Talk:Govigama

Dispute

This is nothing but Karavan propaganda and is written from a point of view to denigrate the Govigama caste. If this does not become a neutral article, this should be deleted.Bandara2000 13:08, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Please explain the above allegation

The entry under Govigama appears to be fully referenced to authentic Sri lankan sources. I do not see anything about the Karava in it. Why do you say it is Karava propaganda and why do you say it is unreferenced ?

The depths to which individuals descend and even sacrifice their personal integrity to promote the ‘Govi Supremacy Myth’ continues to surprise me. The malicious tagging of this page with all possible tags to discredit it is one such example. As usual no evidence to the contrary is given.

The ‘Govi Supremacy Myth’ is almost always promoted through intimidation, repetition or stealth. Never have I seen any reliable evidence from such promoters to support their Govi Supremacy Myth. The oldest evidence produced in it’s support is only from the 19th century and that too written by or influenced by Govigama arrivistes themselves.

If the present pushers of the theory have any evidence at all to prove that the Govi caste was indeed the high caste that they claim it was in the Sri Lankan feudal system, and not a low caste, they should include such evidence here for the benefit of our users. If there is no evidence to support the Govi Supremacy Theory, the promoter of the theory should withdraw it and desist from further vandalism of this page.

Tag rationale

‘’ Social divisions arose over the centuries between those engaged in agriculture and those engaged in nonagricultural occupations. The Govi (cultivators) belonged to the highest Sinhalese caste (Goyigama) and remained so in the late twentieth century. All Sri Lankan heads of state have, since independence, belonged to the Goyigama caste, as do about half of all Sinhalese. The importance of cultivation on the island is also reflected in the caste structure of the Hindu Tamils, among whom the Vellala (cultivator) is the highest caste’’[1]

‘’ Government (from Sri Lanka) Kingship was the unifying political institution in the classical ... Administrative officials were drawn from the Govi caste’’[2] The caste system in Sri Lanka developed its own characteristics. ... The Govi (cultivators) belonged to the highest Sinhalese caste (Goyigama) and remained [3] Seminal study on contemporary Sri Lankan Sinhalese society by Michel Roberts mentions Govi dominance, historic and current [4] Professor Gananath Obeyesekerehe treatment of ordinary farmer (govigama) caste in many parts of the Sinhala country [5].

Hence this currently non neutral article should be edited taking into acount WP:NPOV. It should be edited taking into account all point of view including the Karave caste members and other historic assertion of Govi as lower caste but only as a minor point of view because the consensus of all modern ‹The template Talkfact is being considered for merging.›  credible anthropologists and historians is that Govi have always ‹The template Talkfact is being considered for merging.›  dominated the Sinhalese society. That is what anyone will read in any encyclopedia that is not based a castist narrow collection of non credible biased sources. If this is not done within a reasonable amount of time then I propose that this article should be tagged for AFD and at least then it will get the attention of other editors to a perennial problem that Wikipedia faces with respect to [[caste[[ related articles in which each caste affiliates trying to impose their myth and views on the rest of the world. This particular attempt so far is under the radar screen because Sri Lanka is a small country without many editors. Removing the current tags without justification when the whole article seems to be not neutral, based on original research not backed by credible sources and under dispute will be considered Vandalism and the remover has been thus warned. Thanks Bandara2000 21:55, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

User [6], stop your vandalism

The references given by you above are all from secondary sources. Furthermore secondary sources with outdated information

Before it was debunked in the 1990s, the ‘Govi Supremacy Myth’ was, and still is, actively promoted by interested individuals. Such individuals have managed to get it incorporated into many modern publications of unsuspecting authors and onto public domains as you are now attempting to do. The frequent repetition of the ‘Govi Supremacy Myth’ or the ‘Vellala Supremacy Myth’ which appears to be of greater importance to you, does not turn the myth into fact. It may appear on endless web sites but no historical evidence has yet been produced to validate it.

Sri Lanka is a country with over 2000 years of written history. Therefore if, as you say, the above references are selective, you should be able to produce at least some evidence from Sri Lanka’s pre-colonial history to contradict the above facts.

Although the above facts are not to your liking, they are from authentic Sri lankan historical manuscripts. The authenticity of the quoted sources have never been in doubt and they have been edited and published by several eminent scholars. The historically low status of the Govi caste as evidenced in these sources has never been contradicted so far by any other historical sources.

If you have any evidence, anything at all, to contradict the above quoted historical references and re-establish your myth, please state it here. Childishly deleting the referenced information on this page merely because you have a different point of view (albeit with no historical justification so far) amounts to blatant vandalism. --Veri 13:31, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Civility

Civility

Stop personal attack see WP:Personal Attack

All done above. Now that everything is said and done, I will start editing this page. Thanks

Need credible citations

Show evidence of deleting any content from your creation in this page ?

Backwards copy

This is among several pages from which content seems to have been taken without attribution by karava.org. Although there is considerable overlap between the content of this page and the content of theirs, here's evidence of natural evolution of that content here and here. --Moonriddengirl ^(talk) 14:56, 30 August 2010

about hon. d.s senanayake family

hon. d.s senanayake family not a govigama cast he is a bodhi vamsha cast ( bodhi vamsha cast also one of highest cast in the past sri lanka but after 1815 not beacouse domination of govigama cast.)

References

This article is ridiculous. Paragraphs upon paragraphs of text with zero citations. I'm tagging, and getting rid of the completely uncited list of people. --snowolfD4 ^{( talk / @ )} 21:19, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

My quick count found seventeen (17) proper parenthetical citations, in addition to the eight footnotes to six sources. How many of those did you find? WhatamIdoing (talk) 01:12, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

Let's see. One citation in the "history" section, zero citations for the "rise of" section, one citation for the "current political power" section, one citation for the "religious power" section. --snowolfD4 ^{( talk / @ )} 18:17, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

This page is about Govigama. Not about Radala. Some of the Editors trying to use this page to show the supremacy of Radala over the Govigama in this page. Radala is not a castle with good reputation. Radala post received by two parties. First Nayakkara's. Some people get Radala posts for chosing a Nayakkara king over son of Last Sinhala king for the next king. Story of the later Radala is not differ much. They granted Radala posts to get support from locals who were much closer. But Radala came to exist after Nayakkara came to the trone. All the children of previous kings (All sinhala kings) were belonged to the highest castle in the society. That was "Govigama". --Himesh84 (talk) 10:42, 8 August 2012 (UTC)

according to mahavamsha there are no any kings from Govigama cast .. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 103.247.50.155 (talk) 21:30, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Saradiyel, Kshateria you mentioning must be kings family. Sri Lanka's caste order started with Govi,..... But king was above to all others. So it was like King, Govi,.... not like Kshateria,Govi,.. Kings consort had to be daughter of any other ruling kings. If only one king ruled whole Sri Lanka,consort was bought from South India. But there wasn't a caste called Kshateria in Sri Lanka. Kings didn't married to a daughters of previous kings (according to your clarification - daughter from so called Kshateria caste) . Sri Lanka currently don't have such a caste and Sri Lanka never had a caste called Kshateria. If so even last king were deported, Kshateria caste must be continued. Because every king had lot of wives and children. Do you have any reference about Kshateria families currently in Sri Lanka. So be constructive. --Himesh84 (talk) 05:54, 12 August 2012 (UTC)

Saradiyel trying to ruin this page with information of Radala to show supremacy of Radala. Do it in Radala page rather in this page. Sri Lanka never had a caste called Kshateria. Please referenced Kshateria families currently live in Sri Lanka. Before Nayake dynasty started ruling Lanka, 3 previous Kandyan Sinhalese kings married to South Indian queens. Few of the children might be given Radala status but rest of all children are not Radala. They are govigama. > Himesh is noted for vandalism, follow his contribution to ethnic conflict of SL Anyone can report any thing. Please also add the final result of the discussion to your comment on next time. I removed the sentence stating "the claim that most of the Govi caste .... " . There is no such a claim. It is a joke. Who creating those non existing claims. I am live in Sri Lanka and never heard about such a claim. Please reference the claim. Saradiyel has added some reference materials but I removed them from this page. The facts he trying to show belongs to Radala page. He trying to ruin this page to show Radala supremacy appeared in later stages of Kingdom of Kandy. He has forgot govi supremacy in two thousands years (from king Devanampiyatissa (250Bc) to 1700 BC (Nayakkara comes to trone) and showing his ill mind to talk things happened in less than 100 (1739 to 1815) years of Nayakkar rule --Himesh84 (talk) 09:52, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

To saradiyel Yes. It is unreliable source. Sri Lanka is a Buddhist country. Bamunu are priest in Hinduism. There are no relationship to a Buddhist society. Also there is no Kshteria caste in Sri Lanka. If so please give reference about currently live Kshteria. What ever Radala things should go to Radala page. Not in here. Insulting is not on what they do. Insulting comes when it says Govi trying to equal to kings. But none of the Govi cares in the statement made by government except other caste. I am not hate the outcome. I am trying to stop people fighting over caste. If you want I can give how the Radala come to exists. They were Govi but received higher status for service done to Nayakkaras. Last Sinhala king had a son. But officers in the court at that time had decided to import Nayak prince. Then new king gave opportunity to get higher status in society by administrating areas. If they didn't select foreign king for private gains still we may have a king/queen. Also they are the people who Sign to the Kandyan convention with British to hand over Sri Lanka to the British. English also selected a new Radala to encourage service to them. Now you must understand who needs to shame.--Himesh84 (talk) 11:04, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

Kshateria Brahmin Myth

This page has lot of errors. It talk about two caste which ""Sri Lanka"" never had. Ksheteria and Brahmin. It is very much clear Buddhist country couldn't have a caste called Brahmin(Hindu priests). Second Ksheteria myth. Sri Lankan caste start with King. Some people have misunderstood difference between king and kshateria(India). In India king belongs to kshateria and king should married to kshateria princess. But Sri Lanka never had kshateria. So king had to married to a daughter/sister of a ruling king. If there were only one king, consort was imported from South India. If kshateria was there no needed to import royalist from south India. Also some people clarification of Wimaladarmasuriya I is a Brahmin, Brahmin had authority to rule is a nonconstructive sentence. Wimaladarmasuriya is forcefully married Kusumasana devi who was heir to the Throne of Kandy. That's how Wimaladarmasuriya came to throne. After Wimaladarmasuriya's dead Senerath also married to Kusumasana devi who had 2 children from Wimaladarmasuriya. It was norm that king's brother should be next king. It is very much evident Wimaladarmasuriya/Senerat didn't came from royal blood line( Kshateria or Brahmin caste). What they had was they were married to heir of the Kandy throne. If Senerat didn't marry to Kusumasana devi he will not be the king even he was brother of the Wimaladarmasuriya. --Himesh84 (talk) 06:30, 20 August 2012 (UTC)

Sri Lanka did have Brahmins - numerous reference is made to Bramins (sinhala- Bamuna) therefore it is incorrect to say that Brahmins didn't exist in Sri Lanka! Also by marrying a daughter of a ruling monarch doesn't it mean they are nmarrying Kshatriya caste women! Vijaya was an Aryan - I'm sure he knew and followed this Caste system as all evidence is in favour that he was raised in it! Didn't Devanampiyatissa have a second coronation in the Kshathriya Tradition on Ashoka's advice? Yes! This means that Kshatriya has been an established concept throughout the history of Ceylon — Preceding unsigned comment added by 61.245.163.24 (talk) 08:19, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

Disastrous article

This article is a complete mess. I am currently unable to edit as a logged-in user but should be able to do so before much longer. When I can, I'll be taking a hatchet to the thing based on my experience of dealing with Indian caste articles. Let's say, that gives people a fortnight or so to attempt to source things, remove the puffery etc.

Obviously, I'll do some research before cutting back but I am already fairly sure that much of the content has no chance of decent verification.--2.219.218.79 (talk) 02:39, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

The article is a mess. I will try to clean it according to wikipedia standards. Xenani (talk) 12:03, 21 September 2019 (UTC)

Don't worry I have edited the page with reliable references from

• Maha Vansha - Ven. Mahanama
• Deepa Vansha
• Janavansha- Ven Buddha Rakshita, 15 th century
• Sadhdharma Rathnavali
• Poojavali
• Mandārampura Puvata (C.17th century)
• Prof.Pranavithana 1970 (The Celebrated Archaeologist)
• The dictionary of the proverbs of Sinhalese - John M Senevirathna 1936
• Dutch Thombos van Seylan (Dutch records of Ceylon), Dutch Governorate of Ceylon 1640-1796
• An Historical Relation of the Island Ceylon-Robert Knox, English sea captain in the service of the British East India Company.1681
• Cordiner-1807
• The caste of Sinhalese From Ancient Times to the Present Day- Asiff Hussein B.A. (Social Sciences) PGr.Dip (Archaeology)
• An account of the interior of the Ceylon - John Davy, 1821(John Davy (1790-1868) was an English doctor and brother of the celebrated chemist Sir Humphrey Davy.)
• Notes and Queries. The Taprobanian. Dec.1885 - Hugh Nevil
• Indid race - Humanphenotypes.com (http://Humanphenotypes.com)
• Unambuve parapura, a manuscript written around the 16th or 17th century and found by Hugh Nevill in the village of Unambuve (BMOM 6605)
• Purāna sāmpradāyika kalundā ga� koṭuva in Aitihāsika Mātale (1984)
• Family genealogies in the study of pre-colonial Kandyan society and Polity. K.P.Vimaladharma. JRAASL. 2000

Joshua Nazareth (talk) 03:03, 11 October 2019 (UTC)

External links modified

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The last edit to this page

I have noticed that the information in this page have been distorted by numerous people at least for 10 years since 2009 based on their personal views.

As a Scholar of Archaeology and Anthropology I have edited the page with reliable information from the references given below. Hope that no one will distort the page again.

• Maha Vansha - Ven. Mahanama
• Deepa Vansha
• Janavansha- Ven Buddha Rakshita, 15 th century
• Sadhdharma Rathnavali
• Poojavali
• Mandārampura Puvata (C.17th century)
• Prof.Pranavithana 1970 (The Celebrated Archaeologist)
• The dictionary of the proverbs of Sinhalese - John M Senevirathna 1936
• Dutch Thombos van Seylan (Dutch records of Ceylon), Dutch Governorate of Ceylon 1640-1796
• An Historical Relation of the Island Ceylon-Robert Knox, English sea captain in the service of the British East India Company.1681
• Cordiner-1807
• The caste of Sinhalese From Ancient Times to the Present Day- Asiff Hussein B.A. (Social Sciences) PGr.Dip (Archaeology)
• An account of the interior of the Ceylon - John Davy, 1821(John Davy (1790-1868) was an English doctor and brother of the celebrated chemist Sir Humphrey Davy.)
• Notes and Queries. The Taprobanian. Dec.1885 - Hugh Nevil
• Indid race - Humanphenotypes.com (http://Humanphenotypes.com)
• Unambuve parapura, a manuscript written around the 16th or 17th century and found by Hugh Nevill in the village of Unambuve (BMOM 6605)
• Purāna sāmpradāyika kalundā ga� koṭuva in Aitihāsika Mātale (1984)
• Family genealogies in the study of pre-colonial Kandyan society and Polity. K.P.Vimaladharma. JRAASL. 2000 Joshua Nazareth (talk) 03:01, 11 October 2019 (UTC)

Xenani is Distorting the page based on his or her biased mindset

No one should be abled to delete or hide the historical facts that I have added to this page based on the research of Dr.Asiff Hussein's caste of Sri Lanka . Joshua Nazareth (talk) 02:15, 13 October 2019 (UTC)

You need yo go through the list of reliable sources that I have given in the talks under "The last edit to this page" Joshua Nazareth (talk) 02:24, 13 October 2019 (UTC)

Your version, [7], did not seem to follow wikipedian guidelines. I clearly stated in my edit, [8], why your edit was reverted. To make it more clear, make yourself familiar with the wikipedia policies: WP:CS, WP:NPOV, WP:OR, WP:TONE and WP:RS. Xenani (talk) 11:20, 13 October 2019 (UTC)

Thanks ,I understood it Joshua Nazareth (talk) 08:29, 14 October 2019 (UTC)

Substantial editing need

This article is not adhering to WP:NEUTRAL at all and has significant shortcomings with regards to structure and content. I understand that caste is a very contentious topic, but it would be great to not use Wikipedia as a platform for targetted attacks against any groups of people. Uvants (talk) 09:45, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

E.g.: The article posits: "They were from lowest position in the existing caste hierarchy in South India who landed and settled the county over." The source used for this is [9] which mentions no such thing. Uvants (talk) 07:34, 6 October 2021 (UTC)