User talk:Liamdavies

G'day!

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License tagging for File:Melbourne trams route 1 map.png

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James Moore photo suggestion

Thanks Liam for the photo suggestions, there were a couple of other James Moores - a building material supplier and a bishop. so I might need to do a bit of research to see if these pics are of my railway engineer - at least one seems to be the right period at least. all the best. Garyvines (talk) 09:05, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

Trams in Melbourne

Hi Liam. As an interstate resident, I can confirm the truth of the comment about tourism. I'll get back to you about a suitable reference. Any book about trams in Australia published since the 1970s would probably suffice. I don't mind you putting back into the article the English language reference for the size of the network. I removed it only because it was for 2008, not 2011. I agree with your idea about merging the sections about proposals, etc. Before you do that, you might want to consider moving the stuff about the proposals to some of the pages about the individual routes rather than deleting it altogether. (As I understand them, most of the proposals are for extending existing routes rather than building completely new ones, so material about a proposal to extend line X could be moved to the article about line X rather than deleted.) Finally, I was in Mel last weekend, and took some photos of trams in the city centre, but I haven't uploaded any to commons yet. One thing I noticed is that the Ws are now rarely seen, so it may be appropriate to change the photo in the infobox, perhaps to a B2 class, which I think is probably now the best candidate for being described as a "typical Melbourne tram". Bahnfrend (talk) 01:15, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply. After looking through the pictures I'd taken, I decided on a different idea for the infobox image. I hope you like it. I'll upload some more pictures over the next week or so. Bahnfrend (talk) 16:30, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

Hi Liam. The article looks much improved to me. Keep up the good work! Bahnfrend (talk) 05:29, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Sorry

I am really sorry and will re-read the guidelines again. Sorry about all these images that have been renamed and I am willing to do a favour for you, whatever it is (not too big) and also fix the redirects to the images.

Really Really Sorry.

David. S 06:49, 9 November 2011 (UTC)

Oh! Wait! As you did say that you did not like simply redirects to images, on the 'Move Image' page, it does say that a Bot will fix this later although I will personally fix the 'double-redirects' by myself.

Sorry for ANY inconvenience caused and, if possible, please respond by sending an email by using the email icon on the top-right of my page because I'd rather emails than posts.

Thanks and Sorry again.

David. S 06:56, 9 November 2011 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Editor's Barnstar
	Nice editing. David. S 05:48, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

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DYK for E-class Melbourne tram

Graeme Bartlett (talk) 00:03, 12 July 2012 (UTC)

July WMAU Melbourne Meetup

Hi, At last month's June meetup we discussed the idea of setting up a Training Course at a University of the Third Age (U3A) to be held in 2013 and named Becoming a Wikipedia editor. In order to get this course up and running we are calling for volunteers to help develop the idea, and either tutor part of the course, or provide one on one help to students in the class. All local Wikipedians are welcome to discuss this at our 11am meetup to be held this Sunday on 22 July. Please add your name to the attending list at Wikipedia:Meetup/Melbourne 23. Food and beverages are provided. Cuddy Wifter (talk) 04:41, 13 July 2012 (UTC)

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New infobox

Hi Liam. I am currently developing a new Template:Infobox tram route, for use on articles such as Melbourne tram route 96. The infobox is based on Template:Infobox bus line, and would be used in all of the articles about Melbourne tram routes in place of the existing Melbourne-specific infobox, which I think is not very attractive or informative. You can have a look at the prototype on my sandbox page, and I would welcome any comments (the infobox would also have a yarra trams logo at the top when included in the actual articles). If you want to see how the infobox looks on a real page, I've already put it into the English language articles about the Brussels tram routes, eg Brussels tram route 3, but I don't propose to put a coloured strip across the top of the infoboxes in the articles about the Melbourne tram routes. Bahnfrend (talk) 15:21, 31 December 2012 (UTC)

• Thanks for your alterations and comments. I've now put the new infobox on the Melbourne tram route 109 article. It incorporates all of your suggestions, except that the background at the top has been reverted to white, because the yarra trams logo doesn't look right on a green background. I'm now going to leave that article as is for a little while, to see whether there's any reaction from any other editors before I add the infobox to any other articles. Bahnfrend (talk) 15:03, 2 January 2013 (UTC)
  • It's actually possible to display two logos in the infobox. I've modified Melb tram route 109 accordingly. To see what the two logos look like when displayed together, hit "edit" on that article, remove the comment marks from around the two parameters immediately above the "image" parameter in the infobox, and then press "show preview". That said, I think the infobox looks better with just the yarra trams logo; I've modified the "operator" parameter so that it now says "Yarra Trams for Public Transport Victoria". Bahnfrend (talk) 09:59, 3 January 2013 (UTC)
  • I've now added a zone parameter. Bahnfrend (talk) 01:23, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

January 2013

Hello, Liamdavies. You have new messages at I dream of horses's talk page.
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Transdev Melbourne

Hey there, we've now managed to expand Transdev Melbourne to the extent that it is eligible for WP:DYK and can (hopefully) be placed on the front page of wiki. I wish to nominate it in both our names, but would like to sort a few little things out first. Firstly, what should the hook be? We need something short and catchy that is supported by the text of the article. I would like to ask if it can be held over until 1 August and run with the hook "...today Transdev Melbourne start operating 30% of Melbourne's bus network?", or something along those lines. But ideas would be good.

Secondly, I'd like to come to some consensus about destination names, I would prefer to use the names stated in the PTV timetables as: they indicate the actual suburb first, not the shopping centres brand name; they are verifiable through the PTV website; and they are sometimes broader and therefore more accurate (Box Hill comes to mind, true the station is in the shopping centre, but it also serves the railway station, and broader suburb), I would prefer:

• Doncaster Shoppingtown over Westfield Doncaster
• Box Hill over Centro Box Hill
• Southland Shopping Centre over Westfield Southland

Either piped or redirects could be used, to still send users to an accurate, specific page, but the locality would come first rather than shopping centre brand name. This will aid users when they sort the columns. You can reply here, on my talk page, or on the Transdev Melbourne talk page, I'll keep an eye on all of them.

Also, sorry if I've been standing on your toes a little, but two users editing simultaneously can sometimes cause conflicts. Liamdavies (talk) 10:03, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

Agree between the two of us we have created an informative article. Guess the other thing that may happen is the article may need to be renamed, I just presumed Transdev Melbourne would be the name when I created it.

My thinking on shopping centre names is that Centro Box Hill is the centre's name, if you stood in the street opposite it, that's what you would see. Also clarifies where in Box Hill it starts. Eliminates potential confusion where there may be a shopping centre and a High Street shopping strip in close proximity. It is a brand name, but I don't think it contravenes Wiki's rules on advertising. But I do see your point, I am anti calling things by sponsor names, eg never refer to stadiums by their commercial name, Docklands Stadium is not Etihad Stadium in my book.

No damage done to toes, two editors will never agree entirely, but we were both headed in the same direction, took each other's opinions on board and ended up with a better finished product, many thanks for your efforts. Put it this way, I have had far more frustrating conflicts with other editors.Mo7838 (talk) 11:21, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

One last thing to ask is, how good are you at identifying bus types? I'm very familiar with trams, but buses not so much, and it would be nice to insert a fleet table into pages. Regards, Liamdavies (talk) 11:31, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

Reasonably good (I think!!).Mo7838 (talk) 11:35, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

It looks like were are wanting to move in the same direction (yay civility is good!), I agree with the anti brand name, but that's not my primary reason for wanting to change (although I must admit it is a little). My main concern is that if a user hits the sort alphabetically button on a column, Doncaster will show up under W, Box Hill under C etc etc. This is why I wish to pipe the link to the shopping centre, but use the suburb/PTV name. I'm also wondering if we should use a flatlist like in the infobox to separate large lists of suburbs, such as the orbitals. And... what is our definition of a 'hub', if we sort 'standards' out here (or on a talk page somewhere later) we can use the Transdev page (which I feel is already almost the best developed) as a template for the others.

My feeling is that the name can stay, and it should only be changed if Transdev use a trading as name (alla Yarra Trams and Metro Trains, it was in the contract for both the rail operators, who knows what the story is here).

Pages 23, 25 & 26 of the tender document list the buses in the fleet, could you please identify which ones we have in the comms cats MBL, NBC and SmartBus? Then maybe we can start to build a table, at least representing the fleet for a start. Also, do you mind if I go ahead and make the changes I've proposed to the routes table? Liamdavies (talk) 11:52, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

Good point re shopping centres. What defines a hub, bit like how long is a piece of string? It's hard to pinpoint, I look for where there are multiple services either terminating or passing through, but where do you draw the line? Certainly think it should be kept below 10 members. Will be able to identify the bus types.Mo7838 (talk) 12:25, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

Photos identified:

Melbourne Bus Link

1) Volgren bodied Scania L94UB in Queen Street, Melbourne

2) Volgren bodied Scania L94UB

3) Volgren bodied Scania L94UB in Market Street, Melbourne

National Bus Company (by row)

1) sold

2) sold

3) DesignLine bodied MAN 16.240

4) Custom Coaches bodied MAN 15.220 outside the Young and Jackson Hotel

5) DesignLine bodied MAN 16.220

6) Custom Coaches bodied MAN 15.220

7) DesignLine bodied MAN 16.240

8) DesignLine bodied MAN 16.240

9) Custom Coaches bodied MAN 12.220

10) sold

11) sold

SmartBus

1) DesignLine bodied MAN 16.240

3) DesignLine bodied MAN 16.240 in Mount Alexander Road

4) DesignLine bodied MAN 16.220Mo7838 (talk) 12:55, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

1) Volgren bodied Scania L94UB in St Kilda Road

2) Volgren bodied Scania L94UB in Flinders St West

3) Custom Coaches bodied Scania K230UB in Queen Street

CDC

Hi again,

Have you seen that CDC have bought Drivers bus routes? It might be worth creating a new article 'CDC Victoria', and merging at least the Melbourne operators into it (Eastrans/Westrans). Thoughts?

PS I'm having a little trouble figuring out exactly what buses Transdev will get vis a vis the tender document and bus Australia list, can you try to sort out the mess of a list I put on the talk page (I suspect that some of the separate models the Government lists might not actually exist), I can also take photos, living in the inner north. It would be good to get one of Drivers buses, but I'm a little far to be bothered. Are you anywhere near where they run?

Regards, Liamdavies (talk) 16:04, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

Re CDC Victoria, there is already a section on the ComfortDelGro Cabcharge for 'corporate' information. As the CDC Victoria operations have separate trading names, think it best they be retained as such. If anything the Hillsbus, Westbus and Hunter Valley operations need to be broken out into separate articles.

I think it a bit of a fruitless exercise trying to tie back the tender document to the Fleetlists, since the tender was issued buses will have come and gone, best to see what transpires in August. Only other change I thought of should of, should the background colour for the SmartBus services be changed to orange on grey?Mo7838 (talk) 20:34, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

Fair point, I was just thinking that one larger article that encapsulates the histories of CDC Victoria's subsidiaries and operations would be more comprehensive. I'm not to sure what to do with the SmartBus colouring, they used to have colours based on routes (which I would like to have used as backgrounds for the numbers), but the PTV website gives no difference now, so it might be best to hold tight, and wait and see. I suspect that many Transdev routes will become closer to SmartBus in terms of hours of operation and frequency, so it may become a non-issue. What do you think of the use of flatlist in the SmartBus via section? Should I reverse it, or roll it out to the other two orbitals? I'm quite partial to it, but want more input.

I've also thought about hubs, and would suggest that we include: Sunshine, Footscray, Melbourne CBD, Doncaster Shoppingtown, The Pines Shopping Centre, Box Hill, Southland Shopping Centre and possibly St Kilda and Ringwood. Thoughts? Liamdavies (talk) 11:16, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

Just because the PTV site doesn't colour differntiate, doesn't mean Wiki can't. Perhaps orange on silver for SmartBus to reflect the livery and yellow on black or black on orange for NightRider.

Don't think the flatlist is a goer, better with commas IMO.

Hubs seems ok, it is an imperfect science after all. Mo7838 (talk) 01:03, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

TransdevTSL

Reason I removed TransdevTSL wikilinks from KDR Melbourne was that the article was redirecting to Sydney bus operator Transdev Shorelink Buses. I have removed the redirection and commenced a new article, although does need expanding.Mo7838 (talk) 11:27, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

Transfield's half yearly update for 31/12/10 states the Brisbane Ferries business was also sold in December 2010, have amended article to reflect.Transfield 31/12/10 While Veolia & Transdev have merged they seem to trade under different names in different places. In Sydney they operate bus services under both names, yet tickets have the combined name on them. Just to further complicate Veolia & Transfield operate the Sydney Ferries business, albeit not under the TransdevTSL brand.Mo7838 (talk) 19:07, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

Melbourne Bus Link

Hi, why do you list Dysons as the sole owner of MBL, they do not own it 100%. Read articles from last year you'll see that, Dysons Directors still only own 50% of MBL and East West. I do not know where got that idea from, but it is very misleading Here's a quote from the link below "The Board of Directors of Reservoir Bus Group, together with the Board of Directors of the Dyson Group of Companies, are pleased to confirm the sale of Reservoir Bus Company and Midland Tours to the Dyson group of Companies." http://dysongroup.com.au/press-release and http://issuu.com/mediaflash/docs/ob_07nov12_bz "Rusell Ward Retires after 44 years with Reservoir Bus Comapny. He remains as Managing Director of Melbourne Bus Link, and continues his involvement with East West Bus Lines"

Rusell Ward, is one of the Directors, who is from RBC, He and all other Directors from RBC, kepted there shares in those 2 operators. No where has Dysons said they own 100% of East West or MBL. But if you want more proof, join BusAustralia forum, and one user there, who is a Dysons family member, even conformed the fact they don't know 100% of these 2 operators.

Like the user points out here http://www.busaustralia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=819651#p819651 "MBL & East West are completely seperate businesses. Operationally Dysons will take over the running of East West but stays as a seperate business."

Is that enough proof now, for you to stop editing and saying Dysons own 100% of these operators (talk)

Transdev Melbourne Fleet

Seem be a lot of discussion here about what buses Transdev will have when start running the MBBF. It's rather simple, All MBL and National buses will go to Transdev, as well as most of the Ventura Smartbuses, expect for 6-8 which are kepted for Route 900. If you need anymore help with this, let me know. (talk)

Transdev Melbourne/Dysons Group

Ok then, I will not edit the Transdev Melbounrne Page, what a shame as my Fleet info was 99.99% correct. Well good luck, getting the information yourself. I run the Fleet Lists on Bus Australia, and if I want, I can chose to not keep it up to date. Then be much harder the get the information. Also you and Mo7838, need to learn, Dysons do not own MBL or East West, 100%. I suggest, you join, ATDB, and give member Dyso, a PM, as his a family member, he might be able to explain it you better. If They had of bought MBL, and East West, it would of been mentioned in the press release, but no, it only mentions, RBC, and Midland Tours, which RBC own. But maybe you want to see my staff letters too?

Wish you 2 good luck, cause you're going end up having a lot of information wrong, or hard time getting everything you. For Most they'd be better off looking at Bus Australia Site. MAN 16.242 (talk