriate weight to all published viewpoints - it shouldn't play down or gloss over basic, useful facts simply because a small minority of readers might find the information to be "true, but materialistic". --McGeddon (talk) 16:00, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

I'm not sure what you mean by "a small minority of readers...." Do you mean the 84% who believe in spiritual matters, or the 16% who don't? Our bodies are primate, but the non-neutral POV that has decided we are nothing but animals is... non-neutral. 71.22.155.114 (talk) 14:02, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Its nonsense to consider the 84% of religious people as a single group they do not all share any single belief about what humans are or arent. For the vast majority of religious people there is no contradiction between the existence of spirituality and the fact that humans are primates. Also wikipedia is not supposed to reflect what many people believe, but what they know.·ʍaunus·snunɐw· 14:06, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

To put it bluntly to IP, Wikipedia deals in scientifically-established facts and reliable sources whether you like it or not, regardless of the personal beliefs of anyone of any culture or religion. There are actually some people who believe humans are beings from another planet, but we don't include that opinion here, we include facts that are well-established in empirical science, which has classified humans as primates. Cadiomals (talk) 16:04, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Right. In other words, it is the consensus among the primates who edit Wikipedia that verifiable facts and not unverifiable opinions form the foundation of their encyclopedia. Many articles, including this one, acknowledge the existence of spiritual beliefs, but they don't present them as alternative sources of verifiable fact. The IP might pause and consider that the 84% he or she mentions (which is in itself unverifiable without a bevy of qualifiers) is far from monolithic, frequently argues within its ranks over even the most basic of spiritual "truths", and includes lots of primates who take science and verifiable fact very seriously. Rivertorch (talk) 18:43, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

I apologize for starting a p*ssing contest. 71.22.155.114 (talk) 13:43, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

psychology

This section assumes that humans are animals with cool attributes. Not sure that's true, but it is "accepted" by people who write articles. lol. Why are the educated and over-educated as well as nerd's ideas so important? How come this article ignores the fact that 86% of the human race believes there are spiritual aspects to life? It's worse than merely ignoring. It tries to bury the idea, that we are spiritual beings animating bodies. Sorry, that won't go away. Can we at least mention that some scientists believe there is a spiritual aspect to being human? Maybe a mention of Faculty Psychology, which although has "fallen out of favor" has never been disproved or "non-straw man" challenged. Human beings have mental and spiritual faculties or abilities, such as reason, will, free will, self-talk, emotion, love, senses of morality and aesthetics, etc., that just can't be explained by "Humans are animals that can be conditioned." 71.22.155.114 (talk) 13:59, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

The spiritual aspect of being human is already covered in the article's "Religion and spirituality" section, with links to in-depth articles on these subjects. --McGeddon (talk) 16:04, 7 May 2013 (UTC)