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Comment on notability

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The subject is a twice elected Executive councillor on a major city's council, who spends £150million of public cash a year. Thats notable by wikipedias standards, and there are many such pages for Cabinet councillors in the UK. Suggest user "Wereon" (who added the tag) puts the argument against notability, or the tag is removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.188.208.251 (talk) 16:23, 6 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Good job I had this article on my watchlist. You might want to let me know on my talk page if you wish to summon me.
Wikipedia policy says that neither local councillors nor PPCs are notable ex officio. I suspect it's the latter which got his article created in the first place: there's been a nasty trend of constituency associations using Wikipedia as a campaigning device. For some reason, the Lib Dems seem particularly culpable in this regard.
Have a look at WP:POLITICIAN, though. I think point 2 has been used to argue for the inclusion of some of the Mancunian councillors - which I disagree with - but even so, I don't think Bristol counts as a "major metropolitan city" in the same way as Manchester. Wereon (talk) 00:44, 7 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

You give yourself away! A look through your profile shows that you are a Conservative Party student at a city up north. This and other political articles are on your "watch" list to make sure the Conservative view is represented. Hence you question the notability of articles like this, but conspicuously not of Conservative articles like this Adeela Shafi even though you must know about them. But at least everyone can see your motivation now.

Returning to the point, this article is clearly justified by point 2 that you reference. Bristol is indeed a major metropolitan city - it is England's sixth most populous city and is a member of the "Core cities" English Core Cities Group with the other major metropolitan areas. The article is also justified under point 3, given the considerable local coverage. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.188.208.251 (talk) 15:08, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I "give myself away"? Er, yes, my user page does say that I'm a student at Durham. So what?
Regarding my political affiliations - as it happens, you guess correctly, though as all Wikipedia editors should I try to maintain a NPOV. I wasn't aware of Shafi's article, though I have had articles about Conservative PPCs, such as Annesley Abercorn, deleted in the past.
Anyway, rising above the ad hominems. I'm not sure that point 3 holds in this case: most of the sources cited are either matters of routine record, or are Wright acting as a spokesman for the Bristol Lib Dems, rather than in a personal capacity. I contend that, were he not a PPC, this article would not exist. Wereon (talk) 16:54, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Right let us look at these references that are supposed to establish notability:
  • 1. Bristol City Council: Councillor Details - standard councillor contact details, confirms is an Executive councillor
  • 2. Royal Astronomical Society: Winners of the 2002 Thesis Prizes - confirms he wrote a thesis
  • 3. Bristol City Council: Budget book 2009-2010 - dead link
Fixed
  • 4. This is Bristol: Bristol to build first council houses in 30 years - made a statement to the local press - that is what councillors do
No, he was in charge of the program - it makes it notable
  • 5. eGov Monitor: Council wins another £2.3m to finance more new homes - quoted in a council press release
Notable
  • 6. Bristol 24/7: Landlords have "Social responsibility" to fill empty homes - another brief statement to local press (Interesting that I had never seen this "news source" before)
Wikipedia teaches us all new things every day
  • 7. This is Bristol: Bristol housing chief - we won't snoop on you - another statement to the local press
He's the subject of the story, so notable
  • 8. Jack FM: Snooping Powers Only "Last Resort" in Bristol - another statement to the local press
Ditto #7
  • 9. Bristol City Council: Council takes action to safeguard privacy - the press release that led to the story in refs #7, #8
  • 10. South West Provincial Council Members - membership list, passing mention
The point of references is to provide evidence for statements. If there had been no reference you would be complaining of lack of references
  • 11. West of England Partnership Planning and Housing Board - as per above
As per above
  • 12. This is Bristol: Two Bristol primaries axed - but one survives - passing mention
  • 13. The Guardian: Council votes to oppose ID cards - passing mention
  • 14. This is Bristol: 'Bristol schools letting in ID cards by the back door' - passing mention
No, he's the subject of the story
  • 15. This is Somerset: Lib Dems oppose barrage across Bristol Channel - passing mention
  • 16. This is Bristol: Would-be Bristol MP backs calls to change politicians' expenses - passing mention
No, he's the subject of the story
  • 17. Original 106.5: Bristolians "Should Have Say" On Nuclear Plans - failed verification
Yes, Original Radio doesnt exist any more
  • 18. Bristol 24/7: Call for city to oppose new nuclear power plants - another statement to the local press
  • 19. Bristol City Council: Help us reduce unnecessary floodlighting says council housing chief - council press release
  • 20. Build.co.uk: Reduce Floodlighting, Says Housing Chief - story written up from press release above, in a trade publication with no statement of editorial policy, probably not an RS, straight rehash of ref #19
  • 21. Bristol Indymedia: Help protect Banksy's Park St mural, again! - not a reliable source
Bristol Indymedia is used frequently in Bristol wikipedia articles. E.g. several entries on: Culture_of_Bristol
So we have a few press releases, some membership details, one dead link, one reference which failed verification and one, perhaps two dubious sources. How does that meet "A politician who has received "significant press coverage" has been written about, in depth, independently in multiple news feature articles, by journalists." The press coverage is just rehashed press releases.
"In the case of candidates for political office who do not meet this guideline, the general rule is to redirect to an appropriate page covering the election or political office sought in lieu of deletion." Since the redirect is not accepted, I am nominating for deletion. Jezhotwells (talk) 20:04, 10 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Your list above is in no measure an objective analysis. The precedent for notability of executive councillors of large authorities is well established. Delete opposed.
Firstly I would like to point out: WP:COI that I am a LibDem activist. The article is clearly another example of promotion and although there are press articles I think we would need to see some coverage in the nationals where the article is wholly or mainly about the subject. should be redirected and a reference put on the constituency page and perhaps we could look again after the election. --Wintonian (talk) 23:39, 10 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]
That is not the standard that currently exists as applied to executive councillors of large authorities with wiki pages. And to suggest that it should be looked at again after the election is absurd. Are you arguing that articles on people who stand for election should be deleted while there is an election and then put up again afterwards? Where is this in WP guidance? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.188.208.251 (talk • contribs) 10:35, 11 March 2010
The Wikipedia guidance is at WP:POLITICIAN, standard practice is to redirect to the constituency. Leaders of councils and elected mayors who have had substantial coverage in the national press are likely notable, but executive members who have issued a few press releases are not, any more than directors of divisions of large companies are likely not. Hope this answers your query – and please don't forget to sign your posts using four (~)s. Jezhotwells (talk) 11:56, 11 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]
That is untrue. There is not consensus that local politicians are not notable and WP:POLITICIAN does not mention "national media". WP:POLITICIAN supports this - it says: "Major local political figures who have received significant press coverage. Generally speaking, mayors are likely to meet this criterion, as are members of the main citywide government or council of a major metropolitan city." (Please, let's not start the "Bristol isnt a big city" nonsense either). The precedent is set by what is already accepted on wiki. There are a dozen such examples (often less worthy) at Category:Councillors in Manchester, Category:Councillors in Liverpool and Category:Councillors in Greater London. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.188.208.251 (talk) 10:51, 12 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

If you care to do more than merely superficial research you will see that most of the members of those categories are politicians who were once councillors from the releavnt city, e.g Bessie Braddock, Eric Heffer, Trevor Jones, James Sexton, Sir Max Muspratt, 1st Baronet. These wer all people who received significant coverage on the press. The local paper reprinting councillor's press releases is not significant coverage. There is nothing in those newspaper "stories" about Wright, about his background, no commentary on how he performs his job, etc. They just copy word for word the "quotes" from his official press releases. The comments above indicate a significant failure to understand what is meant by significant coverage. Jezhotwells (talk) 11:14, 12 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

When I say look again after the election I mean if he is elected the he will almost ceranly satisfy WP:POLITICIAN --Wintonian (talk) 17:51, 11 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Following discussion with moderator Bigtimepeace, who set up the re-direct, and others, I am proposing to restore this page as since the redirect Wright has become a notable advocate of Open IT standards in UK local government. There was also a significant article solely on him in the local media: [1], which satisfies WP:POLITICIAN. I therefore propose to add the following paragraph:

Open Standards advocacy

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Since taking the responsibility for IT at Bristol City Council in 2009, Wright has become a vocal proponent of Open Source[1][2], open document formats[3], and open data in UK local government[4][5]. He speaks at IT conferences to highlight the problems still faced by public sector organisations wanting to avoid "vendor lock-in", particularly to Microsoft.[6][7] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.98.215.74 (talk) 13:11, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ The Register: Bristol Council mulls mixed FOSS, Microsoft upgrade
  2. ^ thinq: Bristol councillor makes stand for open source
  3. ^ Openforum Europe: UK Government pushes for open standards
  4. ^ BEP Find out where your money's going
  5. ^ Bristol 24/7: Wikipedia founder in Bristol to celebrate 10th anniversary
  6. ^ Westminster eForum Keynote Seminar: Open source software
  7. ^ http://www.herefordshire.lug.org.uk/node/68
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