Talk:House of Rohan

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1911 EB article

The name Rohan derived from a small town in Morbihan, Brittany. The family appears to have sprung from the viscounts of Porhoet, and claims connection with the ancient sovereigns of Brittany. From the 12th century it held an important place in the history of Brittany, and strengthened its position by alliances with the greatest houses in France.

It was divided into several branches, the eldest of which, that of the viscounts of Rohan, became extinct in 1527. Of the younger branches the most famous is that of Guemenee, from which sprang the branches of Montbazon, Soubise and Gie. The seigneurs of Frontenay, an offshoot of this last branch, inherited by marriage the property of the eldest branch of the house. Hercule de Rohan, duc de Montbazon (1568-1654) served Henry III and Henry IV against the Catholic League, and was made by Henry IV governor of Paris and the Isle of France, and master of the hounds. His grandson, Louis de Rohan, the chevalier de Rohan, who was notorious for his dissolute life, conspired with the Dutch and Spanish against Louis XIV and was beheaded in Paris in 1674.

In the 18th century the Soubise branch furnished several prelates, cardinals and bishops of Strassburg, among others the famous cardinal de Rohan, the hero of the Affair of the Diamond Necklace. The seigneurs of Gie, a branch founded by Pierre de Rohan (1453-1513), a cadet of the branch of Guemenee and marshal of France, were conspicuous on the Protestant side during the wars of religion. Rene de Rohan, seigneur of Pontivy and Frontenay, commanded the Calvinist army in 1570, and the cardinal de Rohan defended Lusignan with great valour when it was besieged by the Catholics (1574-75). His son Henry, the first duke of Rohan, also distinguished himself in the Protestant army. His only child, Marguerite de Rohan, married in 1645 Henri Chabot, a cadet of a great family of Poitou. This marriage was opposed by her mother, Marguerite de Bethune, who put forward a rival heir called Tancred, whom she claimed to be her son by the duke of Rohan. This Tancred perished in the Fronde in 1649.

The property and titles of Henry de Rohan thus passed to the Chabot family, which under the name of Rohan-Chabot produced some distinguished soldiers, and a Cardinal and archbishop of Besançon. The male line of the Rohans is now represented by an offshoot of the Rohan-Guémené branch.

Collapsing the family trees

Four days ago, I collapsed all the family trees in the article, using <cot> and <cob> tabs. I thought that this improved the article, as most of the family trees were hard to read anyway, even on a high-resolution screen. However, I have been referred to Wikipedia:Manual of Style#Scrolling lists and collapsible content, which says "If information in a list, infobox, or other non-navigational content seems extraneous or trivial enough to inspire pre-collapsing it, consider raising a discussion on the article ... talk page about whether it should be included at all." Therefore, I am seeking your opinions on whether the article is better as now (with the collapsing), or as before my edits of 2020-08-02, or without the family trees altogether. (My own view is that the trees contain a lot of valuable albeit hard-to-read information, and should be retained in some form. I am indifferent as to whether they should be collapsed.) Maproom (talk) 21:19, 6 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Pinging Aziliz Breizh, the creator of the family trees. Maproom (talk) 21:32, 6 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hello @Maproom:. The family tree are collapsed in the French article as well and the page is easier to read like that; people can still read collapsed trees if they want to, as the information provided can be useful.--Aziliz Breizh (talk) 13:37, 7 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

reformatting the family trees

I redid the first two tables using Template:Tree list, to make them easier to read. Unfortunately, that template has no (obvious) good way of notating a second marriage after children from the first. I hope someone can improve on my result rather than merely restoring to a format that requires a super-wide window.

If the subsequent tables (Rohan-Guéméné branch etc.) repeat matter in the big tree, I'd urge cutting them out of the big tree, with a reference, thus: John I of Rohan (1324-1396), Viscount of Rohan, Lord of Guéméné, founder of the Guéméné branch (see below). —Tamfang (talk) 00:20, 6 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

We could cope with the problem of second marriages by removing all mention of marriages, if they can be found in the relevant articles. —Tamfang (talk) 03:31, 9 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]