Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2014 December 17

December 17

Template:Infobox western riding timed event

Template:Infobox western riding timed event (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Poorly designed, vertical navbox with only four links; was used on only two articles, now orphaned. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 22:57, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

• Strong support: On behalf of WikiProject Equine. Infobox sport is perfectly adequate and used for all of the other horse sport articles that have infoboxes. (Most should) Montanabw^(talk) 23:15, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Weather/ disaster notices

Template:Current tornado outbreak

Template:Current tornado outbreak (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Template:Current disaster (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Propose merging Template:Current tornado outbreak with Template:Current disaster.
Both are currently unused due to the lack of disasters getting attention right now. It would be better to have a smaller number of templates to remember when one is actually needed, and there's no need to be so precise in the wording. A smaller number of templates will also make it easier to update the wording across all current disaster templates, as I just had to do. -- Beland (talk) 22:37, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Template:Current tropical cyclone

Template:Current tropical cyclone (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Template:Current disaster (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Propose merging Template:Current tropical cyclone with Template:Current disaster.
It's currently a simple call to the other template, and there's no particular need to be more specific. These are actually both unused right now, since there are no current disasters getting a lot of attention. Better to have a smaller number of templates to remember when one does occur and a template needs to be slapped on the article. -- Beland (talk) 21:30, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Combined discussion

• Delete both weather templates in favour of {{Current}} or {{Current disaster}} as apprpriate. Otherwise, merge the tornado & cyclone templates as, say "Current weather event". Not all weather events are disasters. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 23:06, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Template:Cleanup

Template:Cleanup (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Previously, the main problem with this template was that it was getting drive-by tagged without the tagger ever explaining what needed cleaning up. This seems to have been at least somewhat remedied by adding a "reason" field… and while people are at least bothering to fill in that field now, I'm still seeing rampant misuse.

A search of some recent transclusions (articles in ‪Category:Articles needing cleanup from December 201‬4)

• 100 Gigabit Ethernet: "inconsistent use of plurality or singularity for companies as collective nouns" — then use {{copyedit}}
• 1979 New York Mets season: "the section has capitalization, punctuation, and grammatical errors" — again, use {{Copyedit}} or remove that section entirely
• 2014 ATP World Tour and 2014 WTA Tour: "Statistics table has not been updated to reflect the final standings for the 2014 season" — then use {{Update}}
• 991st Field Artillery Battalion: No reason given. Article is only a couple sentence fragments, making its topic completely unclear, so I've tagged it for {{db-context}} instead.
• A.L.B (Watches): "needs putting into paragraphs etc." — again, {{copyedit}} or {{reorganize}}
• A23 virus: "this article has almost no content, and is severely lacking in comparison to similar pages" — replaced with {{context}}
• Melyssa Ade: "Very little BLP information here. Needs more reliable sources". — use {{Missing information}} instead
• Anorexia nervosa: "incomplete citations, wikilinking, manual of style, off-topic or in wrong section (not all content is related to causes), and passive voice (attribution)" — use {{Copyedit}}, {{off topic}}, etc.
• Appeal to emotion: " WP:MOS issues throughout, overquoting, style of writing, wikilinking, curly quotes, citation cleanup ... and more." — again, {{copyedit}}
• Association of Southeast Asian Nations: " There are multiple sections included here that could form individual pages on their own. Inconsistent language, style and grammar used. Suspicions of authors/academics adding their own works in the page without full disclosure" — use {{Split section}}, {{Copyedit}} (which is already on there anyway), and {{COI}}
• Band Famous: "Unencyclopedic tone" — an {{Inappropriate tone}} would be appropriate here, but how about a prod instead since they seem non-notable?

I could go on and on, but the template's problems are still manifold. This template seems to fall under the same pitfalls as the deprecated {{wikify}} or {{expand}}, in that it's too broad in scope. Many in previous AFD's argued that WP:ITSUSEFUL which makes no sense. Most of the arguments in the last AFD in 2012 were suggesting that the "reason" field be made mandatory. But the samplings above show that, even if the "reason" field is used, there is always at least one other template that gives the exact same message.

In short, the template is way too broad and vague to serve a specific purpose anymore. 99.9% forms of cleanup have their own template, so there's no reason to shoehorn something like "this article needs copy editing" into this generic template. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 21:16, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

• Comment: Having a single well-known template with a free-text "reason" parameter makes it easy for editors to tag articles, without sorting through a bewildering array of tags. It doesn't matter to me what the tag is, as long as it's tagged with something, so it gets noticed by cleanup editors and warns/apologizes to readers. -- Beland (talk) 21:32, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Template:SBL team

Template:SBL team (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

The template is only used in one location, where it could be replaced by Template:Infobox basketball club. Diannaa (talk) 21:05, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

• Delete as redundant, after replacing now orphaned. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 23:11, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Template:Infobox Song Contest

Template:Infobox Song Contest (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

An unnecessary fork of {{Infobox Eurovision}}, intended to pre-empt discussion at Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2014 December 6#Template:Infobox ABU Radio (and possibly wider discussions at Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2014 December 6#Song contest templates). This new template gives no credit to the creators of the earlier version, including significant contributions by User:Thumperward.

Any necessary improvements should be made to the original, {{Infobox Eurovision}}, based on {{Infobox}}, then that template renamed over this one (albeit with corrected capitalisation); leaving a redirect, rather than the recent and unnecessary practice of manually replacing templates ([1], [2] etc.). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:06, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

• Delete + renaming of {{Infobox Eurovision}}, keeping the history intact. -- [[ axg // ✉ ]] 17:43, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

• Yeah, the responsible party needs cluebatted here. If someone points me at whatever changes are required to fix the original so that the various forks are unneeded I'll see if I can do it (along with {{infobox}}ing it). Obviously all the bulk-edits should be undone in the interim. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) (talk) 17:41, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
• Support deletion again. For all the same reasons as the last go-around. Montanabw^(talk) 23:20, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
• Keep considering it was already apparent from the discussions of 6 December that this infobox is the new universal replacement of {{Infobox Eurovision}} - and it was actually suggested to make such universal box by none other than Pigsonthewing. And I think it may need to be reminded that the nominator actually has a ArbCom sanction on himself regarding discussion of infoboxes - of which can result in a year-long block. Andrew even stated in the discussions of 6 December, that the other nominated infoboxes would not be deleted until the replacement was ready and rolled out. This is the replacement. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 11:27, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
  • If you feel I'm in breach of a sanction, please raise the matter at WP:AE (although note that similar attempts to use that to silence deletion discussions have failed). Otherwise, you are just making ad hominem attacks. Who is "Andrew"? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:50, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Template:Banis

Template:Banis (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Redundant due to Template:Sikhism and Template:Sikh scriptures Vigyani_talk^{ਯੋਗਦਾਨ} 00:49, 17 December 2014 (UTC)