Talk:Aftermath Entertainment

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Needs Cleaning[edit]

This article needs some cleaning. There seems to be a chunk missing here: "Veteran rapper Rakim signed with the label Legal troubles forced Truth Hurts to leave the label, and Rakim's highly anticipated comeback album, shelved due to production conflict, also forced his departure."

I didn't change it because I'm not sure whats supposed to go there. Also, Rakim is mentioned twice as formerly being in Aftermath

Who took away Former Artists?[edit]

I think it is a useful piece of information and ties in well with the biographies of many other artists' articles on wikipedia. It's also an interesting read, please bring it back. Shabad -6 Nov. 2006

Affiliate Labels?[edit]

It should be noted that while Aftermath "shares" *some* of its artists with Shady and G-Unit Records -- neither of those imprints operate exclusively through it. They are divisions of Interscope Records, proper, and some of their relases do not not go through Aftermath (ex: D12).

Listen, Raekwon is officially signed to Aftermath Entertainment. This has been confirmed by aftermathmusic.com, sohh.com, and hiphopgame.com, and xxlmag.com. These are all reliable sources. Don't delete his name from the Aftermath roster. He is signed, just as much as G.A.G.E and Ortiz!

If this is true why is Shady Records artists on this page and not G-Unit because Shady is part of the Aftermath family. Throwd Off Click out of Houston should be looked at by one of these great record labels. These young men can be a great investment to some one.

Grammar[edit]

This article is overloaded with horrible grammar. Can someone please correct it?

G-Unit Records Roster[edit]

(moved from the main page by FuriousFreddy)

"If someone would please take the time to investigate this:- http://www.interscope.com/artists/. All artists of g-unit are solely signed to g-unit and interscope the only member of aftermath from g-unit is 50 cent.and fred out of cameron texas

PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE EDITING G-UNIT ARE SIGNED TO INTERSCOPE!

source:- http://www.interscope.com/artists/."

This is the last time to said[edit]

Keep all opinions and all other uncomfirmed statements toward 50 Cent, The Game, The Black Wall Street, G-Unit, Shady Records and as well as Aftermath Entertainment to the talk page. These opinions and bad grammar mistakes make the article look bad and not resourcable. As far as I concerned, I still see Shyne is still on Def Jam, Charlie Baltimore is still a part of Murder Inc, G-Unit is under Aftermath Entertainment, and your facts are not to be added unless you find the right source such as Aftermath Music, AllHipHop, SOHH, Aftermath Entertainment, MTV, BET, etc.... You keep changing it to this and you could be blocked! Thanks for your cooperation. LILVOKA 14 December 2005.

What's with all these other rosters?[edit]

Black Wall Street is not distributed through either Interscope or Aftermath. They dont even have a distribution deal. Furthurmore, Shady Records and G-Unit Records are not distributed through Aftermath. Not to mention that all of these labels have their own pages with the same roster information. Linking to thse labels would be appropriate but to list all of these artists as if they were part of Aftermath Entertainment is ridiculous. A list of former artists is also a nessecisity to provide a history of the label. —Preceding unsigned comment added by DanShoryu (talkcontribs)

I got another question about the Aftermath/Interscope setup. The way it is, is Aftermath just for show and Eminem and Dre are essentially signed to Interscope, or is there a difference between "owned by Interscope" and "distributed through Interscope"? I'm curious because there was a similar setup with Roc-a-Fella/Def Jam but Def Jam eventually bought Roc, leading me to believe there might be some difference. Stoned Trey 07:33, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

corrections[edit]

Mike Elizondo doesn't have anything to do with G. Malone, besides some degrees of seperation through The Game. You must be thinking of someone else. Mike Elizondo recently confirmed that he and Dre were in the process of recording Detox. I'm readding him to the producers list. But changing the brief bio, because it was poorly written.

Also, I strongly disagree with these people saying Aftermath Entertainment is a "vanity label." People claiming that it's "just for show" for Eminem and Dr. Dre are mistaking. Aftermath is to Interscope what Death Row was to Interscope. Dr. Dre started the label with a handful of artists, before he even heard of Eminem. Jimmy Iovine has a lot of say in the company, because he runs the parent label. But Aftermath is a seperate entity. There is also a group in Houston Texas called T.O.C a.k.a Throwd Off Click that needs to be picked up by one of these great labels www.ghetorancho.com. They are free agents they have no manger. DanShoryu 04:18, 19 February 2006

WTF?![edit]

I don't get it. How can 50 and Game be still signed to the same label, still be produced by the same producers, and still be beefing? Either the entire G-Unot movement and the whole 50-against-the-world shtick is a massive wool over our eyes, or hell, I don't know. Someone clarify this, please! MOD 04:59, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

They are beefing and they are the same label. It's not that complicated a situation to understand. Dre is not the kind of guy to step in and control everything so there beef is just going on uninterupted.--Ted87 21:14, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Aftermath Rumors[edit]

We can't assume that these albums will come out on the day. Busta Rhymes, The Game, Stat Quo and others are slated to be released in 2006. But if there are any changes to the album date, the internet will provide that. The Big Bang is slated to come out in May. So therefore, The Game's album The Doctor's Advocate is slated to come out on June 6, 2006. That depends on the situation with Busta Rhymes album. I highly doubt the album will be released on that day. People can't assume that these albums come out on the day. The (Game's) debut album was pushed back four times before it's release in 2005. It prevented any oversight between Eminem and 50 Cent's releases.

There are a lot of rumors going around that Bone Thugs N Harmony has signed with Aftermath & Interscope Records. THIS IS NOT TRUE, and that's straight from manager of the group, Steve Lobel.

The BG has signed to Atlantic Records. This is also squashes the so-called G-Unit South issue. G-Unit West, G-Unit Soul, and other so-called G-Unit vanity labels. Just petty rumors.

Mobb Deep are semi-affliated with Aftermath. But they are not signed to the label. Only G-Unit.

Bone Thugs N Harmony is not signed to Aftermath. LILVOKA

BWS Not An Affiliate Label[edit]

The Black Wall Street is not an affiliate label. It, at this time, is not affiliated or distrubted through any other label or other company. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Puffykilled2pac (talkcontribs)

Please do not remove links to usefull resources[edit]

Seems like certain members are too quick to assume external links added by Wiki users are commercial advertising. Here is my message in response to Dan:

Hey Dan, please do not remove links to my Game resource sites. The pictures contained within the gallery and the content on the site such as lyrics are beneficial to users interested in the Game and this is not advertising but serving the purpose of leading users to other resources where they can find more information along with other content that would not be presented in Wikipedia.

It's frustrating having to undo changes when I check to see the links once again removed. Cheers, Tony.

Hope others can understand and refrain from repeatedly removing the links I add.

EDIT: apologies Dan, it's the Aftermath links I'm referring too, not 'The Game' links I mentioned. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.139.48.88 (talkcontribs) 22:51, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

External links should be discussed first on the article's talk page before adding them. A consensus among regular editors of the article should be reached prior to adding it/them to the article. If you wish to add the links, list them here and allow a consensus to be reached. Thanks --AbsolutDan (talk) 02:34, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
The two sites I add but keep having removed by other Wiki users are:
http://www.ShadyGallery.com - A growing Aftermath Entertainment rooster picture gallery
http://www.forum.trshady.com - An active Shady Records and Aftermath Entertainment forum
Both are helpful resources to those interested in Aftermath and Shady Records with many emailing me personally to give thanks and few have mentioned they first found the site from this Wikipedia page. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.138.208.212 (talkcontribs) 08:48, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not here to promote other sites. Your links, although they may contain information on the subject matter, are not so useful that they merit inclusion here. External links should be added sparingly, and only when they contain extensive and valuable information. Lyrics and photos simply do not meet this criteria. Please stop adding the links, especially since they are links to your own website. See point #1 under "How not to be a spammer" in WP:SPAM (Wikipedia spam guidelines). You may wish to also review WP:EL, WP's external links guidelines. --AbsolutDan (talk) 13:10, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
If many visitors to the wikipedia pages find the external links I add as helpful then that certainly warrents inclusion. Part of why wikipedia is so great is the involvement of many users and the information and links it provide (I personally have found many great sites through wiki external links.
Please contact me before removing links I add in future.
Cheers —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.153.174.225 (talkcontribs) 14:26, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
If you look at the history of the articles you have added these links to, I am not the only one removing the links. So far you seem to be the only editor in favor of them, and you shouldn't be adding them anyway since they are your site. Please stop adding them until/unless other regular editors agree that they are useful --AbsolutDan (talk) 14:59, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

There seems to be only you and Lil Vodka who seem to have a problem. The sites are mine and are the only sites I add to the two sections as they are the only two that provide the information (and its why I chose to make the sites, as the contect could not be found elsewhere). They do fit within the rules of Wikipedia and please do not continue removing my links which are far from spam and useful to wiki visitors.

PS: I've added the links to two articles, both of which are directly related. Thanks —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.137.170.55 (talkcontribs) 15:06, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

They are spam, because you run the site. Adding links to sites that you run is bad form here, and is considered by most to be spamming. Please review the 2 guidelines I provided above --AbsolutDan (talk) 15:08, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
I understand that they can be seen as spam but that is your perception and I am adding the links as it is proven that these are of great help to wiki users and I've come to realize that the majority of Wiki editors will not accept that sites other then those that are official can be helpful. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.137.170.55 (talkcontribs) 15:11, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has become circular. Unless new points are raised or comments are added by other parties, I will not add anything further, and will treat further link insertions as simple vandalism (spamming). --AbsolutDan (talk) 16:39, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

What happened to innocent till proven guilty? The links are helpful to many visitors (who have personally told me) so that is clear evidence that you are wrongly removing the links which are far from spam (I do not sell any products, the only text advert links present do not cover hosting costs so I do not make money from it). I'm here to help people, you seem to be doing the opposite. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.139.51.186 (talkcontribs) 17:38, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Lil Kim on Aftermath?[edit]

Please show proof and a source that Lil Kim actually signed to Aftermath Records. Thanks. Darkneonflame 02:29, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

Who keeps deleting the producer list?[edit]

This list is just as pertinent as the artist roster. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.156.39.228 (talkcontribs)

G.A.G.E. left Aftermath[edit]

G.A.G.E. offcially left i think today (March 15) it in the interview on aftermath website. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.117.189.77 (talk) 19:54, 15 March 2007 (UTC).

Eve[edit]

Eve's still signed to Aftermath. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hurricaneshady (talkcontribs)

M. White[edit]

Is M. White really assoated with Aftermath Entertainment? The ip address that added it seems to enjoy droping M. Whites name every where with out any other referance except the myspace link. This could be a self promtion thing. I am not knolageable able about Aftermath Entertainment. If any one knows M white is not a part of Aftermath Entertainment please remove his name from the table. I left it thier in good faith, since I don't know either way. R00m c 20:07, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

It's just bullshit. I removed it. --- Realest4Life 20:11, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

King Tee[edit]

Wasn't his Thy Kingdom Come album originally a failed Aftermath Entertainment release? => Harish - 11:17, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

It was never released, it was shelved, then Dr. Dre let King Tee release the material he recorded in 2002, but NOT on Aftermath Entertainment, because King Tee left after his project was shelved. It's not an AFTERMATH release, because it was never released ON Aftermath. --- Who's the one you call Mr. Macho? The head honcho, swift fist like Camacho 14:31, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

Artists questions.[edit]

Are there any sources for Slim the Mobster, Nicky Grier, and Hittman? As far as I know, Hittman is a former artist. Should there be tables for the producers and former artists? And lastly, if we have a "joint artists" section, should the also be listed in the "current artists" section? --JpGrB 19:57, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

I personally feel that the Artists section isn't suitable, there's no reason why joint artists shouldn't simply be with Artists, separating them does not make the article any more improved. Furthermore, a brief description of each artist is helpful as it sums up their artists in one neat box, as oppose to looking around different articles to learn more. I actually preferred the section when it was like this, though it was understandably removed due to weasel words and lack of sources. It should be brought back if even kept small and referenced, for the encyclopaedic sake of it. Just my opinion. -- Harish - 16:33, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

Joel Ortiz[edit]

it says joel ortiz is a former artist. im sure he's only just recently signed to aftermath and im sure he is still on the label. can someone check it out. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Siwhat (talkcontribs) 07:49, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

He got dropped within the last few months. --JpGrB 10:18, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Focus[edit]

Focus has released an album now, so should he be considered an artist too? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.164.85.197 (talk) 23:11, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Group Therapy[edit]

It says Group Therapy were a group signed to Aftermath. Is it possible Group Therapy were just a one off and never actually signed to any label?

Busta Rhymes.[edit]

At this moment, I haven't had a chance to actually check anything else out yet, but last I heard, Busta Rhymes was only rumored to have gotten dropped. If I'm mistaken please correct me. --JpGrB 01:19, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Now it's stated on AftermathMusic.com, but is this a reliable source? --JpGrB 18:55, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

Is Raekwon signed on Aftermath? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.134.85.87 (talk) 19:25, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

Official website.[edit]

Which is the official website of Aftermath? This is the site from the infobox. Yet this page is the one in the "external links" section listed as the "official website". Which is the correct one so we can list properly? --JpGrB 04:24, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

Bishop gone.[edit]

Well, AllHipHop reports it, but doesn't cite anyone? No word from Dre, Aftermath, or eve Lamont. I'm not gonna touch it as to avoid 3RR, but I don't think it's true. If nothing more has really come out within 24 hours, I'm probably gonna change it back, but still put in the history section that it's been reported. --HELLØ ŦHERE 00:48, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

8 Mile OST[edit]

This wasn't released on Aftermath so should be removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.24.249.168 (talk) 22:53, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

check out gorrila tactics on myspace, the uk version, there skill is on a different level —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.2.79.82 (talk) 09:46, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

Former Artists[edit]

How come Hittman isn't on there, he signed 1999 was all over The Chronic 2001 but left the label in 2001. How come when i added his name to former artists it was removed?

Siwhat (talk) 00:18, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Did it have a source? --HELLØ ŦHERE 17:39, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

I had a similiar problem. I tried to add The Firm to the former artists list, and it immediately got removed (and yes I had a reference to back it up) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.17.200.34 (talk) 20:02, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

It has to be a reliable source. --HELLØ ŦHERE 20:11, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

i had a source for Hittman leaving the label, it was an ariticle on Rakim leaving Aftermath but it also made reference to Hittman leaving Aftermath as well but it was just deleted anyway. its hard to find an entire article talking about Hittman leaving aftermath on the internet because it was a while ago. i assume it must be the same for The Firm too, but i mean everyone knows those people were on Aftermath, Hittman was on almost every single song on 2001. 125.238.8.83 (talk) 05:38, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

Eminem Production[edit]

I think that Eminem should have a spot in the Producers list because he has contributed on enough records to be considered an Aftermath producer. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Maxzoi (talkcontribs) 01:16, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Dr. Dre has produced for Lloyd Banks, Tony Yayo, D12, and numerous others on other labels, does that mean he is to be considered a "Shady producer" or "G-Unit producer"? Some people are signed as producers, much like Kanye West used to be, some are just signed as artists. Is there a source which confirms Eminem as a signed Aftermath producer? --HELLØ ŦHERE 01:20, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Future albums[edit]

WP:FUTURE is pretty clear: "Individual scheduled or expected future events should only be included if the event is notable and almost certain to take place." Certainly "you'll probably hear something in a year or so" [1] fails WP:FUTURE, even for a project that hasn't been in production for six years. Second, a missed 2009 release date [2] isn't a reliable source for a 2010 release date, even if the 2009 date is documented. (Thank you for citing it, though; I adore reliable footnotes.) Hence, both projects are in limbo, at least from an academic/encyclopedic perspective. Yappy2bhere (talk) 19:54, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes, but the very next sentence states "If preparation for the event is not already in progress, speculation about it must be well documented.". Prep for both albums are already in progress. Detox has been slated for release since 2004. It has an article. It's not as if he mentioned "I'm working on an album" and then just kept saying numerous times "it's coming". It seems that that's all that's happened, but it obviously isn't. The album's article has provided numerous sources where it was ready, then scrapped, and ready, then scrapped, etc. The Detox page itself has been up for AFD due to someone citing CRYSTAL, yet it has failed. All of those things should be taken into account. And with the Relapse 2 album, almost the same thing has happened. Eminem has stated he pushed back the release date also. They are both "almost certain to take place" as has been stated, numerous times. --HELLØ ŦHERE 20:15, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
"Obviously"? It's not obvious at all. After six years pass, all the artist can say is "don't call us, we'll call you." That's not a release date, fuzzy or otherwise. And, if "Eminem has stated he pushed back the release date," you should cite a source to support that. The source you've cited makes no such claim. Yappy2bhere (talk) 20:32, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Please see the album's page. There are numerous sources which state there has been work. The current, provided source, is for the release, which he states will be in 2011. It is sourced, reliably. Also, with the Eminem source, I don't understand how:
means 'no such claim'? --HELLØ ŦHERE 20:39, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
A non-commital "next year" is no more definite than "soon" or "whenever" as a release date. That's the same logic that's had you singing Tomorrow for six years while waiting for the Dre release. Certainly you can demonstrate that they're ongoing projects, but you can't date the release until you can demonstrate a release date with a reliable source. Yappy2bhere (talk) 22:35, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Except they are reliable sources. Are you a fan of Star Trek? The sequel to the 2009 Star Trek film has been slated for release recently. June 29, 2009. Wanna hear something funny? The film hasn't even been written, let alone produced. But we note it here on Wikipedia. We have it sourced, by Paramount, the writers, producers, etc. But it isn't even written. It's the same logic. It's being worked on, and it's scheduled, just not completed. --HELLØ ŦHERE 23:17, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Also, you've even stated that they are upcoming which is exactly as they're labeled on the page. IT seems as though you'd be wanting to nominate them for AFD, per no solid release date. But even you yourself have noted that they are upcoming, and they're obviously cited with reliable sources (sources which check out per guidelines), which, being the case, I don't see why we're even discussing this? --HELLØ ŦHERE 23:24, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Pointing out that worse examples exist is no argument at all. What I've said is that these presumptive release dates aren't confirmed by reliable sources. I have not said that these are upcoming releases. What I said was that the projects clearly exist but that the release dates in this article aren't supported by sources. I also pointed out Dre's project as an object lesson in why "later" is not a substitute. You can't claim 2011 as the release date because Dre hasn't claimed 2011 as the release date. When he does, add the date and cite it, but not before. Yappy2bhere (talk) 00:19, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

How are they not reliable sources? They clearly follow the guidelines. And I hate to use the "OSE" thing again, but we use both of those sites in other articles. In a 2010 interview, he said "next year" which clearly translates into 2011. Unless my math is wrong. And, regarding a 2009 interview, Eminem states "next year" which clearly translates into 2010. again, unless my math is wrong. And, as I've said since this discussion began, they are reliable sources. --HELLØ ŦHERE 01:04, 23 January 2010 (UTC) If those two albums are notable enough for articles, they are notable enough to be included here. That's a definite for Detox, but I'm personally iffy about Relapse 2. Andrewlp1991 (talk) 01:26, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Agreed, it doesn't make sense to keep those articles yet not have them listed here. It doesn't violate WP:CRYSTAL. They should stay. Spellcast (talk) 15:35, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Hittman Added To List[edit]

I added Hittman to the list and here's the source showing clearly that he was on Aftermath Entertainment and left the label.

here is the source:

http://www.dubcnn.com/interviews/hittman/

i'm writing this here coz some jackass keeps taking him off. So please read the source and see for yourself that he joined the label in 1999 and left in 2001.

Siwhat (talk) 06:14, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Do you suppose it's the same jackass who cites sources on the Talk page instead of in the article? Yappy2bhere (talk) 07:06, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Raekwon on Aftermath?!?[edit]

Raekwon is NOT a current Aftermath artist and NEVER released an album on Aftermath. Change it and stop the disinformation! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.181.214.76 (talk) 14:03, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Why are there so many mentions of it on teh intarwebs then? Somebody added that, and I googled up some results supporting it (instead of just reverting the unsourced addition, as I was inclined to). Do you consider the source in this article wrong, or unreliable? (He could easily be "former", for all I know. And I don't know which album he's supposed to have put out with them.)— JohnFromPinckney (talk) 00:00, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

Lawsuit[edit]

I read on the Eminem page that he sued Apple and Aftermath. That seems like a pretty important thing to include in the article.

Unfortunately, I'm having problems finding a reliable source. Here are some conflicting arguments I have found:

"Eminem sued Universal Music Group (not aftermath or apple)" from Aftermath Blog http://www.aftermathmusic.com/blog/?p=374 "Eminem sued Apple and nobody else" http://www.macobserver.com/tmo/article/apple_lawsuit_express_eminem_vs._apple_trial_begins/ "Eminem AND Aftermath Sued Apple" http://www.cultofmac.com/eminem-apple-settle-out-of-court/17847 "Eminem's Publisher is suing Aftermath and Apple" http://www.theage.com.au/technology/biz-tech/eminems-claim-of-shady-itunes-deal-20090923-g1ad.html

98.127.168.159 (talk) 06:44, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Something about Game[edit]

PLEASE NOT GAME IS NOT EVEN SIGNED TO AFTERMATH ENTERTAINMENT. CHECK IT OUT ON GOOGLE ETC. HE HAS A JOINT VENTURE WITH INTERSCOPE AND DPG RECORDS. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.13.15.252 (talk) 21:20, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Black hippy (as a group) is on Aftermath[edit]

For those of you who have been editing this article saying that only Kendrick is signed to Aftermath and not his group, Black Hippy, well I got something to say to YOU: if you've read the sources correctly they say that Black Hippy is signed to Aftermath AS A GROUP, but the solo releases of the other group members will be handled by Top Dawg and Interscope (Jay Rock being handled by Strange Music and the other two labels)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!--Supergamer345 (talk) 22:59, 7 April 2012 (UTC)

I co-sign this.

Raekwon never signed[edit]

he was about to sign but the contract didn't materialize. source: http://www.xxlmag.com/news/latest-headlines/2009/04/raekwon-talks-aftermath-deal-busta-rhymes’-decision-to-leave/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.177.65.194 (talk) 14:30, 6 July 2012 (UTC)

Trevor Lawrence Jr.?[edit]

I have looked over the article and the talk page, and unless I missed it, I see no reference whatsoever to Mr. Lawrence, so why the redirect? Jusdafax 18:36, 16 July 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 16 October 2013[edit]

Jon Connor from flint michigan was recently signed to aftermath records by dr.dre 71.205.208.177 (talk) 18:25, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. --Stfg (talk) 18:40, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

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Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 07:03, 12 December 2017 (UTC)