Talk:Andes/Archive 1

Archive 1

Old talk

I recently came across the suggestion that Mt Chimborazo at 6272 metres in Ecuador should be reclassified as the highest mountain in the world Mt Everest is 8848m. However the summit of Mt Chimborazo is apparantly 2150m further away from the centre of the earth than the summit of Everest. This apparantly anomaly being due tothe earth having an oblately spheroidal shape. Any comments on this? how old is it? Do you no?????

See the Measurement section under Mount Everest. The definition of "highest", at least in mountaineering terms, has always been in line with the accepted norm that Everest is the highest mountain. 6272m while a considerable altitude, cannot be seriously compared to additional difficulties of climbing the 8,000m peaks of the Himalayas. RedWolf 20:04, Feb 7, 2004 (UTC)

The Earth has the shape of an oblate spheroid due to the equatorial bulge. Heights are normally taken from the mean sea level at the location in question. Since the sea also bulges at the equator... I'd say not. – RJH 23:44, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

Etymology

Is there any definitive answer as to the origin of the word Andes? I've come across information stating that it is from an indigenous word whose origin has now been lost and also a competing argument that it comes from the spanish word andinas or andines (Of this, all I have found is andinas means "related to the Andes (plural)" and andines is the French cognate of the same). The argument for this etymology is that the conquistadors, upon seeing the Incan terraces built up the mountainsides, named them after such. However, there is no such word in Spanish. Thoughts? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.106.6.82 (talk • contribs) 15:46, 30 November 2005.

Etymonline says that the word is from the Quechua language word andi meaning "high crest". --Mr. Billion 06:59, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

From what I understand the Spanish word "Andén" means platform (or sidewalk). Don't know the origin of that word, however.

I don't think that the word 'Andes' could have come from 'andén', because the plural for this word would be 'andenes', a word very different from Andes. According to Spanish chroniclers, the word for the mountains came from the Quechua language, and the word wasn't even 'Andes', but it was 'Antis', and every chronicler used the same word (They never used 'Andes' until many years later after the conquest). The Spanish didn't use that word for the mountains at the beginning (Check for Inca Garcilaso de la Vega and other chroniclers). Before the Spanish arrived, in Cusco and other Quechua speakers used the word 'Anti' to refer to people who lived in the highland and lowland forests and jungles to the east of the mountains (They used the words 'Anti Runa' - 'People from Anti' or simply "Antikuna", kuna for plural). The word 'Antisuyu' doesn't exist for nothing. I think people from the coast called people from the highlands 'Anti' as well (They were to the east of them), and in my Quechua dictionary it says that Anti means 'east'. Then the Spanish started using the word Antis as a plural of Anti (Again, check for Garcilaso and other chroniclers.) The word only derived to Andes a long time after that, to refer to all the mountains and some highland forests in these mountains.

This isn't my Quechua dictionary, but it's a reference Quechua Dictionary

It's in Spanish. In Anti it says: Anti: Andes\ Anti: East. Andean eastern land\ Anti runa: Eastern man.

TaikunNozomu 07:53, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Boldness

I have had this article on my watchlist for ages, intending at some point to try to rewrite it. But I've decided it would be far, far more work to try and get that 1911 prose into something useful than it would be to simply start again. The notice at the top stating that the article's geology is 100 years past its use by date was just embarassing! We can do much much better than that. Worldtraveller 16:06, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

Good move. I've been thinking about doing something with the archaic mess, but just never got around to it. Now have room for a good article - someday :-) Vsmith 16:25, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

Excellent! Never liked that 1911 guff - MPF 18:19, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

Range description

"To the north this coastal chain continues in small ridges or isolated hills along the Pacific Ocean as far as Venezuela, always leaving the same valley more or less visible to the west of the western great chain." This comment is rather strange, it should be checked. In any case, the portion of the range that goes into Venezuela it's an extention of the Oriental Range, and it is not a continuation of Chile's coastal range. I am also unsure that the whole range can simply be split into two main parallel running sub ranges.

Dycotiles 17:01, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Lincancaur

A mountain called Lincancaur has been listed in the Argentina section. Its height is claimed to be 6620 m, in the province of Salta, on some websites. But I cannot find it on any up to date lists, nor can I find anything over 6,600 m in Salta except Llullailaco. Has it been confused with Licancabur (5,916 m), which is on or near the Chile/Bolivia border but near to the Argentine province of Salta, and grossly inflated? Viewfinder 16:06, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Probably. Googling "Lincancaur" gives 39 hits, and they look like they were copied from a single (erroneous) source. "Licancabur" gets 73500 results, and it's a volcano on the Bolivia/Chile border. Danyg 04:40, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Could be, but the official site gobierno electronico lists it as good. Don't know how can be check it. Mariano(t/c) 18:22, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

I have checked the above link and despite being official, it does not appear to have been been updated from any recently researched source. It has 6,800 m for Tupungato which has been discredited for some time, and the Bonete and Galán elevations are also seriously at odds with modern and reliable SRTM data. SRTM data also shows nothing in Salta over 6,500m except Llullaillaco. See Talk: List of mountains in Argentina for an ongoing discussion. Viewfinder 19:05, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

puma

I want puma information

Perhaps you would like to do some research and add some puma information yourself. Viewfinder 01:37, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

External links

There is no need for the external links that I have been deleting. The information is contained in the site in English that is already linked. (If this were Spanish wikipedia, then it would be different). Moreover, the site that I deleted supports 6882m for Monte Pissis, citing John Biggar. But the Biggar publication cited has been revised, the most recent (3rd) edition supports 6795m; in early 2005 he ascended Monte Pissis and measured it himself usong GPS. The measurement, which confirmed SRTM data, has been further confirmed by two more GPS measurements. Viewfinder 01:35, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

24.232.146.36, if you must continue to push an external link, you could at least:

• Tell the author of the link (are you the author??) to use the most recent English edition (3rd edition, 2005) of "A Guide for Climbers", which states very clearly that Ojos del Salado and Monte Pissis are 6893m and 6795m respectively, or stop citing this publication.
• Defend the addition of this link on this page.

Viewfinder 03:48, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Professional Deleter: My basic weblink is anyhow easyer to find on the searchmchine. I measured both, Ojos & Pissis. What counts is reality, not fantasy!

The above unsigned comment was added by 24.232.146.36. First, please see WP:EL about adding external links to your own sites. Second, how, and when, did you measure Ojos and Pissis? You do not appear to say this on your site, which quotes John Biggar, who measured both summits by accurate GPS in 2005 and got 6900m and 6795m. This confirmed the accuracy of SRTM data. Several other measurements have since confirmed these measurements. Viewfinder 09:26, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

I will stop contesting the Andesargentinos link, if the elevations it quotes are updated in accordance with the latest edition (2005) of the source it quotes ("John Biggar - A Guide for climbers"). Viewfinder 06:44, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

or, if the site author must continue to support 6882m for Monte Pissis, then change the peak heights source credit to some other authority, which still supports that elevation. Viewfinder 07:14, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The Andes Mountain - new name

Hello - In my opinion prefixing an article title with "the" is both non-encyclopedic and confusing; few people are likely to type "the" in the search box. At a minimum it should be "Andes Mountains", as we are referring to a huge chain of mountains, not one single mountain. Cheers Geologyguy 19:28, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Oppose move. After some discussion, the name "Himalayas" appeares to have stuck. Plain "Andes" has always been OK with me. It is also used on Spanish Wikipedia. "The Andes Mountain" sounds like a single mountain. Also the name change was carried out unilaterally, without discussion on this page. Therefore I will revert it. Viewfinder 19:36, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Illyrian etymology

Removed Illyrian and Balkan stuff from etymology. Seems based on a book by John Wilkes, The Illyrians - haven't seen the book, but it doesn't seem the place for such speculations or whatever. Take the subject up on the Quechua and/or Aymara language talk pages. I see no reference to it there. Vsmith 11:43, 5 February 2007 (UTC) BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA —Preceding unsigned comment added by Maria87459576846 (talk • contribs) 09:42, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Agriculture

Question regarding the Agriculture section: the section, speaking of Inka agriculture, states that, "Maize and barley were important crops for these people." Well, no, barley wasn't an important Inka crop, seeing as how it was a Eurasian crop and didn't get introduced until the 16th century. I was going to edit this, but I didn't know what the author meant. Did you mean that barley became an important crop post-Conquest? I don't know that this is true, but considering that it's a crop that can tolerate the cold and altitude it wouldn't surprise me. Or did you mean to say "maize and quinoa," which was an important Inka crop? If anyone knows the answer to these questions, I would appreciate it. Thanks. --Raulpascal 21:09, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Neither maize was important from a nutritional point of view. Maize was complement to other staple food and was at least for the inca culture ritual importance. Dentren | ^Talk 18:26, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Asia?

I thought it was in S. America, not outide Asia... --BananasOnFire (talk) 19:33, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

List of mountains

How exhaustive would the list be? What are the criterions for including a mountain? Jespinos 18:54, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

Age and Geology

This would improve the article immensely. --Rajah 00:09, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

There's a section headed Geology that includes a discussion of the tectonic origin as well as the timing of formation (geologic age) - did you mean something more than that? That seems to me more or less enough when discussing the entire chain - in detail, the geology is quite complex and probably beyond the scope of this summary article. Cheers Geologyguy 00:28, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Ah, my bad. THat is a good section. I missed some of that when I skimmed it. Yeah, the Cenozoic narrows it down. --Rajah 00:44, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Missing article

Shouldn't we have an article on the Andean cultural area, comparable in scope to the Mesoamerica article? See Image:Área Cultural Andina.png and Category:Andean civilizations. Thanks.--Pharos 17:42, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Opening sentence structure

The Andes is the world's longest exposed mountain range, the longest being the underwater Ocean Ridge.[1]

• Different sections of the article treat "The Andes" as singular and plural. While it may be singular, it sounds plural to my English ears, and seeing "The Andes is..." as the opening sentence seems awkward. I don't see the topic mentioned. Is it simultaneously singular and plural? In either case, I would suggest: "The Andes mountains are..." or "The Andes range is...". The second and third paragraphs seem to scan better this way.

• The sentence suggests that there are two longest ranges. Personally I don't find the comment about the underwater Ocean Ridge to be particularly relevant and would just delete it. Otherwise it should at least be restructured: ("...the underwater Ocean Ridge being longer.", or "...only suboceanic ranges are longer.")

• Any particular reason that one use of the word "ranges" is italicized in the second paragraph?

-- 68.126.200.1 (talk) 06:52, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

For the first issue see the article on the The Alps. For the second; it is necessary to make clear what king of records the Andes has, so that the information does not became challanged. Dentren | ^Talk 18:32, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Cities

There is no reason for cities in the sidebar, it is pointless and should be erased, or at least change cities to something else. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.218.30.165 (talk) 04:15, 2 February 2010 (UTC)

Template

Is there a reason the large template-like box at the beginning of the page is so large and overbearing? Is there a way to squeeze it horizontally by staking some of the objects such as the list of countries (with flags) in a vertical position? Suggestions? Andrew Colvin • Talk 02:53, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

I agree. The structure of the template should be changed. No template should be wider than 250px, else it interfers with the text, and all templates should accept a template_width command which allows users to adjust it. Text is primary content, especially the intro. Nothing should be allowed to minimise its visibility and readability. Macdonald-ross (talk) 12:52, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Plane crash?

What about the plane crash with the Peruvian rugby team, where they had to resort to eat the dead? I can't find anything about it on the page. Hollywood even made a film about it, so it'll better be mentioned in the article. 212.85.94.101 (talk) 17:19, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

You are referring to Uruguayan Air Force Flight 571. I don't think that this kind of history, however dramatic it is, is that important for the andes article...Geochron (talk) 13:03, 20 June 2012 (UTC)

Map showing cultural influence in the Andes

Sorry but I don't see how the above map has anything to do with culture. In addition, its in spanish. So what do these regions mean? Anyone? I'm tempted to delete it. Geochron (talk) 12:57, 20 June 2012 (UTC)

Very bad article

I deleted the thing about barley, barley did not exist in pre-Columbian Andean culture. I also deleted the thing about coca. Who says coca is the "most important" crop there? And it certainly wasn't/isn't a "dietary supplement" - it provides no calories, it's used as a stimulant, much like coffee or tea, except coffee/tea is more what we would call food since it is a beverage and may provide calories if milk/cream is used; coca is simply chewed.

In general this article is strongly lacking. It's just small bursts of sentences on subjects that may not even fit in the category of this article.This is Truley a BAD Article

Andean

Since this article is a redirect from Andean it ought to mentions the political implications of being Andean. i.e.- the states that are inclusive of being referred to as Andean. Granted it mentions such states, but with the peaks and mountaineering, not politically. it is clearly politically motivated as a term as Wikipedia 2008 Andean diplomatic crisis shows. Lihaas (talk) 01:58, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Number one, you need to learn how to spell in English. Among other things, you left out the "A" in Andean right in the subject line.

Lots of things are "Andean" in English: Andean countries, Andean people, Andean geology, the Andean condor, the Andean region, and Andean animals, birds, cocaine, diplomacy, geography, glaciers, independence, life, natural resources, plants, settlement, snowstorms, transportation problems, Andean volcanoes, Andean weather, Andean wildlife, and so forth.

Please do not pick out one adjective in English and complain about it when you do not understand how it is used in general. Andean is a word that we use just like Alpine, Atlantic, Appalachian, European, Himalayan, Oriental, Pacific, Russian, Sierran, etc.
98.67.162.130 (talk) 00:31, 2 September 2012 (UTC)

Transportation

Someone need to find out and explain many of the following things about Andean transportation and fill them in. You can find out the basics just by looking at railroad maps and highway maps of the Andean region. In particular, there was nothing about railroad transportation in Andes before I put in a little bit. (My main interest at the time was in the southern Andes. You can look up more about the north.)
1. There is doubtless highway and railroad transportation between Colombia and Venezuela in the northern Andes.
2. You need to find out how far the railroads and highways from the west go from Ecuador and Peru into Brazil via the Andes.
3. I know that there are railroads that go from the lowlands of Peru into the mountains of Bolivia. It is public information - on the TV, newspapers, etc. - that those railroads go all the way above 14,000 feet above sea level to serve mines and the associated towns in Bolivia. There have also been reports which we have seen with our own eyes about highways that cross Bolivia from west to east, crossing treacherous mountain "trails" to the lowlands of southeastern Bolivia. At one time in the 1930s, or so, Bolivia and Paraguay were at war over those lowlands. Paraguayan and other POWs were forced into labor on the first highway across.
4. On the railroad maps, we can see railroads that run from northern Chile and southern Peru, across the Andes in southern Bolivia, and thence into Argentina to connect with its railroad network. There are probably highways there, too.
5. On the railroad maps, we can see the railroad that runs from the area of Santiago, then eastward high into the Andes, thence through a tunnel or a narrow pass into Argentina, then winding its way through the Andes in western Argentina, and thence to connect with the railroad network of Argentina.
5. There doesn't seem to be a railroad connection around the southern end of the Andes between Argentina and Chile, but the land is not so extreme, and there are doubtless highways between the two countries. Even if not there, the island of Tierra del Fuego is divided between the two, and it has highways across it from east to west.
98.67.162.130 (talk) 00:56, 2 September 2012 (UTC)