Talk:Hindu terrorism
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| This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Hindu terrorism article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
| Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
| Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5Auto-archiving period: 30 days |
Clean Chit to Sadhvi Pragya and Indresh Kumar by NIA
Edit to 2002 Gujarat riots
Why is more text being added about the train attack than the actual subject of the section? [1] --NeilN talk to me 04:24, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- Our article on Godhra train burning says "The event is widely perceived as the trigger for the riots that followed." El_C 11:47, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- @El C: Yes, but the same article suggests that the description is disputed; and it is the same sources which say that the Gujarat violence was planned, and not a spontaneous reaction, that use Saffron Terror in that context. Now the article does not reflect this, agreed, but that is not reason for using it as a coatrack for stuff about what triggers violence against Muslim people. Vanamonde (talk) 11:54, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- Note that our article on 2002 Gujarat riots also says the same thing: "The burning of a train in Godhra on 27 February 2002, which caused the deaths of 58 Hindu pilgrims karsevaks returning from Ayodhya, is believed to have triggered the violence." El_C 11:58, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- @Vanamonde93: I don't know enough about the event to comment—but I hope your claim has it's basis on reliable sources that represent due weight. El_C 12:01, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- I suppose my question is whether this article should mirror our other two articles more specific to the event (should Godhra train burning be mentioned?). El_C 12:04, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- @El C: I don't have an issue with the turn burning being mentioned but having more text about that event than the riots themselves seems problematic. --NeilN talk to me 12:28, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- I suggest that we get rid of the subsection on the 2002 Gujarat riots. It wasn't a terrorist incident in the normal sense of the term. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 12:30, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- (ec) I think it is ok to mention the train burning but further down in the paragraph. Perhaps "The riots, which are believed to have been triggered by the Godhra train burning incident, are part of ...". The edit by the simple human is obvious POV.--regentspark (comment) 12:33, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- This article isn't about terrorism. --NeilN talk to me 12:35, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- Right, it's about "acts of violence motivated by Hindu nationalism." I think regentspark has the right idea. El_C 12:43, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- Yes, I agree. --NeilN talk to me 12:58, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- If there are no other objections to the proposed wording, I will add this soon. Capitals00 (talk) 14:32, 23 June 2017 (UTC)
- Yes, I agree. --NeilN talk to me 12:58, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- Right, it's about "acts of violence motivated by Hindu nationalism." I think regentspark has the right idea. El_C 12:43, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- I suggest that we get rid of the subsection on the 2002 Gujarat riots. It wasn't a terrorist incident in the normal sense of the term. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 12:30, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- @El C: I don't have an issue with the turn burning being mentioned but having more text about that event than the riots themselves seems problematic. --NeilN talk to me 12:28, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
- @El C: Yes, but the same article suggests that the description is disputed; and it is the same sources which say that the Gujarat violence was planned, and not a spontaneous reaction, that use Saffron Terror in that context. Now the article does not reflect this, agreed, but that is not reason for using it as a coatrack for stuff about what triggers violence against Muslim people. Vanamonde (talk) 11:54, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
Samjhauta Express blast: How officials connived to ensure prime accused Pakistani national was let off despite evidence to nail him
I request the editors to rewrite the page after reading following report by Rajat Sharma who is a journalist from India TV.
S Gurumurthy also Exposed Pak’s Hand Behind Samjhauta Blast in 2013 with Crucial Rebuttals
Samjhauta Express blasts: UPA ‘cover-up’ questioned
There is also Times Now News Hour Debate over this issue.
Did UPA 'Discharge' Pakistan's Terrorist? | The Newshour Debate (20th June)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gO_8OzYcEgI
Samjhauta Express Blast: Did UPA Compromise India? | The Newshour Debate (21st June)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQRfqsVzRwY
Samjhauta blast: SIMI man’s narco test ‘nails’ Pak angle
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Swami16 (talk • contribs) 17:56, 23 June 2017 (UTC)
--Swami16 (talk) 19:26, 21 June 2017 (UTC)
- Thanks for these links. Capitals00 (talk) 13:11, 23 June 2017 (UTC)
Lead revert
@Kautilya3: restored a undiscussed lead change from 8 May[2] despite heavy discussions in archive[3][4] and the article itself says on sections such as Saffron_terror#Torture_by_Maharashtra_ATS, Saffron_terror#2007_Samjhauta_Express_bombings and more, that these incidents are alleged but also said to be unrelated to Saffron terror. Per WP:BRD a single misinformed edit from 8 May is clearly not the consensus version for the lead. Capitals00 (talk) 13:11, 23 June 2017 (UTC)
- The original lead was this. It was apparently watered down by POV pushers over the years, and Kashmiri was basically restoring the original. We now have much better sources available:
- Gatade, Subhash (27 May 2006). "Portents of Nanded: Bajrang Dal and the Bomb?". Economic and Political Weekly: 2055–2057. JSTOR 4418256.
- Editorial (15 November 2008). "Hindutva's Terrorism Links". Economic and Political Weekly. XLIII (46): 5. JSTOR 40278164.
- Editorial (22 May 2010). "Unravelling Hindutva Terrorism". Economic and Political Weekly: 8–9.
- Jaffrelot, Christophe (4 September 2010). "Abhinav Bharat, the Malegaon Blast and Hindu Nationalism: Resisting and Emulating Islamist Terrorism". Economic and Political Weekly. XLV (36): 51–58.
- Jaffrelot, Christophe (5 February 2011). "Paradigm Shifts by the RSS? Lessons from Aseemanand's Confession". Economic and Political Weekly. XLVI (6): 42–46.
{{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter|subscription=ignored (|url-access=suggested) (help) - Gittinger, Juli (10 September 2011). "Saffron Terror: Splinter or Symptom?". Economic and Political Weekly. XLVI (37).
- Jaffrelot, Christophe (21 July 2012). "Malegon: Who is above the Law?". Economic and Political Weekly. XXVII (29): 17–18.
- Bassett, Donna (2012), Peter Chalk (ed.), Encyclopedia of Terrorism, Volume 1, ABC-CLIO, pp. 647–648, ISBN 0313308950
{{citation}}: Unknown parameter|DUPLICATE_title=ignored (help) - Gatade, Subhash (29 March 2014). "Pawns in, Patrons Still out: Understanding the Phenomenon of Hindutva Terror". Economic and Political Weekly. XLIX (13).
- Please feel free to rewrite the content according to them. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 13:55, 23 June 2017 (UTC)
- The lead you linked was not original, rather one-sided and had been changed quickly upon consensus. 4 of these sources are written by same author (Jaffrelot) and already mentioned. There are many others sources to weigh upon the sentence: [5] [6] Capitals00 (talk) 14:28, 23 June 2017 (UTC)
- Given the sources, wouldn't it be better to rename the article to Hindutva terrorism or Hindu terrorism?VR talk 23:23, 23 June 2017 (UTC)
- Support. "Saffron terror" should then redirect there. — kashmiri TALK 00:09, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
2008 Malegaon blasts
I request following lines to be added in the end of Malegaon blasts section.
A secret deposition of the Ministry of Defence that was submitted to the court which suggests Lt Colonel Purohit was innocent of the terror charges that are being leveled against him.
source: http://www.timesnow.tv/newshour-shorts/video/lt-col-purohit-saffron-terror-scapegoat/59672 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Swami16 (talk • contribs) 23:05, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
More development on Swami Aseemanand and bigger conspiracy
Please do read latest Times Now expose on how UPA government pressurized NIA chief to consider Swami Aseemanand interview to Caravan as a truth, but later failed to allow forensic evaluation of the interview recorded on tape.
debate on the same
http://www.timesnow.tv/the-newshour/debate/bhagwat-a-‘terror-suspect’-for-upa/65970