Talk:Daimyo

"Though the term "daimyo" literally means "great name,"......"

This part is kinda off, weird and confusing......

Though the term "daimyo" literally means "great name," the Japanese word actually comes from the kanji (characters) dai, meaning "large," and myō (shortened from myōden) meaning "name-land" or "private land.[citation needed]"

I know the kanji dai can translate to "great" or "big", but the myo part.....I think that part is off....名 by itself translates to name....where is this moden coming from?? Not to mention it kinda contridicts itself.....its it literally translates to "great name", then what with the further (incorrect) infomation??

I'm changing it. 75.72.221.172 (talk) 12:59, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

No, the contribution was correct: 大名 daimyō does in fact derive from 大名田 daimyōden, literally "great named land", referring to an owner of a large estate (as opposed to a 小名田 shōmyōden, later simply 小名田 shōmyō). 195.14.216.9 (talk) 00:53, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

sui lord?

Definition needed: "a generic term referring to the powerful territorial sui lords in premodern Japan". And what were they? The closest possibilities I see on the disambiguation page are still pretty far-fetched:

• Sui Dynasty of China
• Sui (surname), a transcription of two Chinese surnames
• Sui County, Henan, county in Shangqiu, Henan, China
• Sui County, Hubei, county in Suizhou, Hubei, China
• Sui (粋), an ideal in Japanese aesthetics similar to iki

Thnidu (talk) 22:12, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Corrected. It must be a residue of past edits.－－ Phoenix7777 (talk) 22:49, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Unital?

Hi, "daimyo" is in the current edition of Merriam Webster, the 11th edition. So it's considered part of Amerian English and doesn't need to be italicized. You can also see it here on its online edition. Let's update this.--A21sauce (talk) 04:02, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

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Requested move 7 February 2020

Daimyō → Daimyo – In 2008, User @Fg2 correctly noted that "Daimyo" (without the macron) is an accepted English term and moved this article from Daimyō to Daimyo. In 2016, with no explanation, user @Gryffindor moved it back. "Daimyo" (no macron, no italics) is the correct title for this article, just as Tokyo does not take macrons. See: the manual of style for Japanese terms, which specifically says that accepted English terms should be spelled as in English, even if this differs from Japanese: [1] For dictionary references, see: [2], [3], etc. In addition, only transliterated terms should be italicized. "Daimyo" is not transliterated; it is an accepted English term. Bueller 007 (talk) 21:17, 7 February 2020 (UTC)

Oppose: Claims that this or that is an "English word" need very clear evidence. Of course Daimyo, written with or without a macron, will appear in lots of writing in English, but this does not make it an "English word", any more than "tagliatelle", "Tokyo", or "tovarich" are actually "English words". Writing with the macron is no obstacle to ignorant readers, who can ignore it, so you simply want to reduce the amount of information Wikipedia provides, which I think is a bad idea. Imaginatorium (talk) 03:34, 8 February 2020 (UTC)

It's really quite a feat to not be able to make it through such a short paragraph as the one I wrote. The Japanese manual of style, which I linked above, specifically says that English words of Japanese origin (like "daimyo") should be spelled as accepted in English. And then I provided English dictionary references that show it without the macron."Follow the usage of academic texts or a widely used reference such as a published encyclopedia in matters of spelling, macron usage, and name order." (Emphasis mine.) It also Here's Britannica: [4] Again, no macron. But your argument completely flies in the face of the manual of style and all English dictionaries and encyclopedias, so that's cool. P.S., "tagliatelle" is an English word of Italian origin, just as "daimyo" is an English word of Japanese origin. Your example, like your argument, is nonsense. Bueller 007 (talk) 02:48, 9 February 2020 (UTC)

Oppose - just make the version without the macron a redirect. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.184.193.250 (talk) 15:33, 9 February 2020 (UTC)

Support - The relevant policy here is WP: COMMONNAME. Bueller 007 is completely right. All other encyclopedias and dictionaries drop the macron, and there's no reason to make Wikipedia the big exception to the rule. I agree also that daimyo should not be italicized, since it's a word used very often in English language articles and books without italicization. Patiodweller (talk) 13:39, 10 February 2020 (UTC)