Jacob and User talk:Russavia: Difference between pages

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{{User:Russavia/Top}}
{{merge-from|Yaqub}}
:<span class="dablink">''This is an article about '''Jacob''' in the [[Hebrew Bible]]. For other uses of the name, see [[Jacob (disambiguation)]].''</span>
{{cleanup-date|February 2006}}
[[Image:Jacob-angel.jpg|right|thumbnail|250px|Jacob Wrestling with the [[Angel]] &ndash; [[Gustave Doré]], 1855]]
'''Jacob''' or '''Ya'akov''', ('''&#1497;&#1463;&#1506;&#1458;&#1511;&#1465;&#1489;''' "Holder of the heel", [[Standard Hebrew]] '''{{IPA|Ya&#703;aqov}}''', [[Tiberian Hebrew]] '''{{IPA|Ya&#703;&#259;q&#333;&#7687;}}'''; [[Arabic language|Arabic]] '''&#1610;&#1593;&#1602;&#1608;&#1576;''' '''{{IPA|Ya&#703;q&#363;b}}'''), later known as '''Israel''' ('''&#1497;&#1460;&#1513;&#1474;&#1456;&#1512;&#1464;&#1488;&#1461;&#1500;''' "One Who Has Struggled with God", [[Standard Hebrew]] '''{{IPA|Yisra&#702;el}}''', [[Tiberian Hebrew]] '''{{IPA|Yi&#347;r&#257;&#702;&#275;l}}'''; [[Arabic language|Arabic]] '''&#1575;&#1587;&#1585;&#1575;&#1574;&#1610;&#1604;''' '''{{IPA|Isr&#257;&#702;&#299;l}}''') is the third [[Biblical]] [[patriarch]]. His father was [[Isaac]] and his grandfather was [[Abraham]]. His story is told in the [[Book of Genesis]].


<center>
{|
|align="center" style="font-size:13pt; style="background:#fff022; font-color:red; font-weight:bold"|[[User:Russavia/Required photos|Can you help?!?]]


I am in constant need of photos for various articles I am working on, and I am in dire need of the following photos from around the globe. So I turn to the community in the hope that someone out there is able to take the photos that I require.
== '''JAKOB SUCKS HIS MUM's COCK !!!!''' ==


If you can help with photos of any of these subjects, please upload them to Commons, and then post a short message with a link to the photos on my English Wikipedia talk page.
==Other references to Jacob==
Jacob is the only person in [[Scripture]] whom God said He "loved". ([[Book of Malachi|Malachi]] 1:2&ndash;3, "...I loved Jacob, and I hated [[Esau]]...").


In the event you don't have a Commons log-in, you can email them to me at russavia.wikipedia@gmail.com and advise which licence you would like to licence them under, and I can do the uploading, categorisation, etc.
==Jacob's sons==
{{main|Israelite}}
{{sons of Jacob}}


I have provided as much detail on what I require, including addresses, links to online maps, and photos of the subject that I am unable to upload to Commons, in order for photographers to identify the subject I require.
{{Tribes of Israel}}


More info at [[User:Russavia/Required photos]]
Jacob had twelve sons by his four wives, as follows:
|}
*By [[Leah]]: [[Reuben (Bible)|Reuben]], [[Simeon]], [[Levi]], [[Judah (biblical figure)|Judah]], [[Issachar]], [[Zebulun]].
</center><BR>
*By [[Bilhah]]: [[Tribe of Dan|Dan]] and [[Naphtali]].
*By [[Zilpah]]: [[Gad]] and [[Asher]].
*By [[Rachel]]: [[Joseph (dreamer)|Joseph]] and [[Benjamin]].


{| id="toc" style="margin: 0 2em 0 2em;"
These 12 sons comprise the twelve [[Tribes of Israel]]. These tribes were recorded on the vestments of the [[Kohen|Kohen Gadol]] (high priest). However, when the land of Israel was apportioned among the tribes in the days of [[Joshua]], the [[Levite|Tribe of Levi]], being priests, did not receive land. Therefore, when the tribes are listed in reference to their receipt of land, as well as to their encampments during the 40 years of wandering in the desert, the [[Tribe of Joseph]] is replaced by the tribes of [[Ephraim]] and [[Manasseh]] (the two sons of Joseph by his Egyptian wife [[Asenath]], whom Jacob elevated to the status of full tribes).
! align="left" style="background:#fff022" width="100%" | Welcome to my talk page. Please leave me a '''[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=User_talk:Russavia&action=edit&section=new <font color="#5a3696">message</font>], alternatively you are welcome to [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Russavia<font color="#5a3696">email me</font>]. If you leave a message here for me and it requires a reply, I will reply here, so you may want to add my talk page to your watchlist. '''All users''' have my permission to remove any bot messages from my talk page at any time.
|}
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== Notes ==
Thus, the two divisions of the tribes are:


* [[Russophobia]] - add back in information on Latvia - http://rt.com/politics/latvia-russia-relations-nationalists/ - http://english.ruvr.ru/2010/11/17/34992378.html - http://www.humanrights.org.lv/html/monitor/30267.html - http://www.reitingi.lv/en/news/politics/2529.htm - http://english.ruvr.ru/2010/11/22/35422738.html - http://english.ruvr.ru/2010/11/09/32682722.html - http://rt.com/politics/roar-russia/ - http://english.pravda.ru/world/ussr/09-11-2010/115704-latvian_nazism-0/
Traditional division:
** It needs to be noted 1) Slutsis/Slucis was a member of the Civic Union 2) Slutsis was a major contributor to the party 3) Slutsis was expelled from the party after the scandal in order not to damage the new government 4) another Latvian doctor also made such Russophobic statements 5) that same doctor was also expelled from the party 6) the Latvian FM scandal threatened to scuttle the Latvian Prez's trip to Russia, after he drew almost universal condemnation in Russia for agreeing with the Russophobic Slutsis
#[[Reuben (Bible)|Reuben]]
** http://www.minelres.lv/MinIssues/info/2003/63.html - Xenophobic (as a rule, Russophobic) statements are common in readers' letters in all Latvian newspapers.
#[[Simeon]]
** Review http://www.lhrc.lv/biblioteka/last_prisoners.pdf and http://szf.lu.lv/files/petnieciba/publikacijas/Integracija_anglu.pdf
#[[Levi]]
* [http://www.kdmid.ru Consular Department of the RF]
#[[Judah (biblical figure)|Judah]]
* [[Russian Agency for International Development]] - [http://www.webcitation.org/61Iol4NMX Vedomosti], [http://www.webcitation.org/61Iot8qTK Moscow Times], [http://www.webcitation.org/61Ip0O9dt Forbes], [http://www.webcitation.org/61IpJEeps LDPR against]
#[[Issachar]]
* http://www.mid.ru/ns-dgpch.nsf/aa259d77f08b8f4543256da40037b908/ff0b06a742a63c5ac32572f9004a2a15 - make contact with organisations on this list
#[[Zebulun]]
* http://reocities.com/CapitolHill/parliament/3005/ - old Tunis embassy website - get relevant info from there for future articles
#[[Tribe of Dan|Dan]]
* http://www.webcitation.org/62TbrvkT0 - 224th Flight Unit from MDF
#[[Naphtali]]
#[[Gad]]
#[[Asher]]
#[[Joseph (dreamer)|Joseph]]
#[[Benjamin]]


== Come back ==
Division according to apportionment of land in Israel:
#[[Reuben (Bible)|Reuben]]
#[[Simeon]]
#[[Judah (biblical figure)|Judah]]
#[[Issachar]]
#[[Zebulun]]
#[[Tribe of Dan|Dan]]
#[[Naphtali]]
#[[Gad]]
#[[Asher]]
#[[Benjamin]]
#[[Ephraim]]
#[[Manasseh]]


Please change your mind and come back. Laissez faire, it doesn't matter. Do get involved again.
== Rabbinical teachings about Jacob ==
According to the classic Jewish texts, Jacob, as the third and last patriarch, lived a life that paralleled the descent of his offspring, the Jewish people, into the darkness of exile. In contrast to Abraham&mdash;who illuminated the world with knowledge of God and earned the respect of the inhabitants of the land of [[Canaan]]&mdash;and Isaac&mdash;who continued his father's teachings and also lived in relative harmony with his neighbors&mdash;Jacob experienced many personal struggles both in the land and out of it (including the hatred of his brother [[Esau]], the death of his favorite wife [[Rachel]], the sale of his son [[Joseph (dreamer)|Joseph]], the rape of his daughter [[Dinah]], and the deception of his father-in-law [[Laban (Bible)|Laban]]). For this reason, the Jewish commentators interpret many elements of his story as being symbolic of the future difficulties and struggles the Jewish people would undergo during their long exile, which continues to the present day.


P.S.: I started to upload the images you suggested to Commons, and also started to include them in a number of articles.
==Jacob in Islam==
{{main|Yaqub}}


With warmest regards
In [[Arabic language|Arabic]] Jacob is known as [[Yaqub]]. He is revered as a prophet who received inspiration from God. The [[Qu'ran]] does not give the details of Jacob’s life. God perfected his favor on Jacob and his posterity as he perfected his favor on Abraham and Isaac (12:6). Jacob was a man of might and vision (38:45) and was chosen by God to preach the Message. The Qu'ran stresses that worshiping and bowing to the One true God was the main legacy of Jacob and his fathers (2:132-133). [[Salvation]], according to the Qu'ran, hinges upon this legacy rather than being a Jew or Christian (See Qu'ran 2:130-141).
--[[User:Jetstreamer|Jetstreamer]] ([[User talk:Jetstreamer|talk]]) 10:46, 30 September 2011 (UTC)


Good to have you back Russavia!♦ [[User talk:Dr. Blofeld|<span style="font-variant:small-caps;color:#000">Dr. Blofeld</span>]] 15:31, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
According to the Qu'ran, Jacob was of the company of the Elect and the Good (38:47, 21:75). However, the [[Nation of Islam]] organization considers the figure of [[Yakub]] (a variant of the Arabic form of Jacob) to be a villain who created the white race through genetic experimentation.


==See also==
== Collect ==
*[[History of ancient Israel and Judah]]


Re [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement&curid=12936136&diff=454575086&oldid=454455685]: interesting. Collect has made similar implausible claims of uninvolvement elsewhere [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Amendment&curid=22747432&diff=454569183&oldid=454568619#Statement_by_uninvolved_Collect] [[User:William M. Connolley|William M. Connolley]] ([[User talk:William M. Connolley|talk]]) 17:36, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
==Reference==
:Oh yeah, it's a joke. Everytime I see "uninvolved Collect" I piss myself laughing, because it actually indicates that he is knee deep involved. Such as at the AE request, how on earth can he say he is "uninvolved" when he also actively edit warred in removing the POV tag, tried claiming neutrality on the issue, which of course got some bemused comments from other editors. Collect is neither uninvolved or neutral in most things. I have never really bumped into Collect before, and from using wikistalk we had only ever edited around about 6 articles which were the same...and never at the same time, but rather long periods apart. But yet, there "uninvolved" and "neutral" Collect is, at almost every dispute discussion involving myself, making his uninvolved and neutral comments to try and have me sanctioned. So I share your disdain for such behaviour, even moreso when the editor outright lies at a 3RR report and an amendment request involving myself, and pushes for me to be sanctioned and/or banned (refer to the last 2 weeks). Frankly, I have no time for such dishonest editors, and they will themselves get banned before too long because of that dishonesty. Glad I'm not the only one who see this. Good luck with your request too. [[User:Russavia|Russavia]] <sup>[[User talk:Russavia|Let's dialogue]]</sup> 18:10, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
*{{Harvard reference|
::[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement&diff=454583145&oldid=454582001 Your edit] of Collect's statement to make him 'involved' seems to be a violation of [[WP:TPG]]. Since [[WP:AE]] is an admin board, I can't rule out that you might be blocked for modifying someone else's statement. When an editor states that they are 'uninvolved,' it is simply a claim by the person making it. You can interpret their statement with whatever grain of salt you think best. You would normally be free to rebut Collect's statement in your own section, but you can't do so anymore since the report is closed. To avoid problems, I suggest that you revert your own edit to the closed report. Your use of the word 'lies' above also seems to be a personal attack. Please be circumspect about your own behavior if you want to participate in discussions about others' behavior at AE. [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 20:03, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
|Surname=Trachtenberg
:::I know you mean well and you are just trying to follow Wikipedia's guidelines but I don't see this issue even addressed in the TPG. If "involved"/"uninvolved" is something anyone can be dishonest about, and without consequences (but consequences for those who know) rather than a guide for admins to ascertain the status of a user (hence the formalised nature and the third-person), then what purpose would it serve?
|Given=Joshua
:::Having said that, I'm open to changing my mind. If you are aware of any precedents supporting the use of misleading editorial status, I'll undo the change, regardless of it being another ridiculous, and obvious, loophole for editorial dishonesty. If there are no precedents, a community discussion regarding misleading uses of "involved/uninvolved" would be interesting.
|Title=Jewish Magic and Superstition: A Study in Folk Religion
:::Based upon this, I must at this time, respectfully decline your request. [[User:Russavia|Russavia]] <sup>[[User talk:Russavia|Let's dialogue]]</sup> 22:10, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
|Place=New York
::::The problem is: he identified his status in his own header. You changed the header he wrote, while leaving no acknowledgment on the board of the fact you changed it, making it seem like it was his choice to mark himself as 'involved.' You also did not notify him of the change. [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 00:06, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
|Publisher=Behrman's Jewish Book house
:::::The problem is Ed, that I could identify myself as an admin, or as Jimbo, or as Jesus Christ; it doesn't make it true in an any sense, and it would be changed. It's the same thing here. Having said that I was going to go to the AE and remove "involved"/"uninvolved" completely, but Lothar beat me to the punch by an hour. That is the solution. By the way, I am not an admin, nor am I Jimbo, [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zjz16xjeBAA nor am I the messiah....I'm just a very naughty boy]. [[User:Russavia|Russavia]] <sup>[[User talk:Russavia|Let's dialogue]]</sup> 08:08, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
|Year=1939}}


== Please do not edit other people's statements.. ==
{{Adam to David}}
[[Category:Torah people]]
[[Category:Fraternal twins]]


Like you just did at RfArb/A: It's impolite, combative, and in the long run of things, fairly useless to the Arbitrators. See this discussion thread on more [[Wikipedia_talk:Arbitration/Requests#Statement_by_uninvolved...]]. Thanks. [[User:SirFozzie|SirFozzie]] ([[User talk:SirFozzie|talk]]) 19:34, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
[[cs:Jákob]]
:Refer to [[User_talk:Russavia#Collect]] right above here. It is dishonest of an editor to claim to be uninvolved, particular in a thread which is discussing topic bans on two editors in which Collect was more than a willing participant in edit warring, plastering notices on people's talk pages warning them of 3RR, when he was edit warring, and ignoring talk page discussions. It is now becoming a running joke. It may not be of any use to Arbitrators, but it of use to the general community who might be otherwise clueless as to an editor's level of involvement. But hey, if you say it is combative, I won't do it in future. I have removed all pages, except for those in my userspace from my watchlist, am no longer keeping any major tabs on discussions, with the exception of the clarification request, so I thank you for the link; I will post a comment over there. Cheers, [[User:Russavia|Russavia]] <sup>[[User talk:Russavia|Let's dialogue]]</sup> 19:43, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
[[da:Jakob]]

[[de:Jakob (Patriarch)]]
==Avicopter AC313==
[[fr:Jacob]]

[[he:יעקב אבינו]]
Nice find! Since we do have an article for the [[Avicopter AC313]], I'ved moved the photo there from the [[Aérospatiale Super Frelon]]/Z-8 page. - [[User:BilCat|BilCat]] ([[User talk:BilCat|talk]]) 10:08, 22 October 2011 (UTC)
[[it:Giacobbe]]

[[ja:ヤコブ (イスラエル)]]
==Hi==
[[pl:Jakub (Biblia)]]
I left you a message [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:RT_%28TV_network%29&diff=457381778&oldid=456502299]. No need to discuss anything. This is simply my suggestion. [[User:Hodja Nasreddin|Biophys]] ([[User talk:Hodja Nasreddin|talk]]) 00:42, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
[[ru:Иаков]]
[[sv:Jakob]]
[[zh:以色列 (人名)]]

Revision as of 00:42, 26 October 2011

User:Russavia/Top

Can you help?!?

I am in constant need of photos for various articles I am working on, and I am in dire need of the following photos from around the globe. So I turn to the community in the hope that someone out there is able to take the photos that I require.

If you can help with photos of any of these subjects, please upload them to Commons, and then post a short message with a link to the photos on my English Wikipedia talk page.

In the event you don't have a Commons log-in, you can email them to me at russavia.wikipedia@gmail.com and advise which licence you would like to licence them under, and I can do the uploading, categorisation, etc.

I have provided as much detail on what I require, including addresses, links to online maps, and photos of the subject that I am unable to upload to Commons, in order for photographers to identify the subject I require.

More info at User:Russavia/Required photos


Welcome to my talk page. Please leave me a message, alternatively you are welcome to email me. If you leave a message here for me and it requires a reply, I will reply here, so you may want to add my talk page to your watchlist. All users have my permission to remove any bot messages from my talk page at any time.

Notes

Come back

Please change your mind and come back. Laissez faire, it doesn't matter. Do get involved again.

P.S.: I started to upload the images you suggested to Commons, and also started to include them in a number of articles.

With warmest regards --Jetstreamer (talk) 10:46, 30 September 2011 (UTC)

Good to have you back Russavia!♦ Dr. Blofeld 15:31, 11 October 2011 (UTC)

Collect

Re [1]: interesting. Collect has made similar implausible claims of uninvolvement elsewhere [2] William M. Connolley (talk) 17:36, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Oh yeah, it's a joke. Everytime I see "uninvolved Collect" I piss myself laughing, because it actually indicates that he is knee deep involved. Such as at the AE request, how on earth can he say he is "uninvolved" when he also actively edit warred in removing the POV tag, tried claiming neutrality on the issue, which of course got some bemused comments from other editors. Collect is neither uninvolved or neutral in most things. I have never really bumped into Collect before, and from using wikistalk we had only ever edited around about 6 articles which were the same...and never at the same time, but rather long periods apart. But yet, there "uninvolved" and "neutral" Collect is, at almost every dispute discussion involving myself, making his uninvolved and neutral comments to try and have me sanctioned. So I share your disdain for such behaviour, even moreso when the editor outright lies at a 3RR report and an amendment request involving myself, and pushes for me to be sanctioned and/or banned (refer to the last 2 weeks). Frankly, I have no time for such dishonest editors, and they will themselves get banned before too long because of that dishonesty. Glad I'm not the only one who see this. Good luck with your request too. Russavia Let's dialogue 18:10, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
Your edit of Collect's statement to make him 'involved' seems to be a violation of WP:TPG. Since WP:AE is an admin board, I can't rule out that you might be blocked for modifying someone else's statement. When an editor states that they are 'uninvolved,' it is simply a claim by the person making it. You can interpret their statement with whatever grain of salt you think best. You would normally be free to rebut Collect's statement in your own section, but you can't do so anymore since the report is closed. To avoid problems, I suggest that you revert your own edit to the closed report. Your use of the word 'lies' above also seems to be a personal attack. Please be circumspect about your own behavior if you want to participate in discussions about others' behavior at AE. EdJohnston (talk) 20:03, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
I know you mean well and you are just trying to follow Wikipedia's guidelines but I don't see this issue even addressed in the TPG. If "involved"/"uninvolved" is something anyone can be dishonest about, and without consequences (but consequences for those who know) rather than a guide for admins to ascertain the status of a user (hence the formalised nature and the third-person), then what purpose would it serve?
Having said that, I'm open to changing my mind. If you are aware of any precedents supporting the use of misleading editorial status, I'll undo the change, regardless of it being another ridiculous, and obvious, loophole for editorial dishonesty. If there are no precedents, a community discussion regarding misleading uses of "involved/uninvolved" would be interesting.
Based upon this, I must at this time, respectfully decline your request. Russavia Let's dialogue 22:10, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
The problem is: he identified his status in his own header. You changed the header he wrote, while leaving no acknowledgment on the board of the fact you changed it, making it seem like it was his choice to mark himself as 'involved.' You also did not notify him of the change. EdJohnston (talk) 00:06, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
The problem is Ed, that I could identify myself as an admin, or as Jimbo, or as Jesus Christ; it doesn't make it true in an any sense, and it would be changed. It's the same thing here. Having said that I was going to go to the AE and remove "involved"/"uninvolved" completely, but Lothar beat me to the punch by an hour. That is the solution. By the way, I am not an admin, nor am I Jimbo, nor am I the messiah....I'm just a very naughty boy. Russavia Let's dialogue 08:08, 11 October 2011 (UTC)

Please do not edit other people's statements..

Like you just did at RfArb/A: It's impolite, combative, and in the long run of things, fairly useless to the Arbitrators. See this discussion thread on more Wikipedia_talk:Arbitration/Requests#Statement_by_uninvolved.... Thanks. SirFozzie (talk) 19:34, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

Refer to User_talk:Russavia#Collect right above here. It is dishonest of an editor to claim to be uninvolved, particular in a thread which is discussing topic bans on two editors in which Collect was more than a willing participant in edit warring, plastering notices on people's talk pages warning them of 3RR, when he was edit warring, and ignoring talk page discussions. It is now becoming a running joke. It may not be of any use to Arbitrators, but it of use to the general community who might be otherwise clueless as to an editor's level of involvement. But hey, if you say it is combative, I won't do it in future. I have removed all pages, except for those in my userspace from my watchlist, am no longer keeping any major tabs on discussions, with the exception of the clarification request, so I thank you for the link; I will post a comment over there. Cheers, Russavia Let's dialogue 19:43, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

Avicopter AC313

Nice find! Since we do have an article for the Avicopter AC313, I'ved moved the photo there from the Aérospatiale Super Frelon/Z-8 page. - BilCat (talk) 10:08, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

Hi

I left you a message [3]. No need to discuss anything. This is simply my suggestion. Biophys (talk) 00:42, 26 October 2011 (UTC)