Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/Sherlock Holmes (1939 film series)/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by Giants2008 10:01, 16 September 2013 (UTC) [1].[reply]

Sherlock Holmes (1939 film series)[edit]

Sherlock Holmes (1939 film series) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s): SchroCat (talk) 22:42, 21 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The Sherlock Holmes (1939 film series) was a series of fourteen films produced by two studios: Basil Rathbone played Sherlock Holmes, while Nigel Bruce portrayed Dr. John Watson. A superb and enjoyable series of films led by an actor who many consider to be the definitive Holmes. This has undergone a makeover recently and is ready for an FLC. - SchroCat (talk) 22:42, 21 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

  • The article's title doesn't seem correct to me. Why "1939 series"? It makes it seem like that was the only year that the films were made. I would have titled this "Sherlock Holmes (Basil Rathbone series)".
  • Let me have a think on this: "Rathbone series" is also sort of misleading, as it was about more than Rathbone. I'll drop in some further thoughts on possibilities shortly. Having had a hunt round and asked about, the title is correct as per WP:NCF#Film series. Cheers - SchroCat (talk) 08:10, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Both Rathbone and Bruce continued their roles when the series changed studios, as did two other regular characters, as did two other regular characters, Mary Gordon, who played Mrs. Hudson and Dennis Hoey portrayed Inspector Lestrade." -- Hoey does not appear in the 20th Cenury-Fox films so it is incorrect to suggested that he continued into the Universal films. Also, both he and Mary Gordon were not regulars, but semi-regulars; neither appears in all of the films.
  • Tweaked, although "regular" doesn't necessarily mean they were in all the films, so that's changed to recurring. - SchroCat (talk) 07:21, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • " ... in a process that was jointly paid for by UCLA, Hugh Hefner and Warner Bros.." -- Only one period is needed at the end of this sentence.
  • One is for the Warner Bros. abbreviation: I've tweaked to remove the double. - SchroCat (talk) 07:21, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Other recurring characters, were played by numerous actors, with Professor Moriarty being played by three people." -- Take out the first comma and name the three actors who played Moriarty in the main text, not a footnote. Also note that Atwill and Daniell appear in other films in the series.
  • " ... included Harry Cording, who played seven roles in different films, and Gerald Hamer and Harold De Becker, who both played four roles." -- You could also include Evelyn Ankers and Hillary Brooke.
  • Hamer and De Becker did four each (more than any others), which is why I put them in there, but I could have included about five others, which would have been overkill, I think. I've tweaked it slightly to make it more clear that there were others who also appeared, but to include them all could be a bit of overkill. - SchroCat (talk) 09:41, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Consider using the Template:Episode list to list the films. I think it would look better and take up less space. (You would lose the ablility to sort the films but since there are only fourteen I don't think it would be that great a loss.) Also if you do this you need only link Roy William Neill's name the first time.
  • I'd rather not. Apart from the fact these are stand alone films, rather than television episodes, I hope to be able to include the budgets of the films at some point in the future, which would be much better with the sortable table.
  • How about naming the actors playing the main characters in the plot synopsis of each film; i.e Henry Baskerville (Richard Greene).
  • I did consider that, but I think it would bloat the table quite a bit if we start adding in names of actors into a section that doesn't actually need it. The films have their own pages and the full cast is available there. - SchroCat (talk) 14:47, 23 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • How about noting that Rathbone and Bruce also made cameo appearances as Holmes and Watson in Crazy House (1943)?
  • Let me have a think about this: there's a few bits and pieces I could add about Rathbone and Bruce, but they fall outside the remit of film series. This one is more borderline and I just need to consider it for a bit. - SchroCat (talk) 07:21, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I'll check out this article more in a few days. Jimknut (talk) 02:31, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Aaron
Resolved comments by Aaron

Comments from Aaron

  • and produced twelve further films. → and produced a further twelve.
  • and production values and → and production values that
  • and lowered the budgets, producing the films as B pictures. → and produced them as B pictures with lower budgets.
  • In the 1970s → Comma after
  • In 1938 → Comm after
  • Commas after dates are a matter of personal taste, except when there is a sub-clause after the opening words. - SchroCat (talk) 14:27, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

 — ₳aron 14:09, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

  • Many thanks Aaron! Much appreciated. - SchroCat (talk) 14:30, 22 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support  — ₳aron 15:06, 23 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Crisco 1492 (talk)
Crisco comments
  • another recurring character, Mary Gordon, - She's not a character
  • In February 1942, following negotiations with the Doyle estate, Universal Studios acquired the rights to the films and signed contracts with Rathbone and Bruce to continue their portrayals. Universal's deal—worth $300,000—was for seven years, and they purchased the rights to 21 stories in the canon; the contract stipulated that the company had to make three films a year, of which two had to be adaptations of Doyle's stories. - Was this while the cast was doing the radio show too?
  • Certainly while Rathbone and Bruce were doing it: I'm not sure how many of the others were involved as I've not got much info on the radio series - most of my sources are about Holmes on Screen - SchroCat (talk) 15:48, 24 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Lots of semi colons
  • I'll see if I can remove a few! OK: slimmed down on the usage! - SchroCat (talk) 15:57, 24 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Universal considered replacing him on screen with Tom Conway—as he subsequently did with the radio series - Universal cannot be replaced with the pronoun "he". Needs rewriting
  • Changed "he" to "they". I think it reads OK, but let me know if it looks a little clunky. - SchroCat (talk) 15:48, 24 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • As American films shouldn't this list use American English?
  • Possibly! It's a slightly moot point, I think. The character and stories are British, as are most of the cast. I'm happy to change to AmEng if people think it appropriate. - SchroCat (talk) 15:48, 24 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Why Hugh Hefner?
  • Aside from the fact he's a film fan, there's no other reason given. I've added the film fan info. - SchroCat (talk) 15:48, 24 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Many thanks, as always Crisco - much appreciated! - SchroCat (talk) 15:48, 24 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Dana Boomer

Comments - Prose and linking need some work, plus a few reference/note comments:

  • In the last two sentences of the last paragraph of the lead (starting "Some of the films had become degraded over time,..."), I am unsure if all of the films or just the ones that are PD are being discussed. In other words, does "some" refer to some of the PD films or some of the entire series? When the UCLA restored the series, did they restore all of them or just the four? A bit more clarification needed.
  • Note "a" needs colons after "Atwill also played" and "Zucco also played". Also, it would probably be better if "Daniell also appeared in two other roles in the series:" was changed to "Daniell also played" to make it consistent with the others. Also need colons after the "xyz played" in the other notes.
  • Not strictly needed, but done. - SchroCat (talk) 21:25, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • The Hound of the Baskervilles, "Holmes and Watson are consulted about the arrival of Sir Henry Baskerville," How do they consult about his arrival? His arrival to where?
  • The Hound of the Baskervilles, "viscous hound" Is this meant to be vicious? Or is viscous really meant?
  • The Hound of the Baskervilles, "to the moor the night" Perhaps "that night" or "in the night"?
  • Voice of Terror, link British Inner Council? (Is this a real thing? We don't seem to have an article for it...)
  • Secret Weapon, link Gestapo?
  • Bordering on over linking, but done. - SchroCat (talk) 21:05, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Secret Weapon, "revolutionary bombsite." What is a bombsite?
  • Secret Weapon, "leaves a part with four Swiss scientists" Does he leave one part with all four of the scientists as a group (so that four people have one part) or does he leave one part with each of the four scientists (so that four people have four parts)?
  • Secret Weapon, "Moriarty tries to kill Holmes by exsanguination, but is rescued by Watson" This sounds like Moriarty is rescued by Watson.
  • Washington, "that he had put onto microfilm and inserted them into a matchbook;" - "them" can be removed.
  • Spider Woman - the first sentence is completely ungrammatical, as the first clause is in present tense and the second is in past tense. How about "As a series of similar suicides take place in London while Holmes is on holiday in Scotland, Holmes complains to Watson about his health and shortly afterward collapses into a ravine and goes missing, presumed dead." or similar.
  • The Pearl of Death, "but manages to his it" What?
  • The Pearl of Death, "and their china and crockery is smashed." "Is" can be removed.
  • House of Fear, " In all cases the identification is difficult, with the victims only identified with difficulty." Both clauses of this sentence say the same thing.
  • The Woman in Green, link hypnotism?
  • Pursuit to Algiers, link Algiers?
  • Pursuit to Algiers, "trying him up" Should this be "tying him up"? Also, should "When Holmes if discovered" be "is"?
  • Terror by Night, "his mother Lady Margaret, to protect" The comma can be removed.
  • Terror by Night, "and Duncan-Bleek at dining," "are dining"?
  • Terror by Night, link poison dart?
  • I think that would be a link too far - especially as we don't have a poison dart article. - SchroCat (talk) 21:05, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Dressed to Kill, "before the murders also visit" "murderers"?
  • The last two references in the bibliography have red error messages. Also, how are these used as reference? I don't see mention of them in the Notes and References section.
  • Errors removed (inclusion of access date). Both are used as sources - see FNs 11 and 53. - SchroCat (talk) 21:05, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Quite a few typos and ungrammatical spots, especially in the movie summaries. Please do a full read-through to make sure there aren't more that I haven't caught above. Overall a nice article, but needs some polishing. Dana boomer (talk) 18:29, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support - The prose is still a bit stiff in places, but I think we've found all of the typos and obvious errors. There are still a few too many semi-colons for my taste, and they are used in a few places where they are a bit jarring, but I think that is more personal preference than anything else. At this point, I am ready to support. Nice work - hopefully we will see more Sherlock Holmes-related articles/lists from you! Dana boomer (talk) 19:56, 12 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Many thanks Dana Boomer. I'll take another spin over it tomorrow to iron out any other little bugs - including the semi colons. Cheers - SchroCat (talk) 20:22, 12 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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