Talk:Michael Moore

Total gross of Moore's films

Michael Moore's films have earned over 172 million U.S. dollars. The source of this information is http://www.the-numbers.com/people/directors/MIMOO.php I think the amount of profits Michael Moore's film have made should be included in the section regarding his filmography.

I agree with you. Also, in 2009, while his net worth was more than $50 million, he said, "capitalism did nothing for me." That should be in the article too. Grundle2600 (talk) 22:55, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

I believe Michael Moore is saying capitalism should not be credited for helping him become a filmmaker because, if you read the rest of his answer, he is happy to acknowledge that he went on to do very well for himself, and is now using his time, energy and wealth trying to bring down what he perceives to be an unfair system: "Well, capitalism did nothing for me, starting with my first film [Roger & Me]. You know, I had to pretty much beg, borrow and steal [to make the film]. The system is not set up to help somebody from the working class make a movie like this and get the truth out there. [...] I’m not loaded in the way you described. But I do well, obviously because my films do well. So, that means I have an extra responsibility to make sure I spend my time trying to make things better for the people that don’t have what I have." Dynablaster (talk) 23:36, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Only he hasn't done any of that. He spends all his time talking about how the corporate world is so evil and how it hates america, yet he hoards his money like everyone else, and relies on corporations to distribute his movies that have apparently "changed the world." He's not in it to make a change, he's after money and he's after fame. He wants people to think he's the good guy trying to make the world better, but he doesn't want the problems to go away, what he wants is to blow them out of proportion so he can continue to reap the benefits of acting like a "crusader" for the good of the working class people that he has nothing in common with. 207.5.160.27 (talk) 05:21, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

I agree with all of that. But this is an encyclopedia, even if it's an odd one, and not a tabloid at the supermarket checkout. The article should have specific, verifiable criticisms, but not a general "he's a hypocrite" opinion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.170.83.119 (talk) 07:10, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Can I add something here quickly? The section on Fahrenheit 9/11 is wrong, it says "second highest grossing film of all time" but the citation says first. 174.36.153.147 (talk) 12:41, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

Just want to reiterate the above point since this hasn't been changed but the page is locked. The article says second highest grossing and links to a sight that names it the highest grossing, which it is. Should be changed by someone with those privileges. 08:43, 14 November 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.12.197.138 (talk)

His first major film was "Roger & Me". And yet there is no reference to this in the introduction. This seems to be conspicuously missing. Yes, it is listed later, but this got him off the ground.--74.107.74.39 (talk) 03:33, 11 March 2011 (UTC)

This page needs to be updated. Capitalism: A Love Story is now 10th on the highest list by the source quoted. Can someone with administration priviledges change the first paragraph? 24.199.23.211 (talk) 19:02, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

 Done Rostz (talk) 21:28, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Criticism section

There should be something about how he was able to create so many movies and have so much monetary success despite being diagnosed with a mild form of autism. He is certainly one of the most notable people with the disease, and it seems like it should be credited to him. Overcoming this handicapped to make propaganda films is a remarkable achievement. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.74.161.233 (talk) 20:33, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Why isn't there one?124.158.32.144 (talk) 23:20, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

People would feel inclined to slit the throats of one another on this website. It would be the end of Wikipedia as we know it. LaRouxEMP (talk) 10:35, 12 March 2010 (UTC)

Wow! I didn't realise that Wikipedia was this biased. What happened to NPOV? A criticism section needs to be added immediately for this ignorant economic illiterate. I mean if there is no criticism section for MICHAEL MOORE then no one deserves a criticism section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sabaton10 (talk • contribs) 03:40, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

I agree with these people. Is there any doubt he is a controversial figure. People from both sides of the aisle agree he has some controversy. Please add some criticism of Michael Moore to this article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.107.0.73 (talk) 20:47, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

I agree that there should be some mention of criticism, but the problem is, I haven't come across any actual criticism. Aside from childish insults, the only complaint is that he's "rude" and "takes people out of context". If there is any legitimate criticism, it should definitely be cited and added. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.89.78.187 (talk) 07:27, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

There is no doubt he is a controversial figure. While he seems to take a lot of liberal or democratic positions, this article never describes the answer to "why"?. The tag controversial {{tl:controversial}} should absolutely be added to the main page. This needs a NPOV touch. --74.107.74.39 (talk) 02:41, 11 March 2011 (UTC)

Although I am a fan of Michael Moore, I created a "Controversy" section. Remember, this is supposed to be an objective source, and no valid criticism should be excluded. I added information about his alleged hypocrisy and provided links to the controversy sections to his major movies. InverseHypercube (talk) 23:15, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

I'll start. Try this link for a easy summary: criticism + "michael moore"--74.107.74.39 (talk) 01:05, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

There is some discussion about this here: [1]. Please join in! InverseHypercube (talk) 01:58, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, but there is a LOT more to look at criticism + "michael moore", and NONE in the main article - it's as if he is not controversial at all, any such attempts to point out such controversy in the main article is being deflected away from the main page. This is not doing very good service to the readers. If "political views" are are going to be expressed by any non-politician, then there will be controversy. Moore's views are worth no more than those of any other citizen, yet he gets special treatment by his protectors. The point is that the main page needs to discuss some of the principal controversies associated with Moore, whether it be his films or his political stances. Anything else is just protectionism by the super-editors of wikipedia. WP "controversial" tag should be posted in the main page indefinitely until this is resolved. --74.107.74.39 (talk) 00:14, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

The problem is that most criticism is about his work rather than about himself; so this should be on those articles (which it; look at Fahrenheit 9/11 controversy, for example). There are no "super-editors", and administrators have yet to be involved. Please, if you find good, sourced information then add it. I will add the "unbalanced" tag for now (the controversial tag is for talk pages, and is already here). InverseHypercube (talk) 02:44, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

"Unbalanced" is appropriate. By "super-editors" I refer to those with additional priviliges not availalble to all users. I fail to distinguish criticism of his work and the positions he takes - what's the diff? The article is all about Moore, not just about his films. If it was just about his films, then the entire section on "political views" can be removed (which I would gladly like to see happen - it invites controversy). --74.107.74.39 (talk) 00:40, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

General criticism

What is the most frequently levelled criticism of Michael Moore? It is sometimes said that his work is unscholarly, that his films lack balance, and that he sometimes plays fast and loose with chronology, events etc. Perhaps it would be better if we could find two or three sources that summarise these points in a concise manner. Moore has responded to such criticisms several times before, so we will need to provide his response. We should use high quality sources, per WP:BLP. Wikispan (talk) 15:21, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Agreed, and I actually came here to say this. Imagine my surprise to find my words here, already written by another. Viriditas (talk) 23:23, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

This article as it stands now doesn't have a shread of criticism of Michael Moore. Doesn't that seem odd since Moore frequetly responds to his crictics? I was just searching for the "Criticism of Michael Moore" article only to find it was deleted. I think someone is POV pushing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.107.0.73 (talk) 20:57, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I have been vandalized here too, and request editprotection be removed. The content here is an invitation to controversy. If the political views are removed from the main article and stick to his filmmaking rather than his soapboxing, things would be a lot better.--74.107.74.39 (talk) 00:16, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

Liberal Bias

There has been much talk about a "controversies" section for Moore, but for some odd reason, none has come up. I think it is the liberals on wikipedia who just pay it lip service. A major controversy for Moore was when his claims about the Cuban healthcare system. John Stossel completely destroyed his claims, by several methods, including talking to Cubans who illegally taped the hospitals in Cuba and showed that they were completely run down. It was a major controversy. These videos are all available on YouTube. I think I will start referencing them and building a section if no one objects. There was also a book out showing Michael Moore's hypocrisy, and showed that Moore held Haliburton stock. You should see the controversy section on Rush Limbaugh's page. It is almost half the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by CaptainNicodemus (talk • contribs) 23:05, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

The appropriate place for detailed criticism of Sicko is the Sicko article, where there's already significant coverage. Rostz (talk) 00:27, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

"Moore is a jet-setting multimillionaire living a life of luxury, leisure and fame" writes Jeffrey T. Kuhner in The hypocrisy of Michael Moore (The Washington Times, February 10, 2011). "He … has misrepresented almost every facet of himself in order to forge a false 'little guy' persona. … For example, he claims to come from working-class roots in Flint, Mich. 'I think once you’re working class, you’re always working class,' the filmmaker said. The Moore’s family home, however, was not in Flint but in the nearby middle-class town of Davison. His father — contrary to Mr. Moore‘s claims — was not some low-level autoworker struggling to put food on the table. Instead, he worked at General Motors where he earned a comfortable salary, owned a bourgeois home, sent his four kids to private Catholic school and played golf nearly every day at a private club. Mr. Moore had a privileged upbringing." Asteriks (talk) 10:51, 26 February 2011 (UTC)

By others who have contributed to this article, he and his family now lives in the resort town of Traverse City, Michigan. To quote from the current article:

"Also in 2005, Moore started the annual Traverse City Film Festival in Traverse City, Michigan." "Moore's net worth has been estimated at "8 figures"."[59] So how many figures is acceptable? How many of you wikipedia readers earn eight figures in income per year? He talks the talk but can no longer walk the walk.--74.107.74.39 (talk) 00:05, 6 March 2011 (UTC)

I'm not sure I see what the relevance here is other than a ad hominem attack. 76.254.27.29 (talk) 06:01, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

Hypocracy is the theme. The main article cites it, and additional references tend to confirm it. He is no longer "working class", despite the image he tries to present.--74.107.74.39 (talk) 02:10, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

I agree, wikipedia is definetly liberal biased. they critisize all the conservatives, but when a liberal comes up, they leave them alone. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.57.137.27 (talk) 04:02, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

This comment page is not about Wikipedia in general, but about the specific article. Please keep to the topic. --74.107.74.39 (talk) 01:47, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

The Ground Zero project

I am removing this from the article and placing it here on talk, per WP:Recentism and WP:Undue. Moore has launched/supported many causes and campaigns -- what distinguishes this one from the countless others? How much coverage has this received in the quality press? (Note for user Hearfourmewesique: Newsbusters in a low quality source that should be used sparingly, particularly where WP:BLP is concerned. If you disagree, proceed to the RS Noticeboard.) What this article needs is a balanced expansion of his religious views, given his longstanding interest in the topic, both in film and print. Wikispan (talk) 18:14, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

On September 11, 2010, Moore has publicly expressed his support of Park51, a project designed to build a Muslim center on the ruins of the Twin Towers. Moore insists that the Muslim center must be built directly on Ground Zero, rather than near it, claiming that it will promote the image of the American people as a "a loving and generous people" and will "help [the Muslims] get [their] religion back." He also stated being more displeased about having a nearby McDonald's, claiming it took more lives than the terrorist attacks. Moore has already collected about $60,000 in donations on his website.

I am reinstating this in the article. Don't point at other stuff. He is proudly talking about this on his website, citing the CNN article. What exactly is not publication worthy here? Hearfourmewesique (talk) 19:09, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

That is not a considered reply to my expressed concern. The NewsBusters piece is not fit for this or any other BLP related article ("Schlockumentary film producer", "people who live in pants the size of tents shouldn't throw Big Macs"). The Slate magazine article is dated 2004. JOHANNORBERG.NET is a personal website. The weight of evidence is against you. To repeat, this article could do with a section that describes the subjects religious views in a neutral and balanced manner. Wikispan (talk) 19:29, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

OK, then let's leave CNN and Huffington Post – are these unreliable as well? "Not fit" is your opinion btw, I think it's fair, albeit somewhat personal. Still, there are two reliable secondary sources, with one being directly quoted in the primary source. Hearfourmewesique (talk) 19:37, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Please take the necessary time to read and understand exactly what I am trying to say. I do not oppose mentioning Moore's view on the building of a Mosque as near as possible to, or on top of, "the ruins of the Twin Towers". I simply ask that we approach this topic in a balanced and more complete way (i.e. his dislike of organized religion, etc). For your information, BLP says: "We must get the article right. Be very firm about the use of high quality sources." And "Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced—whether the material is negative, positive, neutral, or just questionable—should be removed immediately and without waiting for discussion." Let's avoid sound bytes and encourage editors to work toward a more complete section. Wikispan (talk) 19:57, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

...and there we go again:

• High quality sources – Moore's website itself, the CNN article it cites in its entirety, and Huffington Post. I could dig for more, but isn't that enough?
• Unsourced/poorly sourced – just demonstrated two good primary and two good secondary sources that fully back up this story.

So... after it's been established that the BLP policies that you've quoted have not been violated, what's next? Hearfourmewesique (talk) 06:27, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

I believe that Moore's support for the mosque/center should be included. Perhaps it could be included in the existing "Political views" section instead of its own section or under a "Religious views" section. Besides the high-quality sources CNN.com and the Huffington Post and Moore's official website (allowable under WP policy if same article), there is also an article in The Washington Times, and broadcast reports on both CNN and Fox News. Drrll (talk) 06:49, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

Hmm... now an editor is removing most of the links, claiming that it's a WP:LINKFARM (a policy which that editor obviously needs to review, considering that it doesn't apply to citing references but only to a list of external links!) and... let me guess, in a couple of days this passage will be deleted for lack of coverage. Am I right? Please, no more tricks. Hearfourmewesique (talk) 16:02, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Excessive external links

On September 11, 2010, Moore has publicly expressed his support of Park51, a project designed to build a Muslim community center on the ruins of the Twin Towers. Moore insists that the Muslim center must be built directly on Ground Zero, rather than near it, claiming that it will promote the image of the American people as a "a loving and generous people" and will "help [the Muslims] get [their] religion back." He also stated being more displeased about having a nearby McDonald's, claiming it took more lives than the terrorist attacks. Moore has already collected about $60,000 worth of donations on his website.

• -http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/mike-friends-blog/if-mosque-isnt-built-no-longer-america

• - http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/mike-in-the-news/build-islamic-center-ground-zero-says-moore

• - http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2010/09/11/moore-build-islamic-center-on-ground-zero/

• - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/pearl-korn/michael-moores-fundraisin_b_720615.html

• - http://arabnews.com/world/article144068.ece

• - http://www.cnsnews.com/commentary/article/75360

• - http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/sep/12/inside-the-beltway-908658550/

Discussion

There is no need at all to have this content cited by more than a couple of citations, what we do here is report content and cite it to a reliable location, multiple externals are undue and are better removed. Also . .the text is a bit weasely, the word insists is weaselly, he has on authority to insists anything, also the expression publically expressed his support, publicly is not neededOff2riorob (talk) 16:05, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

First and foremost, you are forgetting what WP:External links are. It is a bare list, usually found below the {{reflist}} section. Secondly, I've been trying to establish the notability of this passage for a while now, and had to find a large amount of sources to overcome yet another silly wikibattle. Lastly, nothing here is "weaselly"; "insists" is a neutral description of his firm statement, and "publicly" is a neutral description of his loud outcry to reach as many supporters as he can. All I see on your end is WP:IDONTLIKEIT. Hearfourmewesique (talk) 16:11, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Yes, we don't add as many external links as we can find in an attempt to assert the issue is notable. Personally I see the addition as basic partisan attack type content. We can easily cite this content from two external links (in this manner I am considering any link to an of wiki site as external) . The weaselly words will be better gone, I will look through the cites, as for I don't like it, no I dont like such POV pushing partisan attack additions, wikipedia needs NPOV contributors and even discussing this is a waste of my time, clearly there are unnecessary citations and clearly the measly words are undue, you like them, you wrote them. Off2riorob (talk) 16:19, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Everything that you don't like is an attack. Gotcha. Michael Moore has never stirred a controversy in his life, and if the whole world, including Moore himself, says he has, it's a conspiracy, which will probably be the theme of his next movie. POV pushing? This is precisely what you are doing: removing content that is not to your liking. There is not a single POV-driven word in that passage. Had it contained sentences like "Michael Moore has decided to dance on Sep. 11 victims' graves by making a mockery of the aforementioned date", you would have been right. Again, nothing but WP:IDONTLIKEIT. Hearfourmewesique (talk) 16:36, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

The whole thing is undue, as I said previously. BLP is unambiguous: our purpose is to provide a broad overview of Person X's views on any given topic, being naturally conservative, avoiding the temptation to reproduce only the most sensationalist sound bytes (the very opposite of what is unfolding here). The same rule applies to every notable person on Wikipedia, regardless of political persuasion. Unfortunately I don't have the time to craft a balanced section, nor in the immediate future. Wikispan (talk) 16:28, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

This is what he's doing. This is what he's distributing on a scale as broad as possible. Come to think of it, I'm actually doing him a public service by (justly) including this here. I've gathered both this section and the hurricane issue under "Controversial media appearances" – can we at least agree that Moore has a tendency to make those? Multiple reliable sources are covering this issue, describing it as "controversial" and "stirring the pot", and Moore even cites the CNN entry on his own website, under the headline "Mike in the news"! Geez, what more do you need to eradicate the "undue" excuse? Marching elephants? Fireworks? Moore going door-to-door to make sure everyone knows? Hearfourmewesique (talk) 16:36, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Moore receives frequent press attention―negative and positive―for things he says, writes and does. I can identify 5 similar instances with ease. The material you wish to add is not very illustrative, but it has a much better chance of sticking if we expand the section to give a general summary of his political/religious views, instead of focusing narrowly on a single point of contention, which is no more 'controversial' that many other things he has said in the past. If not, a pattern will emerge of selecting the most salacious quotes we can find, and pretty soon the whole section will be zapped. Wikispan (talk) 17:20, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Zap. There should be a way to integrate the content into the major sections without sensationalizing it as a controversy or out of context. Viriditas (talk) 22:20, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. I don't think this section is good for the long term health of the article. BrendanFrye (talk) 01:49, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

I've removed this coat rack and recentism section as unencyclopedic for a second time. Default on BLP articles is exclusion not inclusion of disputed material. I would like to be convinced as to importance of this content to a biography before it is added again. Viriditas (talk) 05:39, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Re-read BLP please. That's all I'm going to say now, after repeatedly asserting the importance of including these controversial media appearances. Hearfourmewesique (talk) 22:11, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

We do not assert the importance of biographical material. We use sources that make that assertion. Unless you can show that this coat rack recentism is in any way important or significant to this biography, we have no good reason to include it. Viriditas (talk) 03:47, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

The sources say it all, please read. They are asserting the importance of including the material. Editors are either claiming there are too many sources, that they (were) garbled at the end (I've rearranged them to match citations) and now you're saying there's not enough? At least make up your mind. Hearfourmewesique (talk) 19:08, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

No, you need to stop forcing disputed BLP content into this article and wait for this discussion to conclude. Please do not keep edit warring on a BLP. We default to exclusion when we are dealing with biographies. Now, please explain in your own words, how and why this material is significant, important, and essential to this biography. I don't see it. All I see is an editor cherry picking negative, trivial criticism to make a BLP look bad. That's not how we write articles. Viriditas (talk) 21:47, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

No, all I see is editors excluding any material that might balance this appraisal piece you call a BLP. Michael Moore has created several controversies, upset many people and got more than plenty of WP:RS coverage about this. Now you explain why you are fighting so vigorously to exclude this from the article. It's supposed to cover a person's life, not just assorted points that you like. Why isn't there a single word about the endless negative criticism he keeps getting? Does WP:NPOV spring to mind? Hearfourmewesique (talk) 20:14, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

You haven't responded to a single question I've asked you about the content you keep adding and until you do, it doesn't belong in the article. Please refrain from addressing other contributors and directly address the content and its applicability to this article. There are many problems with your latest edits. First, you have added back redundancy to the lead section that describes Moore as a liberal twice, and uses a primary source to do it the second time. On Wikipedia, we use secondary sources to highlight significant claims, and we use the lead section to summarize the article. The lead already says Moore is a liberal in the first sentence, and does not require that an editor find a primary source to state it for a second time. Lastly, you have added back a "controversial media appearances" section. This section is a hand-picked, cherry-picked, hodgepodge of non-notable trivia using Fox News sources and primary sources from Moore's website to "create" a controversy. That's not how we use sources, and that is not appropriate for an encyclopedia entry about a BLP. Viriditas (talk) 20:31, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

First and foremost, I've responded to all your questions more than once. You're just playing stupid. For the 238476537th time: the material is important because it balances the otherwise one-sided fanclub appraisal piece.

I do not "create" controversies. I use multiple sources that describe the events as controversial. Like it or not, FOX news is still a WP:RS until proven otherwise; if you want to change it, find a noticeboard. Still, it's only one of the sources and that wasn;t even my addition. The 9/11 controversy is backed up by seven sources, most of which Moore fans here were removing under the pretense of "linkfarming", just so that someone like you could say that there are not enough sources to convey importance. Just because a reliable source represents a view that contradicts your own, doesn't make it any less reliable. Another editor removed the Cybercast article because he didn't like the tone. A neutral biography is supposed to cover everything, not only hand-picked, cherry-picked, biased Nobel peace prize winning appraisals about how much revenue Moore's films made (it's just an example, please don't take it verbatim). Check the sources please, I even outlined the inline citations that clearly define the events as controversial. Hearfourmewesique (talk) 20:50, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Please be mindful of WP:CIV and WP:NPA. You have not answered my questions nor addressed the points raised by others. Your response, "the material is important because it balances the otherwise one-sided fanclub appraisal piece" is a non-response. I would be happy to discuss and analyze your sources and material word by word, but you will need to also do your part, which means putting a stop to the disruption, the edit warring, and the non-answers. Viriditas (talk) 09:16, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Source for Flint

Note 1 refers to his being from Flint because he says he is from Flint. This sort of circular reference should not be used on wikipedia as it is not a neutral source. 86.45.62.58 (talk) 04:30, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Feel free to fix it. Say where he is from in the lead (although make mention of the area of Flint) then add a single line about him being made fun of for not really being "working class" in the body if that is what sources say.Cptnono (talk) 06:24, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

That is not a helpful suggestion. Please see past discussions on this subject. Moore was born in St. Joseph Hospital (Flint) and grew up in Davidson (a suburb of Flint). This is supported by several references, including the New York Times. Wikispan (talk) 06:49, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Is is a very helpful suggestion. Where someone is born and where they grew up are totally two different things that both need to be addressed. For example, I was born in a town that is completely different than the one I was raised in since the hospital was in that city. Since Davidson is so much different than Flint it makes sense that people have pointed it out. And since some have pointed out tat he claims to be working class but grew up in a suburb then it means we might need to do it as well. We should not mirror their POV, of course.Cptnono (talk) 06:55, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

The main body already includes a concise summary of his upbringing (Early life). Your comment "since Davidson is so much different than Flint" comes across as a clumsy attempt to drive a wedge between the two. The reality is that Davidson is a district of Flint. They are inseparable. Countless critical sources make the same mistake. But these sections―including the infobox―require high quality sources. I will dig out the New York Times reference when I get time. Several more all say the same thing. These have the benefit of dealing with the subject in a neutral manner. Wikispan (talk) 08:10, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

An American Carol

The 2008 movie An American Carol was basically a two hour long satire/criticism of Michael Moore, I think its well known enough and pertinent enough that it demands at least recognition of some sort. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.226.211.125 (talk) 03:16, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Moore linked to Rahm Emmanuel?

I'll simply re-ask the question posed by an IP user in 2004, visible in Archive 1 of this talk page: Is it true Moore's agent Ari Emmanuel is the brother of Illinois congressman Rahm Emmanuel? Of course Rahm Emmanuel is now the mayor of Chicago. I just heard Michael Rivero assert this information on his radio show dated May 13, 2011. We should attempt to address this relationship, starting by looking for reliable sources to document it should it happen to be correct. And if it is, I suggest this information should go into our article. No one responded to the question in 2004, btw. __meco (talk) 19:25, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from 68.3.178.239, 1 June 2011

He is from Davison not flint

68.3.178.239 (talk) 11:05, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Davison is a suburb of Flint. Wikispan (talk) 11:56, 1 June 2011 (UTC)