Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2007 October 31

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October 31

Dooyeweerdian Modal Scale Library Categorization

Hi, I am interested in a schema by which human knowledge can be categorized other than by the Library of Congress or Dewey Decimal system. Specifically, I would like to see if there has been work done use Herman Dooyeweerd's modal scale as its basis. Thank you, D. Hornor —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.240.182.186 (talk) 00:02, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

See Ontology (computer science)... AnonMoos 19:12, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Hmm, I'm actually looking for a Christian categorization of human knowledge. I.e., something which assumes the Trinity as its basis, and then derives all other categories from there. I.e. somehting in which God is not a category of the encyclopedia, but its ground. I'm not getting much response here, so maybe I'm just whistling in the dark--but it seems to be that putting God as a subcategory of religion is to "worship [i.e. assume the greatest, best and foundational nature of that being] the creation, rather than the creator, who is God, blessed forever." Any other thoughts on this? Menyaman 03:10, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

That sounds like something that Joachim de Fiore or Ramon Lull might have been interested in, but it's quite remote from most modern trends of thought... AnonMoos 19:58, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

P.S. I have an account on the Tok Pisin wikipedia. Is there a way to log in across all the projects simulaneously? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.240.182.186 (talk) 03:01, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

"Single login" has been promised for about a year now, but never seems to arrive... AnonMoos 19:58, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

How to check someone's academic credentials?

P.s. One more question. Is there a reliable way to check someone's academic credentials?

Thanks again. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.240.182.186 (talk) 00:02, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

It's a lot harder than you'd think. One standard way, when considering someone for a job, is to obtain academic references (that is, from people who have supervised or employed the candidate at a university or college) and then to contact at least one of those referees and ask questions about what has been said. Xn4 00:49, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

In the U.S., universities are fairly open about confirming whether someone received a degree from the institution. Awards of degrees are announced publicly, so there's no privacy concern. -- Mwalcoff 01:32, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

As long as it is general. Grades or transcripts, for example, cannot be accessed with permission of the person who got them. In many places they are kept under lock and key for decades after the person has died! --24.147.86.187 03:53, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I would take both negative and positive references and records with a grain of salt. Clem 06:07, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

It can be very hard in the UK. You could ask the person to provide their certificates, if they are applying for a job, but unless the person has asked one of their old tutors to be a referee the university may refuse to confirm or deny the qualification. In an example from my own experience: shortly after I gained my PhD I was offered a job at the same university, and had to show the certificates for my qualifications. The university could not access my PhD certificate from its own registry, which was in the next office: I had to take in my own copy. I have no idea what they would do if they had been asked by some other employer to confirm my credentials. (signed after signing in) SaundersW 10:07, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Russian ambassadors to King Louis XIV

Did King Louis XIV have any Russian ambassadors to his court? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.64.133.15 (talk) 01:29, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Constantly. In 1781-82 he even unofficially hosted Grand Duke Pavel Pavolovich and his wife, travelling "incognito" as the comte and comtesse du Nord ("of the North"). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wetman (talk • contribs) 03:44, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Pavel Pavlovich? Not Pavel Petrovich?  --Lambiam 11:15, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

This question has already been asked and answered here. Wetman's answer can't be taken seriously, because Louis XIV died in 1715, long before the birth of Pavel or his supposed 1781 mission to France. Marco polo 16:00, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, I was wrong that the question has already been answered. The previous question was whether Peter the Great had sent any ambassadors to Louis XIV. However, Louis ascended the throne 40 years before Peter. Still, I can find no evidence that any of Peter's predecessors sent ambassadors to Louis. It seems unlikely, because the institution of diplomacy was all the more alien to Russia in the decades before Peter's reign and because France and Muscovy shared few common interests in those years. Marco polo 20:11, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Bangladeshi Television networks

How many television networks does Bangladesh have? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.64.133.15 (talk) 02:15, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

See List of television stations in Bangladesh, which is misnamed, since it lists networks and not stations. Corvus cornix 16:31, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Criminal Justice

Differences between general and specific deterrence theory. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Irishkahuna (talk • contribs) 04:20, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Please see the article Deterrence (legal). I found it by searching Wikipedia which is probably a lot faster than waiting for a response at the ref desk. Hope it helps. Sifaka ^talk 06:22, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Drink Driving Cost To The Public

Hello, I am doing an assignement about drink driving and the thing that I'm stuck on is getting the details about the cost of it to the public, such as financial, social and emoitonal. Can you pleae give me some information? –203.217.17.48 05:05, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I went the the Mothers Against Drunk Driving website and found some wonderful information there. Try their statistics page. You will probably find more detailed information at websites belonging to anti-drunk driving organizations like SADD, MADD and possibly your government's administration of transportation or public safety. Sifaka ^talk 06:21, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

MADD are a partisan organisation in this instance. I'd look for a more objective source. Exxolon 03:54, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Criteria for Last Will and Testament

I’m considering writing my LW&T. I, however, want to distribute my assets (though not extremely large) according to the order of priority and proximity to my own of various criteria such as moral, ethical, philosophical, political, religious belief and practice; genotype and phenotype; life’s work, but not necessarily geographic or proximity of age. Although I want my assets distributed with the understanding that continuation of my life’s work has the greatest priority of all criteria, where might I find a list of relevant criteria I should considered? Clem 05:26, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Is that you, Mr Pooter? Wouldn't it be much kinder just to leave it all to Carrie and Lupin? Xn4 07:05, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

A list of criteria is still necessary, even if Mr. Pooler's decision were to fairly accommodate both Carrie and Lupin rather than making them decide. On the other hand, and as in the case of Tutankhamun, perhaps leaving it all to the High Priests to decide is the proper way to go. But even then, consciously or not, a list of criteria is still needed by the priests if only to determine the proper place to stow each piece of furniture, the tomb I speak of therein. Clem 08:57, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Ha! Ha! I admit that Clem's mode of expression is a brilliant parody of the Pooterish style, but do you not think it a little too 'fast and modern' for the real thing? After all, Xn4, can you ever imagine that dear old Pooter would use terms like 'genotype' and 'phenotype'?! Oh dear, no; not at all the thing. Clio the Muse 23:24, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Right. You don't want the executors to ask, "...wonder what we should do with these things?" or "Who cares what he was working on? If it was worth a tinker's darn he would have already won the Nobel Prize and someone else would worry." or like King Tut have all your personal possessions thrown in the corner or against the annex wall. 71.100.9.205 13:15, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

As a LW&T is a legal document, the obvious (and only worthwhile, considering your level of concern) place to find the requisite information is with a lawyer. Last Wills for Dummies (in whatever guise it may take) is a poor alternative. — Lomn 13:30, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

There's "Wills, Probate & Inheritance Tax for Dummies" by Julian Knight. Rmhermen 19:29, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I was hoping I might find possibly an online interactive questionnaire that would help me to explore more than the legal ramifications and realities in preparation for death prior to seeking the advice of an attorney as to how the criteria I selected might best be implemented rather than a prehash of the legalities. Clem 21:21, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Indeed, Clem, your original question isn't a legal one, so Last Wills for Dummies and its like won't help you. What you need is a moralist, not a lawyer. If I were you, I shouldn't waste any time in going all through Ambrose Bierce's The Devil's Dictionary. All the criteria that matter to you are there. Xn4 23:29, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Actually not. Bierce's definitions (or senses) are his own, and while full of bedeviled wit and perhaps the ability to be used as an example now and then, are for the most part not necessarily proximal to my own. The work I am looking for is a work that will help me pin down for the sake of my executors what manner of belief and thinking represents my will, which certainly Bierce's work might help to either draw comparison or serve to represent, but still fails to offer the taxa and dichotomy necessary to present an unambiguous will. Clem 10:22, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Your friendly annoying neighborhood park pigeon is tasty...

... I moved this question to the Miscellaneous desk because I posted it on the wrong refdesk page! Sifaka ^talk 06:55, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Witchcraft

An appropriate question for halloween: was belief in witchcraft still widespread in nineteenth century Britain? I was told that it was. Stockmann 06:48, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes they were, and up till this very day, witchcraft still exists but have been giving new names such as Magick. To Christans, they are to be seen as Satanic and DOES exist! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.107.107.196 (talk) 10:50, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

It depends to some extent n the meaning of "widespread". Witchcraft comes from wisdom and applies to good and evil users off th lore. Although a charismatic evangelical would condemn them all. - Kittybrewster ☎ 10:57, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

There is a difference between "Magick" and Wicca, or Paganism. And none of them is Satanism. Corvus cornix 16:33, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Yikes - it almost seems like you somehow missed the Wikipedia reference desk and asked this question on a MySpace bulletin board...hopefully some more objective and helpful responses will follow. -Elmer Clark 07:51, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I agree with Elmer, Stockmann, your question deserves a fuller response. I saw it yesterday but really had to dig a little deeper into the subject before I felt confident enough to give you a considered answer. Anyway, here is what I have been able to uncover.

The first thing to note is that for centuries law and superstition walked hand-in-hand. That is to say, on the subject of witchcraft, there was little to distinguish offical perceptions from popular prejudice, though the well-springs of belief may have been different in both cases. The big change came in the eighteenth century, when concepts of witchcraft began to lose ground amongst the educated. The gap really begins to open up with the passing of the Witchcraft Act of 1736, which repealed earlier English and Scottish statutes on the subject. From this point forward the law dictated that

No prosecution, suit or proceeding, shall be commenced or carried on against any person or persons for witchcraft, sorcery, inchantment or conjuration or for charging with any such offense, in any court whatsoever in Great Britain.

The Act further made it an offence to pretend to have supernatural powers. So, from this point forward, as far as the law was concerned, witchcraft was no more than a pretence. However, while the enlightened could scoff at the subject, beliefs in the literal truth of witchcraft continued to be well-entrenched among large segments of the population, especially in rural communities. People were slow to realise, moreover, that the law was no longer on their side on this subject. Right into the late nineteenth century magistrates continued to receive requests for the arrest of suspected witches.

So, no longer able to call on the law, people took to dispensing their own forms of 'popular justice', which gave rise to a new phenomenon in law: in place of the witch trail came to trial of those accused of assaulting those whom they believed to be witches. We now have one of history's acutest ironies: that the British in the course of Empire were attempting to reform the 'heathen' practices of subject people, while at home violence against suspected witches was on the increase. James Augustus St. John, author and traveller, was moved to write "...here in England, in the midst of our civilization, with the light of Christianity, ready to pour into the meanest hovels, violence against witches is still prevailing in our rural disreicts, while belief in witches is all but universal."

In 1895 a poor, elderly woman from Long Sutton in Lincolnshire was assaulted by a farming couple for supposedly bewitching their cows pigs hens and butter. Assaults of this kind even continued into the twentieth century. In 1935 a doctor from Poole in Dorset had to treat an old woman so badly scratched that she required stitches in twenty-two wounds. In essence there was often a two-way process at work: people claimed to possess traditional forms of 'folk wisdom' as a way of making money, which could very easily turn to accusations of black magic when things went wrong, or when tensions built up within communities that, despite social and industrial progress, were often claustrophobically self-contained.

Further social changes, and the continuing decline of the older rural ways of life, saw a steady decline in these traditional beliefs, as ordinary people caught up with educated opinion. But, once again, irony played its unique part: for while witchcraft was received in the public mind with increasing scepticism, it achieved a new life among sections of the middle class, inspired by the likes of Margaret Murray, author of The Witch-Cult in Western Europe. This, and much of the Wiccan movement that followed on, was really quite bogus; for people were not persecuted in the past for following ancient cults, but for malice and spite, and with malice and spite, the small change of village life. Clio the Muse 00:35, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

More Angkar

Thank you Clio Muse for much important detail. Sad i not live in Phnom Penn. Please help some more. I need who these people were:

Keo Meas

Kong Sophal

Tiv Ol

Vorn Vet

Thank you. Sreykor 08:45, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Hello again, Sreykor. Here is the information that you need:

Keo Meas. Ex-Issarak. Hed of the clandestine Phnom Penh Committee of the Communist movement in 1954, afterwards leader of the Praceachon group. Member of the Central Committee of the CPK in 1960. From 1969 Khmer Rouge representative in Hanoi. Purged as pro-Vietnamese and killed at Toul Sleng in 1976.

Kong Sophal. Alias Keu or Cheang. A schoolteacher who joined the communist movement in Phnom Penh in 1958. Also important in the Samlaut uprising in 1967. Member of the CC of the CPK from 1971, and promoted to the standing Committee in 1978. Arrested and killed at Toul Sleng in 1978.

Tiv Ol. Alias Penh. Student activist, then secondary school reacher in the 1950s and 1960s. Joined Pol Pot at Ratanakiri in 1968. Purged and killed at Toul Sleng in 1977.

Vorn Vet. Real name Pen Thouk, also known as Sok, Mean, Te, Koun, Veth and Vorn. Joined the Khmer Viet Minh in 1954 after dropping out of school. Member of the CC of the CPK and head of the Phnom Penh CPK from 1963. CPK Secretary of the Special Zone from 1971. Member of the Standing Committee. After 1976 Vice-Premier of the Economy. Purged and killed at Toul Sleng in 1978

Try to get hold of Pol Pot: The History of a Nightmare by Philip Short. It's all there. Clio the Muse 03:09, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

9-gun salute?

I recently attended a funeral for a man who had served in the Army Air Corps during WWII. There was a gun salute put on by the local VFW post. What I found confusing about it is that they only had three of the men fire their rifles three times for a total of a 9-gun salute. I perused the 21-gun salute page but couldn't find any reason for the 9 vs. 21 and a search of the net didn't provide anything noteworthy except that I'm apparently the only one that has noticed this. 9-gun salute wasn't any help either. So, what's the history behind this? Dismas|^(talk) 10:36, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I found this link where it says that the custom arose from a battlefield signal. When the dead and wounded had been cleared from the field, three volleys were fired to inform the enemy that the battle could recommence. It further points out that "gun" in "21-gun salute" and the like refers to artillery, really, not shoulder arms. --Milkbreath 11:38, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Cattle and stairs

Apparently one can lead a cow up a staircase but not down one. So how does one get her down? - Kittybrewster ☎ 10:53, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

In a lift perhaps? I've never heard that saying but I imagine it would be better to use a ramp for herding cattle than a staircase. GaryReggae 10:58, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

My grandmother used to take her pony upstairs to show it the reception rooms. No lift. But it was happy to walk down again. - Kittybrewster ☎ 11:12, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

There was a memorable episode of Hill Street Blues in which Andy Renko & Bobby Hill had to deal with exactly this situation. I believe a helicopter was used, but alas! the beast slipped from its harness. DuncanHill 12:29, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The correct answer is walk it down backwards. This same phenomenon is revealed in ramps as well. You can put a cow into a trailer head first, but you have to back it out. Little known fact; cows in Australia have to be backed up inclines but can come down head first. Beekone 13:11, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

management/external environment of an organisation

The task environment provides some important benefits to the organisation hence the need for a proper management of it's elements. Ouline and explain with examples from[ Ghana] five methods by which an organisation can influence vividly these elements. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Coffie Abraham Ackah (talk • contribs) 11:02, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

We're not supposed to give people answers to their homework here as that's cheating and you don't learn anything if someone else gives you the answer! I would suggest Googling "Task Environment" and that might give you some ideas for starting from unless somebody else here knows anything about the subject and can offer some hints. GaryReggae 12:52, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Christchurch College, Cambridge?

I am working on a new biographical article partially sourced from this book chapter from 1890. The second sentence says Thomas Jones graduated from "Christchurch College, Cambridge". What is that? The only English Christchurch College I see is Christ Church, Oxford not Cambridge. The closest Cambridge match I see is Christ's College, Cambridge but that appears far less prominent than the Oxford college and is not called Christchurch. Can anyone help determine which to link to? —Wknight94 (talk) 11:23, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Non-subscription sources such as the peerage don't give much info, but the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography (free access to some UK and international library users) states - "Thomas matriculated sizar from Christ's College, Cambridge, in November 1565. He commenced his BA studies in 1569 and took his degree in 1570. He proceeded MA in 1573". I've emailed you the instructions for accessing this text. Foxhill 12:18, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Thank you very much! —Wknight94 (talk) 13:09, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The It Girl

I'm considering working on a paper on the rise of the independent society lady in Georgian England. Can anyone give me a kick start? Yours sincerely, Shiela Spencer —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.147.191.31 (talk) 12:39, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps a good starting point would be our aticle on the Georgian Era, although admittedly it doesn't specifically mention the role of women in that period of time although it does mention the broad social changes brought about.GaryReggae 12:56, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

By the way, "It girl" is a 1910's or 1920's expression. I'm not sure what the expression "rise of the independent society lady in Georgian England" exactly means -- though of course there were the famous "Whig hostesses" at that time. AnonMoos 19:01, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The term was coined for Clara Bow, and we even have an article for it. -- JackofOz 22:35, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Shiela, I think you should begin by looking at the changes brought on by the English Civil War, in the creation of a new type of independent-minded woman, or 'It girl', if you prefer. Mary Astell was possibly the first woman in English history who had 'it' and, what's more, she knew she had it! There was a new consciousness, admittedly still limited in its application and scope, which saw woman as possessing the same kind of potential as men, frustrated by lack of education. It even made its way into Jonathan Swift's Gulliver's Travels, where it is proclaimed that it is monstrous of mankind "to give the females a different kind of education from the males, except in some articles of domestic management."

It was the Georgian period that opened ever more opportunities for woman of a certain social background, either as players in the public arena, or as authors, meeting a demand for printed material that men alone were not able to answer. Henrietta Howard, mistress of George II was possibly the greatest 'it girl' of the age, with a literary salon that attracted the likes of Swift, Alexander Pope and John Gay. Molly Leppell, Lady Hervey and Lady Mary Wortley Montague were also figures of intellectual and literary note who made an impact on their times, the harbingers of the Blue Stockings Society, founded in the 1750s by Elizabeth Montagu. Writing in the Critical Review in 1762, Elizabeth Carter observed "Learning is now grown so fashionable among the ladies, that it becomes every gentleman to carry his Latin and Greek with him whenever he ventures into female company." The new freedom was to find its most perfect expression in the writing of Mary Wollstonecraft, whose Thoughts on the Education of Daughters was fiercly critical of traditional male views on the matter. In many ways Georgian England was the high point in the cycle of the wheel for upper class and intelligent women. It started its downward course with the dawning of the Victorian age. Clio the Muse 02:41, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Prisoner of the Vatican

After the Italian army occupied Rome in September 1870 Pope Pius IX made an appeal for assistance to the entire Catholic world. Was there any response? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.130.15.240 (talk) 13:43, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Only the Republic of Ecuador responded to the appeal, breaking off diplomatic relations with Italy. Under the guidance of President Garcia Moreno, the national assembly voted a contribution amounting to half a year's state revenue to Peter's Pence. Clio the Muse 01:55, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Mary

Can anyone explain the reason for the various Marian Titles? Specifically, why would we refer to her in so many different ways, when she was a single entity? Each title even seems to be a patron saint of certain causes, unto itself. Some refer to specific geographical locations, others to concepts or attributes of Mary.

Secondly, is there any structure or order to why any given church takes on a certain name? It always strikes me that "Our Lady of Sorrows" isn't the most cheerful name for the church and school I drive by each day. (I of course understand that spreading cheer is not the primary mission of the Church.)

p.s. Should "Ark of the Covenant" really be in the list linked above? jeffjon 13:45, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

As to the latter: it is used by some Catholics.[1][2][3]  --Lambiam 14:48, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Aha, the word "new" in Ark_of_the_Covenant#Mary_as_Ark_of_the_New_Covenant foiled my search. jeffjon 15:12, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The reason for the multiple titles is the same reason other mythological figures are given multiple titles/epithets - different people at different times will be interested in promoting different aspects of the character's personality. Check out the list forApollo - there's a guy who got around! See also Zeus and Artemis for other examples.Matt Deres 15:16, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

See also 99 Names of God in the Qur'an. It is common in many Western religions to direct a prayer to a specific aspect of the prayer's object. A prayer for curing an illness of the eyes, for example might be addressed to Our Lady of Lourdes, while curing an illness of the back might be addressed to Maria de Guadalupe (these examples are made up purely for this demonstration). Steewi 00:50, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

personal names derived from Mary's titles

A few weeks ago (on the Language desk, i think) I raised the subject of names like Pilar, Consuelo, Concepción, Dolores which are short for Maria del Pilar etc. Yesterday I noticed the given name Nieves (Snows); I suspect that's of the same type, but what's the allusion? —Tamfang 20:16, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Have you read Dedication of Saint Mary Major? Algebraist 20:50, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Now why didn't I think of that! —Tamfang 01:21, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Interestingly, there's also a "Nuestra Senora de las Nieves" church in Oaxaca, Mexico; it refers to a different event (a miraculous snowfall that saved travelers in those mountains from thirst). Vultur 16:32, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Washington D.C.

The page at D.C. Statehood says "D.C. Statehood is a political campaign intended to grant the District of Columbia the full privileges of a U.S. state. Such privileges include not only full voting rights in the United States House of Representatives and United States Senate, but also full control over its own local affairs."

Who has control over its own local affairs currently?

24.229.119.116 13:46, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

See Washington, D.C.. -- kainaw™ 13:53, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Oh sorry, thanks!24.229.119.116 13:57, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Invasion 1805

What was the propaganda response in England to the threat of of a French invasion? Qurious Cat 14:04, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Try caricatures such as Image:Buonaparte, 48 hours after landing.jpg... AnonMoos 18:52, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The public was deluged by handbills and broadsheets, some printed at government expense, detailing the horrors that would follow from a French occupation. Some of it still manages to be acutely funny; that London was to be renamed 'Bonapartopolis', and that children would be shipped across the Channel for compulsory French lessons! French, as one might say, with tears. Others were altogether more sober, detailing horrors of the past, and horrors that history would take time to nurture; "The French will fix badges upon us, mark us in the cheek, shave our heads, split our ears. and clothe us in the habits of slaves."

Newspaper circulation was still restricted because of the prohibitive cost imposed by the stamp duty, so handbills were an important source of free information, distributed to every parish in England and Wales, with broadsheet versions affixed to church doors and other public spaces. Many claimed that there was nothing to fear, because the French would 'turn tail' at the sight of 'our village boys'. Other criticised this boastfulness and the dangers of creating a mood of overconfidence. Some concentrated on the grand politics, and still others on the social issues, fearful, perhaps, that the lower classes would break ranks, seduced by the revolutionary appeal of the French. The argument that an invasion might improve the condition of the poor was dismissed in handbills with titles like "No Change for the Worse, a mistaken notion", or yet another addressed to "My poorer fellow countrymen." In these it was argued that while the rich might be the first to suffer, this would impact on trade and on wages.

Poverty, it was argued in some, would not protect against rape, another important theme. One broadside warned "...the poorest honest labourer, who has a Mother, or a Sister, a Wife, or a Daughter, has, in truth, as much reason as the highest Duke to fear invasion." The poor man was warmed that to prevent his sweetheart suffering "a common intercourse with the most brutal of mankind", he must bond with the rich, for their fates were linked.

Napoleon is usually depicted in these publications as a "mere insect, a pigmy", or as the 'Corsican usurper, which manages to convey that he was a foreigner even in his own land. One handbill warned that he was the Beast described in the Book of Revelations.

Long after the threat had receded it was still casting a shadow over the British imagination. Well into the nineteenth century mothers were prone to warn naughty children that if they did not behave Boney would come and get them. Clio the Muse 01:48, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Post revolutionary economics

how were american politics effected after the economic crisis that occured post-Revolutionary war? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.254.155.240 (talk) 16:20, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

You might start with Presidency_of_George_Washington#Money_and_finances and Whiskey Rebellion, or are you talking about the period under the Articles of Confederation? Corvus cornix 16:38, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Camp Siegfried

I am looking for information on Camp Siegfried which was a Nazi run camp in Yaphank, Long Island during the 1930s. More often than not, the camp receives little than a two-sentence mention in reference to the German American Bund. I have searched on the internet for info but I find few details. Here are the links I have found:

http://www.newsday.com/community/guide/lihistory/ny-hs729a,0,7169.story http://www.longwood.k12.ny.us/history/index.htm

Here is the wiki link of the German American Bund. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German-American_Bund As you can see it does really give much on the camp.

Pictures

http://www.longwood.k12.ny.us/history/yaphank/campsiegfried.htm

I have learned that the camp was founded in 1935 and it served as the Nazi headquarters in America. I do know that there is book out that would answer most of my questions but it is fairly obscure, “Wunderlich's Salute.” I have searched through three libraries, twenty colleges and I can only find it on Amazon. The problem with that is I really don’t have the money to blow. More specifically, I would like a copy of the road map that shows Adolph Hitler Street in the township at the camp called “German Gardens”: Map 1219, Abstract 1238, Brookhaven Township, Suffolk Co, NY. I would also like to find the Horst-Wessel-Lied stanza that goes something to the effect of:

“When the Knife is red with Jewish blood

Then the German People will prosper”

Any and all help will be highly appreciated.

Future 17:19, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

If you live in Long Island, you should be able to get access to it at the New York Public Library (Humanities Library, the main branch with the lions). This page lets you search their collection; I did the search myself and it is available. Just be prepared to photocopy or take copious notes because you will not be able to take the book out of the building.--Pharos 18:10, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

You can also take it out at the Queens Borough Public Library (central branch) and the Brooklyn Public Library (central branch) — actually it's currently taken out in Brooklyn and due back on Nov. 7. I'm giving you this on the presumption that you probably live in Long Island, and that these may be more convenient to you.--Pharos 18:54, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I appreciate the effort but I live in the South East. That would be a bit of a drive. Future 21:39, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

OK, I've got the solution for you. Look in WorldCat (www.worldcat.org). I did, and they have the book at the German Hist. Institute as well as the Library of Congress in DC, the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill, and Truman State University as well as Washington University Libraries in Missouri (if that counts as the South). Hopefully one of these is relatively convenient for you.--Pharos 22:26, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Okay, thanks. I can get to the book but I was kind of hoping that someone would have a link to a electronic source with the map or something along those lines. Future 22:37, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I found a couple of links. The stanza is here about halfway down the page. There is a fragment of a map here showing Adolph Hitler and Goering streets. I'm still looking. --Milkbreath 23:51, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The lines you're looking for seem to be: "Wenn das Judenblut vom Messer spritzt/dann geht’s noch mal so gut, so gut". However, from a brief Google search, this appears to have been not the Horst Wessel Lied, but another Nazi song. Random Nonsense 01:31, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

The title of that marching song is Ihr Sturmsoldaten jung und alt, after the opening line.  --Lambiam 05:27, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=yaphank&ie=UTF8&ll=40.845867,-72.941709&spn=0.006566,0.01134&t=h&z=17 seems to be the current location. hilter street is now park blvd

A student at Harvard in the 1990s wrote an undergraduate thesis about Camp Siegfried that contains information from Marvin Miller's book as well as hundreds of other sources. A copy is on file in the Harvard University Library in Cambridge, Massachusetts. Good luck!

Lady Jane Grey

Why was Lady Jane Grey a more "acceptable" choice as queen instead of her mother, Lady Frances Brandon? I know Edward VI's will excluded Frances, but why? Corvus cornix 17:21, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Corvus. This is an interesting question, requiring a mixture of both fact and surmise to answer properly. The traditional view is that the ambition and influence of John Dudley, 1st Duke of Northumberland was decisive in having the succession settled on Lady Jane Grey, his daughter-in-law. More recent scholarship has questioned this assumption, placing far greater weight on Edward himself, who was beginning to emerge from Northumberland's tutelage. We know that he was anxious to secure the Protestant settlement in the church, which of course meant excluding his obdurate and conservative sister Princess Mary from her legitimate place in the succession. So, why not Frances or Princess Elizabeth, both of whom would have served the same Protestant purpose? The answer would seem to be that the first was too old and the second too young. More crucially, Elizabeth, unlike Jane, was unmarried. The fact that Jane was married to Guilford Dudley has led to the assumption that her place in the succession was no more than a way of perpetuating Northumberland's influence. However, all of the direct evidence suggests that the 'Device', the instrument of succession, was the work of Edward himself. He certainly used his authority to have it accepted by the Privy Council.

By this document the succession had originally been settled on any son who might be born to Frances and her husband, Henry Grey, 1st Duke of Suffolk. That had been set down before it was known just how desperately ill the king was, indicating a settled intention to elevate the Suffolk line before the question of Jane's own claim arose. But it seems that, in view of her age, the conclusion was reached that Frances was no longer capable of bearing a son, because all reference to her and her heirs male was subsequently removed. Not long aftrer the marriage of Jane to Dudley the succession was directed instead to the 'heirs male of the Lady Jane', clearly based on the assumption that time was not of immediate concern. But when the document was presented to the law officers three weeks later the wording was altered to read 'the Lady Jane and her heirs male'. Why the sudden amendment? The only conceivable answer is that the king's health was deteriorating rapidly, which meant putting Jane in the direct line of succession, rather than waiting for the birth of a possible son.

So, that's it. I can give you some references if you wish. Clio the Muse 01:09, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

That would be great. Thank you, Clio. Corvus cornix 02:56, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

As you wish, dear sir! I would suggest, depending how serious you are, Literary Remains of Edward VI ed. by J. G. Nichols (Roxburgh Club, 1857); Edward VI: The Threshold of Power by W. K. Jordan (London, 1970); Mary Tudor: A Life by D. Loades (Oxford, England and Cambridge, Massachusets, 1989); Edward VI; The Changing Picture by M. Christmas in History Review, March 1997. Clio the Muse 03:29, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Cheers. Corvus cornix 21:20, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Maximal distance between two places visited by one person : who broke what record?

Hello,

consider a certain person X, and all places he or she visited in his lifetime (places NOT on earth, outer space, the moon,... don't count) Take the maximal distance between two places (so that's at most 21000 kilometers) and let that be the "distance covered by person X".

Now is anything known about who might have broken what record?

People who pop up in my mind are Persian warriors, Chinese rulers, Alexander the Great, Roman messengers, Mongol warriors,....

Thank you, Evilbu 17:32, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, lots of people have been to the antipodes and they're almost all modern commercial airline passengers, I imagine (any New Zealander who's go on holiday in Spain, or vice versa). Nominally, the Apollo 13 astronauts traveled the farthest from home, though as the article explains it's not entirely clear they actually did go fatrther than the other Apollo missions.--Pharos 17:58, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

(ec) Even excluding outer space (I think that's what you mean, but it reads like you're excluding the Earth as well), I can't see how anyone from the ancient world is going to surpass even a relatively trivial modern business traveler. Take any of the modern explorers who have visited both poles and the only room to surpass that mark relates to the equatorial bulge of the Earth. There are comparatively few antipodes for which one member of the pair isn't open ocean, it's highly likely that somebody has determined what antipodes are the most separated (presumably those on the equator), and some rich guy has surely visited them. The chances of any ancient Chinese, Persian, Roman, et al, doing the same is utterly negligible. — Lomn 18:04, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

• FYI, this site makes it easy to play around with antipodes. The only major land antipodes on the equator appear to be in Indonesia with their opposites in South America. --Sean 18:34, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Maybe I wasn't very clear! Of course I know that right now it is much easier, but my question is : who marked what milestones? Who could have been the first person to reach 10,000 kilometers? Or 5000?Evilbu 18:21, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The unknown-to-history first settlers of Madagascar made a trip of over well over 5,000 km, likely in a single person's lifetime, 1500+ years ago.--Pharos 18:32, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Until the middle ages, the farthest-travelling individuals were unlikely to have had their exploits recorded in texts which have survived to the present. According to some, Herodotus may have travelled as far north as a little ways up the Don river, and as far south as the Egyptian city of Thebes. Herodotus also recounts the story of a Phoenician ship which allegedly circumnavigated Africa. Alexander the great and many soldiers in his army travelled as far west as areas in current-day Serbia and as far east as beyond the Indus river... AnonMoos 18:42, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

(edit conflict)The Phoenicians that Necho II probably sent around Africa traveled about 7750 km from home in the 6th century BC. If the account is true, that would almost certainly be the record up to that time.--Pharos 18:46, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Walking is a vastly under-appreciated method of travel. Pick any two points on the earth's surface that can be connected by a land route: You have no way to prove that at least one prehistoric individual did or did not visit both points. A determined explorer can average ten miles a day even in what we think of as harsh conditions: look at the Inuit as an example. At ten miles a day, you need 1250 days (less than four years) to traverse the distance between antipodal points. Double that for non-straight-line travel, and double it again for stops along the way, and you still have less than 14 years. Start at age 15, end at age 29, and you have a pre-Inuit in Terra del Fuego or a pre-Hottentot in Kamchatka. We have many historical examples of large distances covered by walking and prehistoric-level technology: John Rae, Lewis and Clark, and John Muir spring to mind. -Arch dude 00:43, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

I would think Ibn Battuta set some sort of record for distance travelled. Adam Bishop 00:51, 1 November 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.210.170.48 (talk)

Pytheas is another good candidate for early record holder, having visited far enough south to see the sun in the Northern sky, and Iceland. If it was only Norway he discovered, it might not be quite a record for that time, but it might be.209.244.30.221 12:40, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Hafiz-e Shirazi

Tell me persian (original) of these two hafez poems:

1.My Brilliant Image

One day the sun admitted I am just a shadow.

I wish I could show you The Infinite Incandescence That has cast my brilliant image!

I wish I could show you When you are lonely or in darkness

The Astonishing Light Of your own Being!

2.The Sun Never Says

Even after all these years, the Sun never says to the Earth "You owe Me."

Look what happens with a Love like that, It lights the whole sky.Flakture 20:01, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

This question would do better on the Language Desk. In the mean time, we have an article for Hāfez-e Šīrāzī which has a surprising number of parallel texts. Xn4 03:36, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Fuller and the Red Army

To what extent did the the ideas of J F C Fuller influence the Red Army? 86.151.241.224 21:16, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

According to our article, Fuller's 'blitzkrieg' ideas had little direct influence on the Red Army, which developed its own doctrine of deep operations. Of course, the success of blitzkrieg as practiced by Germany was a major influence on the thinking of the Red Army, although apparently the extent to which Heinz Guderian was influenced by Fuller is subject to debate. I can't speak personally for the accuracy of this. Algebraist 21:36, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

He was an important influence on the thinking of Mikhail Tukhachevsky, who did much to disseminate Fuller's ideas on mechanised warfare among the Soviet officer corps in the early 1930s. It was under his sponsorsip that a Russian language edition of The Reformation of War was published in Moscow in 1931. In his foreword to the book Tukhachevsky wrote "Fuller's great merit is that he does not just study past experiences but, by keeping track of technological advance, endevours to indicate a direction for the structure and equipment of land forces as a result of which future war might take new, more effective forms." A brilliant soldier in his own right, Tukhachevsky dismissed Fuller's more theoretical speculations, instructing his brother officers to concentrate instead on his ideas about attacking the enemy throughout his depth, which "must undoubtedly result in more intensive manoeuvre and more decisive tactical action." Clio the Muse 23:40, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Gerald Laverne? Jerrold Laverne?

What is the correct spelling of this R&B artist's name? Wiwaxia 21:54, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Do you mean Gerald Levert? ---Sluzzelin talk 22:41, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

That's it! Thank you so so much! Is he saying "whxxps" or "once" in that "DJ Don't" song? (found the title.) Wiwaxia 22:55, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Enlish word that means "sound of tires on a wet road"?

Someone I know has told me that her late grandfather, who was an English professor, taught her a word that means "the sound tires make on a wet road" or "the sound tires make on a road in the rain". She can't remember anything else about the word. I've searched the full text of the Oxford English Dictionary, using a database my library provides, but found no likely matches. Any help is appreciated, whether it be the answer or some tips to further my search. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.188.61.11 (talk) 22:02, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

• Um, The Sound of Changing Places? Or is that reference too obscure? --M@rēino 22:50, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Thrum. Drone. Whirr. --Milkbreath 01:04, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Swoosh. Marco polo 01:12, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Screech? Although that's probably more the "sound of tyres suddenly braking on a wet road". Hammer Raccoon 13:11, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

You might have better luck if you posted this question on the Language Ref Desk. -- JackofOz 22:04, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Siss. Hum. Swoosh. Will you know it when you see it, or are you saying that there is a word whose definition is exactly that? --Milkbreath 23:21, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

What is controversial about the book 'How the Mind Works'?

I have recently read this book, by Steven Pinker. Its the best book ive ever read- i cant praise it highly enough, and i now idolise Pinker. I says on the blurb that it has been considered controversial by some people. What exactly is their problem with it? He disses behaviouralism, and certain thinking in the social sciences, but what specifically is peoples beef with him? Not sure if this is the appropriate desk to ask this question on, but it is literature. Has anyone else read it by any chance? Is there a website where you can discuss what you thought of a book? Sorry if this is innapropriate but i implore everyone to read it immediately. Willy turner 23:55, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Try Amazon.com - book reviews. - Kittybrewster ☎ 00:16, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

The page you want at amazon.com is here. Xn4 01:24, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Additionally, Pinker is especially willing, if I recall correctly, to say that current theories about how the mind works should be used to govern how people view their world, including on a social level. It is usually controversial when any scientist attempts to colonize other domains (especially the social) with their personal interpretations of theories, whether they be cognitive science, Darwinism, etc. Pinker also weighs very heavily towards the emphasis on "nature" in the nature/nurture debate, and while he definitely is known for this more in his other books (e.g. The Blank Slate), if I recall (it has been years since I read How the Mind Works) in that book he touches on that as well. Additionally he somewhat caricatures theories of others, e.g. his attack on Behaviorism and the social sciences does not really correspond with how either would self-describe their theories, but that sort of objection is to be expected, I suppose. --24.147.86.187 02:05, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

• I can't think of any scientist who prominently engages the general readership who is *not* controversial. Maybe Stephen Hawking, but only because no one's worldview depends on the behavior of black holes. --Sean 13:03, 1 November 2007 (UTC)