Talk:Alamo Christian Foundation

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Conviction in 2009[edit]

A citation is needed for the date of Alamo's conviction. The reference given by previous editors was published in 1998, and thus couldn't be a source for the fact (?) that he was convicted in 2009. It's possible that I will fix this myself, but I wanted to leave a record of it here in case someone can around to it before me. Alf.laylah.wa.laylah (talk) 01:46, 13 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

OK, I found some refs for conviction date of 2009 on the Tony Alamo page itself. However, one of those sources refers to crimes committed between 1994 and 2005, hence making it clear that the arrest date of 1988/1991 is unrelated to the 2009 conviction. I don't have sources to sort this out so I just removed the arrest date and will try to fix later. Alf.laylah.wa.laylah (talk) 02:00, 13 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I have removed the reference to "cult" in the first line because the word has no definite meaning, merely a general purpose insult for any small church. Jewels Vern (talk) 12:46, 8 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

External links[edit]

Why are certain external links being deleted because they are considered "not within the Wikipedia guidelines"? I refer to the following links:
http://www.factnet.org/factnetcgi/discus/discus.cgi Former members discuss the abuse at the hands of Alamo,
http://www.tonyalamochurch.com/ A website that details biography and legal history of Alamo Ministries,
http://www.armfulofhelp.org/index.htm A website that exposes Alamo Ministries bogus charity organization used to fund his radical propaganda. It also details eyewitness accounts of abuse in the cult group,
http://tapolygamy.blogspot.com/ A blog that posted Tony Alamo's tract entitled "The Polygamists" written by Alamo while in prison,
http://tainformation.blogspot.com/ Another blog that posted an informative tract, found on a car windshield, written by Former Members, Concerned Citizens and Children Born and Raised in the Alamo cult that details what the "World Pastor" has been up to (behind the compound doors) for all of these many years.
The Polygamists tract is word-for-word from a tract Tony Alamo wrote. The factnet discussion board is a place where actual members and former members of this cult group post detailed accounts of what happened in the group. How can the other websites that use eyewitness testimony to back up their accounts of abuse not be considered? People have come forward to testify about what this "World Pastor" has done to them and it is not being considered valid? How is this possible?
Does anyone else want these sites posted to the external links?
Does anyone object? — Preceding unsigned comment added by InSearchOfTheTruth (talk • contribs) 16:54, January 16, 2007

Wow. Sounds like someone in search of "The Truth". None of those are reliable sources. - SummerPhD (talk) 22:09, 29 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I agree. Though I still don't understand the double-speak about IMDB and "reliable" sources. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't depending on the power status of the editor... But blogs certainly need to be looked at with a strong eye. =//= Johnny Squeaky 18:45, 4 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
This is the IMDb guideline. IMDb is user-edited and therefore unreliable, like blogs and internet forums. Span (talk) 20:38, 4 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Like most of the Interwebs: User editable. Yet certain powerful Wikipedia editors will use IMDB for "some things" but come down like concrete on weak editors for essentially the same usage. Double standard *in use* ... I suspect that you Spangle are "on the way up" in the Wikipedia hierarchy, having kissed the right - er - grown alliances with the right editors... =//= Johnny Squeaky 21:34, 4 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Does this back and forth about IMDb have any connection to this article? - SummerPhD (talk) 00:54, 5 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Does your comment about being "in search of the truth"? Or was that just a "snide" comment from someone with a "do as I say not as I do" attitude? =//= Johnny Squeaky 00:47, 6 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The editor asked about several sources. I linked to an essay that seems appropriate and answered that no, the sources listed are not reliable sources. IMDb and your current hierarchical concerns are unrelated to improving this article. - SummerPhD (talk) 01:23, 6 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Early 1960s[edit]

This Rolling Stone piece from 1972 (cited in the article) states that Alamo was using that name by the early 1960s - certainly by 1964 when he led the publicity campaign for Bobby Jameson - and describes him at that time as "a hotshot former singer". Do we have any more information on this, for inclusion in the article? Ghmyrtle (talk) 08:52, 9 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I can't find that article in any reliable source and I wouldn't trust the version you've linked to from Blogspot, even though it might be correct. I see that the supposed Rolling Stone article is being used as a source in the Jameson article and it's been mentioned by World News Network (which isn't reliable). I would ignore this mention of Alamo since it's a minor point and we can't trust what little coverage there is of it. Chris Troutman (talk) 00:08, 2 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]
This Allmusic article suggests that there may have been some confusion between the subject of this article, and a different Tony Alamo who was a singer with Sammy Kaye's band from about 1940 through to the 1950s. According to the Allmusic piece, the Alamo in our WP article (Bernie Lazar Hoffman) has claimed to have been a "crooner" and "big band singer", and "adopted the name Tony Alamo in the '50s in the hope of cashing in on the popularity of Italian-American singers", but is clearly a different person to Kaye's singer. Ghmyrtle (talk) 17:41, 2 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

You will never find any proof that it is the same Tony Alamo as the Tony Alamo with Danny Kaye. That is because it isn't the same Tony Alamo. And as far as merging pages, I think both the Tony Alamo AND Susan Alamo pages should be merged with this one. Right now there are 3 pages about this cult. TeeRich (talk) 00:52, 6 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

what does this unreferenced sentence mean?[edit]

"This church aligns with Scientology as a type of cult"--Richardson mcphillips (talk) 13:26, 25 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Psychopathy diagnosis[edit]

There is nothing in reference 1 that states that Tony Alamo is a diagnosed psychopath. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.244.70.15 (talk) 01:26, 11 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Tonly Alamo should have a separate article[edit]

There should be a separate article for Tony Alamo. He's a mildly famous person, and yet I am unable to find basic information about him (birthdate, birth location, death date, death location, etc.) on Wikipedia. In fact, I can't even determine from Wikipedia whether he is dead or alive!

Was there a previous RfD about this matter, or has he never had his own article? The direct link's history [1] seems to indicate that he never had his own article.

I know that there are some people who don't get their own pages: for example, Orville Wright and Wilbur Wright are combined on the Wright brothers page. But in that case, basic biographical information about both brothers is available on the page. — Lawrence King (talk) 07:20, 4 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Pronunciation[edit]

The article currently states that Alamo's name is pronounced "a-LAHM-o". Is the h pronounced? 173.66.5.216 (talk) 03:27, 6 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

When indicating pronunciation, the letter combination "AH" indicates the vowel sound in "palm," "calm," "saw". In much of the United States, this is the same as "dawn" and "thought". See here for pronunciation: [2]. So the "H" is included to show how the vowel is pronounced, not because it is pronounced separately. — Lawrence King (talk) 00:54, 11 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Merge proposal[edit]

To discuss the merge proposal, please comment at Talk:Susan Alamo#Merging into Alamo Christian Foundation (second request), since that keeps the discussion on the same page as the previous discussion. — Lawrence King (talk) 21:24, 27 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Nature of the “legal troubles”[edit]

The first paragraph of this article mentions only that Alamo was jailed in 2009 “after years of legal troubles”

Given that this currently serves as his bio page, and he was convicted to a maximum of 175 years in prison for the rape of ten underage girls this seems like a massive understatement, the nature of the ‘legal troubles’ are only mentioned in a single paragraph down at the bottom.

I’m not trying to stir the pot, but realistically it is probably the most notable thing about both Alamo and the ministries. Seelenamt (talk) 21:59, 27 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know whether it's the most notable thing, but you are correct that it's significant. My recent edit [3] makes it more clear. — Lawrence King (talk) 05:32, 28 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion migrated from old Susan Alamo page[edit]

I have completed the merge of this page with Susan Alamo. All the information from the former Susan Alamo page has been merged to Alamo Christian Foundation. The context of the former Talk:Susan Alamo page is copied here. — Lawrence King (talk) 06:11, 28 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Merging into Alamo Christian Foundation[edit]

The result of this discussion is no consensus. This dated discussion has received little input, and the only respondent discussed Tony Alamo, rather than Susan Alamo. North America1000 10:21, 23 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

In my opinion, if Tony Alamo isn't notable enough to have his own article (it redirects to the aforementioned article), neither is Susan. There isn't much content, so might as well merge it, in my opinion. --Therealelizacat (talk) 06:29, 29 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

You logic is impeccable, but I disagree with its premise. Tony Alamo is notable enough to have his own article. He's a relatively famous person, and yet basic information about him (e.g., his birthdate, and his death date -- unless he is still alive!) is not available on Wikipedia. That's why he should have his own article. — Lawrence King (talk) 07:14, 4 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Merging into Alamo Christian Foundation (second request)[edit]

User:Ilovetopaint has relisted this for merge. I argued against the merge last time, but at this point -- given the group's decreased notability after the death of both founders -- I would find a merge acceptable, if it was done right. My preference would be that the first subsection of the article would be Founders, with a subsection for Tony and a subsection for Susan. This would contain everything about them prior to the founding of the church (which is quite brief). The rest of their bios would be integrated into the History section which would follow. Thoughts? — Lawrence King (talk) 21:18, 27 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Merge. I agree with the above points. The articles should be merged. Timothy Titus Talk To TT 14:44, 4 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified (January 2018)[edit]

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