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about and eariler AFD

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The deletion debate Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Christopher Clayton referred to an article which bears no resemblance to this article. This article should NOT be deleted based on that earlier debate. Jon513 (talk) 19:41, 20 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

SL/ GL

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I've tried to draw in the point about transfer to the General List, and the implications but the transfer needs cited. The RN employment regulations are in a restricted handbook, so not easily referencable and anything that would have been public domain in the 70's would be ephemera.

Do we have any indication of when he attended Staff course, presumably at Greenwich based on his promotion dates unless he did the sideways walking one at Bracknell, and the HCSC, which again looking at promotion dates he probably did at Camberley.

Do we have any indication of any command appointments? PCE would have allowed him a ship command or a squadron command, he must have done one or other. If he stayed typed to Lynx then that would have been at Portland if he crossed over it could have been at Culdrose, Gannet or Yeovilton. If someone can find that out then it's be useful to include his PCE, otherwise it's pretty incidental, almost every Lt Cdr in the warfare branch has done that.

There is a promotion date missing, by the time he got RAdm the Cdres rank was substantive, so he should have gone through that rank at some stage, plus the fact from the dates given he would have served as a Captain beyond the six year limit on half stars.

ALR (talk) 11:55, 22 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The other promotions must be in the gazette somewhere, problem is that pre-2000 it's all based on scans of the original issues, using Optical Character Recognition to get back an electronic version of the text. This process is prone to errors which means names can be hard to find in searches - coupled with the fact that the RN is very inconsistent over how it reports names, and doesn't use service numbers (and the fact that the 1998 Gazettes are not fully online may also be a factor). The only additional info I've been able to find is that he seems to be involved in RN skiing http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/server?show=ConMediaFile.28097&outputFormat=print David Underdown (talk) 12:22, 22 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
aha:
So he would appear to be a Commodore by 2000, and was still holding the same post in 2003. However, searching the Times archives finds him listed as FOSF(?) from 1/4/02
As a captain he seems to have commanded HMS Chatham (F87) during the handover of Hong Kong.
FOSF was Flag Officer Surface Flotilla, I'd have thought it would have been more likely he would have been FOSF staff as they transitioned to become Fleet Command around that time. COMNA became a FLEET post at some point when AOC 3Gp ceased to exist, so it might have transitioned to FOSF first. I was OC of a Signals Squadron at the time so a bit detached from things.
CO of Chatham would be right, in terms of timing, so he must have had something as a Commander as well. Chatham would have been Captain of one of the Frigate Squadrons at the time, that would be on bridge cards, which are probably ephemera again but possibly held by the Naval Museum.
ALR (talk) 13:17, 22 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wow guys you sure have been busy! You navy bodds have far surpassed my knowledge in this subject, please add it all to the article, it's gonna look great! ;) Ryan4314 (talk) 17:21, 22 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

How do you guys do it? I met him at our reunion in Cardiff 2002 and at that time he was a Commodore and he was about to take command of HMS Ocean with the rank of Captain. I had an email from Rear Admiral Harris a couple of years ago and he informed me that Clayton was in charge of the fleet air arm - an appointment we knew to be FONA (Flag Officer Naval Aviation)- and was based at HMS Heron (Yeovilton). As far as I know he never converted to the Sea King, I have only known pilots convert from Sea King to Lynx. Keep up the good work.Griffiths911 (talk) 08:05, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Does this help: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/devon/2942212.stmGriffiths911 (talk) 08:44, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes that is useful - I didn't think to search for Chris Clayton as well as Christoper (doh). David Underdown (talk) 08:47, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Hmmm I can see that you guys are not gonna let me get away with dumping this article on you lol. I'll add the new stuff in, but you guys will probably wanna C/E it. Ryan4314 (talk) 11:14, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hang on, something's not right here; This means he went from being a Captain on Chatham in 97, got promoted to the Commodore Naval Aviation (that's the new name for FONA Ken, says in the Navy News ref), got demoted to be the captain of Ocean, then skipped 2 ranks upto Rear Admiral just a year later!

Does this sound wrong, or does the navy change ur rank to fit ur role willy nilly? i.e. lets say for instance that captain is the highest rank that can command a ship (I don't actually know if that's the case), would they bump u down then so u could command it? Coz Ocean is quite a unique significant ship... Ryan4314 (talk) 11:51, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Oh n bonus points to whoever finds out what he was doing during Gulf 1, we know he was a commander at the time. He probably didn't go to the Gulf anyway (only something like 3 ships went didn't they?), but it would be nice to clarify in the article. Ryan4314 (talk) 11:59, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, my computer at work blocks me from entering many sites including Navy News and I will not be online at home till next month. It is quite normal for a Commodore to relinquish that rank for a large ship command. Most Commodore appointments (ratings have drafts officers are appointed) are shore jobs and unless the officer in that appointment makes a real 'hash' of it he will be appointed to command a carrier size ship with the rank of Captain. If he doesn't 'hash' that up he will be (in most cases) promoted to Rear Admiral. All the Rear Admirals I can remember had carrier sized ships as Captains before being promoted to Rear Admiral from that rank. Our Chris would most likely have had command of a frigate or destroyer shortly after his promotion to Commander then another command as a Captain, say as a frigate squadron leader, does anyone know if he was squadron leader in HMS Chatham. I may have the terminology slightly wrong, it may have the word 'flotilla' somewhere in there.Griffiths911 (talk) 14:28, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Aghh! ARL has already mentioned the squadron leader bit. It's difficult concentrating at work on this stuff. LOL.Griffiths911 (talk) 14:56, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Assessment

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Still start for now, though it is close to B. There is still a citation needed tag, the WP:LEAD is very small, and needs to be more representative of the article, and overall, it just seems a bit short and lacking full information. Any information on action between 1998 and 2003? Can the Falklands actions be expanded a little bit? If sources cannot be found, then I can accept that, but I don't think it would reach GA at this length, loathe as I am to character count. Regards. Woody (talk) 21:53, 30 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That's cool, I couldn't be arsed to push for GA anyways. Can this still become a B with that citation tag? P.S. Between '98 - '03 he was the CONMA. Ryan4314 (talk) 23:57, 30 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

With regards Admiral Claytons promotion from Captain to Rear Admiral. The first set of Captains appointed to OCEAN were all Commodores, but they were reverted to Local Acting Captain whilst in Command of OCEAN. Admiral Johnston - Burt was the first one to annotate the bridge list with Cdre (Local-Acting Captain), whilst he was in Command of OCEAN. Admral Clayton took over command of Ocean on the return home from Telic. It was Admiral Sir Adrian Johns who was in command of OCEAN throughout TELIC. Admiral Johns left OCEAN in SAHLALA, as the ship was homeward bound. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.30.148.100 (talk) 16:24, 4 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

command

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to answer your questions he was the commanding officer of H.M.S Beaver as a commander — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jc2803 (talk • contribs) 09:57, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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