Talk:Van Halen

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Former good article Van Halen was one of the Music good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
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Appropriate?[edit]

Out of curiosity, is including the ongoing public "tiff" between members - current and former - appropriate for an encyclopedic article? Feels a bit like a fan magazine read to me.THX1136 (talk) 14:22, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

Kinda agree. I would say the criticism of DLR by Eddie may turn out to be important if it leads to another line up change. Unless everyone just grudgingly continues to work together, which would make this a non-factor in the long run. Either way it's still too WP:CRYSTALBALL. As for the criticism of Sammy and Michael, who really cares. We already know that they don't get along, that's why they're not in the band anymore. It's not news, really, and Wikipedia is WP:NOTNEWS, so we really don't need to summarize every news story that comes out. I say we take it out. oknazevad (talk) 16:12, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
Since there has been no other discussion on this subject I have removed the paragraph on this subject. I've included it here for reinstatement if that is deemed necessary.
"Appearing in a cover story for Billboard published on June 19, 2015; Eddie Van Halen commented that Roth "does not want to be my friend… (His) perception of himself is different than who he is in reality. We're not in our 20s anymore. We're in our 60s. Act like you're 60." Eddie also claimed that he had to show Michael Anthony how to play, and that he assisted in creating the backing vocal sound the bassist is well known for. Anthony responded: "I am proud to say that my bass playing and vocals helped create our sound. I’ve always chosen to take the high road and stay out of the never-ending mudslinging, because I believe that it ultimately ends up hurting the Van Halen fans.”[85]"THX1136 (talk) 14:18, 16 September 2015 (UTC)
WP:TONE says we should keep the tone neutral, which means we don't tell the reader about all the biting little comments they say. We summarize instead, and if it's petty shit then we ought to keep it out. Binksternet (talk) 17:51, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

"Van" Halen[edit]

Actually, whereas is correct to call the band "Van Halen", Alex's and Eddie's proper surname should be "van Halen" (sort key by "Halen, van") since they are Dutch native. Same for their father Jan van Halen who was a Dutch national. -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 11:30, 19 October 2015 (UTC)

All sources, including the brothers themselves, use the capital V and alphabetized it under V. To do otherwise would be WP:OR by WP:SYNTH. oknazevad (talk) 13:55, 19 October 2015 (UTC)
Yes, I suppose that living in the U.S. since the 1960s made them drop the "v". Btw the Dutch article reads Alex van Halen and Eddie van Halen, since they are not American of Dutch descent but Dutch-born American nationals -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 16:48, 19 October 2015 (UTC)
We follow the conventions used by sources. I've never seen an English-language article about the band or either of the brothers use a lower-case v. The Dutch versions of these articles are very poorly sourced and use only English-language sources which read "Eddie Van Halen" etc. If anything, the Dutch articles should be corrected. --Spike Wilbury (talk) 17:11, 19 October 2015 (UTC)
It's the first letter of their band name so it would be capitalized for the MOS. The band also does not use a stylization of lower-casing their name MOS:LCITEMS as with k.d. lang. The places where the lower-case v would be appropriate is for their father's name or referring to their full name. But common name uses caps for Van. AngusWOOF (barksniff) 17:46, 19 October 2015 (UTC)
No, they spell their full names with a capital V, Dutch rules be damned. We don't tell people how to spell their own names. And we don't make stuff up. Spike is right. The article at the Netherlandish Wikipedia is wrong. oknazevad (talk) 18:53, 19 October 2015 (UTC)
Since the members identify themselves by capital V, it should be fine. Dutch_name#Surnames shows usage of both capital and lower-case V depending on the person. So use what is most consistent with the media and sources. That the band's capitalization is questioned is rather peculiar. AngusWOOF (barksniff) 19:29, 19 October 2015 (UTC)
I am not talking about the band's name which is correctly "Van Halen" and nobody discusses it. I was just wondering whether, being they born Dutch nationals, wouldn't be better respect the Dutch use of lower-casing the "Van". But of course that's not a war of religion, if the use in English is to capitalize the article I have nothing to object :-) BTW, the argument that they are their own source is weak. Steve McDowall learnt as adult that his own name was McDowall, not McDowell, in this case the correct source being not himself but the birth office of his native city :D (and, to make a personal example, I learnt at 15 that I have a middle name that was never used :-) ). -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 14:57, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
And I am saying that the brothers (and Wolfgang) never use the lowercase version and that is what we need to respect their spelling of their own name. Telling people how to spell their own names is stupid, rude, and insulting. As Angus notes, there is no consistent Dutch use to "respect". The McDowall situation is different; McDowall himself chose to use the "a" spelling, so we respect that. The Van Halens don't use a lowercase V, so we don't . Period. oknazevad (talk) 15:48, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
Take it easy, are you Van Halen's agent? :D It's normal that Van Halen jr. has his name capitalized, being born in the US. Clearly as for McDowall I haven't been able to explain myself: is not that McDowall "chose" to call himself McDowell, is that he simply didn't know his name was McDowall. Simple and clear. As well as I didn't know I had a middle name until I was 15. The examples I made were not to contest van Halen brothers' right to name themselves as they like, was only for contesting someone's (HERE) assertion that "one is the best source of himself". Apart that this counterdicts the "third party source" policy here, the argument is flawed because one can ignore their real name until adulthood. That apart I just said that I have nothing to object, I am a longtime admirer of Van Halen, and I just posed a question from a broader encyclopedic point of view. -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 17:13, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
WP:SELFPUB would apply to information where the person states information about themselves, like their birthday / birthplace, or the "true" spelling of their name. WP:COMMONNAME, especially the Wikipedia:Article_titles#Name_changes section has information about that. So if Steve McDowall wants his name spelled with an a instead of an e, and the media start adopting that, then it's fair to list as an a. The e is then treated as an alias link, although it doesn't need to be listed in the infobox if it's a typo by the publishers. Same with a publisher that might use MacDowall. AngusWOOF (barksniff) 19:40, 21 October 2015 (UTC)

Associated Acts: Tremonti?[edit]

Tremonti should be under associated acts as Wolfgang Van Halen is their bassist. — Preceding unsigned comment added by NickolasOnWikipedia4 (talkcontribs) 20:27, 21 May 2016 (UTC)

Protected[edit]

I've indef'd the article as far as semi-protection goes. From what I can see, there's been a need for protection since the early days of Wikipedia, so this looks to be overdue. Tokyogirl79 (。◕‿◕。) 05:33, 27 May 2016 (UTC)

Glam Metal[edit]

Whoever is putting glam metal in Van Halen's genre list please stop. Glam metal is not listed on any of their albums, songs or individual profiles of the members so why is it listed in the bands page? They are not a glam metal band they are heavy metal / hard rock. They may have inspired glam metal but they are not a glam metal band. Thank you. Pinkzeppelin4 (talk) 02:50, 24 June 2016 (UTC)

It is sourced to a reliable source. Now, whether or not you agree with it is irrelevant. But you do raise a good point that there seems to be a genre disconnect between the band article and the album articles, none of which are labeled glam metal. A check of the edit histories of those album articles would likely show a clear removal of the genre where it belonged. oknazevad (talk) 02:54, 24 June 2016 (UTC)