Talk:Akron, Ohio

Suggestions

We need to add the zoo to the section on culture! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.227.219.84 (talk) 06:35, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

i think you should add more to akron ohio iyt had a lot more to offer now that the downtown area is looking alot better like the civic theatre university of akron, akron aeros stadium etc...

As a resident of Akron, I was sort of dissapointed that there was no reference to any local sports at all. The Akron Aeros (Cleveland Indians AA farm team) are perrennial division champs. some other sports include the Racers (Pro Softball), International Basketball, (I forget the name, but there IS a team), University of Akron sports like Football (conference champs), Mens Soccer (ranked #1 in nation for most of last year, #7 this year), Mens Basketball (Post season NIT), Womens Track (Conf. Champs in indoor, outdoor and Cross Country last year) LeBron's "King James Tournament" and that TV show on MTV2. Also, the PGA Firestone Invitational. I think sports could be its own section. If it is possible, please do this. Sports are paramount in this this part of the world. Believe me.

Akron's obscure musical heritage

As a non-Akronite [?Akronian, whatever] I have always been amazed that the town seems to have spawned a larger than normal number of bands and musicians who were prominent in punk / new wave / alternative etc music. I note that some such as Chrissie Hynde and the Mothersbaugh brothers of Devo are mentioned in the people list at the end of the main entry, but perhaps a section that a more knowledgeable person could start, listing and linking to bands would also be a useful addition and, frankly, make the place seem a bit more exciting. No offence meant of course, but sometimes the objective tone of Wikipedia articles does tend to flatten out the highlights a bit [[[Special:Contributions/60.242.50.195|60.242.50.195]] (talk) 05:26, 6 January 2008 (UTC)].

Expansion

I don’t think it was necessary to remove Fairlawn’s Summit Mall. I realize it is not in Akron, but it is quite close and serves a large part of Akron’s population. The only rational I had for leaving it in was the picture of Summit Mall, which I had a particular liking for. Sorry about all the spelling errors, I didn’t bother to proofread it. Other possible points of expansion: breakdown of neighbourhoods, dining, and entertainment.

Limits of Akron

I thought about it when I removed the wording describing Summit Mall as part of Akron. While it is obviously part of the Akron area, the article is titled "Akron, Ohio". The picture was nice and the content was otherwise good, but someone reading the article who isn't from the area would assume that Summit Mall is in the Akron city limits, just like Chapel Hill and Rolling Acres. The article should be able to stand on its own without prior knowledge required so that is why I made that change.

UltraSkuzzi, you are adding a lot of good content. I feel sort of bad going through and correcting things but I want to keep things accurate so that is why I'm making changes here and there.

==

Hi. it's me, twitch. i think you should emphasize the fact that lebron was born here. put it in the main article, not tucked away at the end. other than that and a handful of punctuation and spelling errors, none of which are really important, it's amazing!

ooh wait, you did say "eights" instead of "eighties" at one point. ficks it. :)

Metro Size

I agree Bernie, the metro is exaggerated. However, it depends on what the metro area is said to be. I based Akron’s on what the Cleveland article said. I'm not sure how that number came about. I think they added up Summit, Portage, Medina, Cuyahoga, and Stark Counties to form that number. Since there is no defined metropolitan area, at least in censes terms, what should it be defined as? I would like to reach a conclusion on this since this would affect articles on other cities as well... - UltraSkuzzi

I took the definition of the metropolitan area from the Census Bureau metropolitan area list, where it listed Summit and Portage counties. I realize that defining a metropolitan area includes a lot of judgment and some politics, but I figured the 2-county Census Bureau definition provides a standard measure. --Beirne 12:39, Mar 15, 2005 (UTC)

The Metro area of Cleveland-Akron is 2,945,000 and does not include Stark County (Canton). It includes Lorain, Cuyahoga, Lake, Geauga, Portage and Summit Counties. Stark county is its own MSA. If Canton's MSA is included, the popoulation is more like 3.5 million.

Split up the article?

I noticed that the article is up to 33K, 1K over the preferred maximum size. The limit isn't critical anymore but it helps keep articles manageable and easy to read. Should we split it up? If we do I'd suggest putting the neighborhood section in its own article since it is the largest section and can stand well on its own. --Beirne 00:54, 22 October 2005 (UTC)

That sounds fine...just make sure that the Akron properly refers to it.

--UltraSkuzzi 16:15, 22 October 2005 (UTC)

I'm not sure if the neighborhood section is properly referenced, it took me about a minute just to find it buried in the article, perhaps it could be placed in a more prominent location?

I placed it the way the Related topic links are done in the Cleveland article, which seemed fairly standard. I'm not sure where else it could go but post any ideas that you have. I did notice that the Cleveland article lists the neighborhoods in the article with links to some of the neighborhoods. That is a possibility, although some of the articles will be short on their own.

--Beirne 12:10, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

Time Warner

Can TWC position 23 really be considered 'public access', doesn't position 15 serve that purpose. I've never seen anything on 23 that wasn't TWC sanctioned. Perhaps it would be better to say 'cable only'? --UltraSkuzzi 20:43, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

Heads up

A little bird told me (okay, I got interviewed) that the Akron Beacon-Journal is planning to run an article about Wikipedia, with a possible sidebar of some Akron-related articles that are redlinks or stubs, to encourage people from Akron to get involved. So you may hopefully notice an influx of new editors soon. Jacqui^★ 18:53, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

This is correct. Let's make the article shine! --UltraSkuzzi 01:17, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Akron means "high"

I found this source which says that Akron is derived from the Greek word meaning "high". Summit County is so named because the highest part of the Ohio and Erie Canal was in Summit. I can't help thinking these are related. I'm trying to come up with a good way of phrasing this in the header. Thoughts? JDoorjam Talk 04:03, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

Mickey Lee Brown Vandalism

Allotropic has been removing Mickey Lee Brown from the famous people from Akron section. --Beirne 22:32, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

nicknames

wouldn't most of the nicknames for akron be considered speculation? theres only one nickname up there that i've ever heard of officially, and that was that its the "Rubber City", and about the ak-rowdy nickname, it doesn't even say in the link that it was successful in commercializing the nickname --Ditre 15:55, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

add: krackron would falls under Wikipedia:No_original_research if it is just being used in myspace by teenagers --Ditre 14:25, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

• its not an "official" nickname. It is a nickname used by citizens. The reason for listing nicknames is for when somebody says, "yeah my friend lives in krackron", they go to wikipedia type in krackron and see akron. Lally-ho. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Allatropicalis (talk • contribs) 01:58, February 20, 2007.
• also, ak-rowdy doesnt have to be successfuly commercialized to be a nickname. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Allatropicalis (talk • contribs) 02:01, February 20, 2007.
  • I think the bext thing to do would be to find references that meet verifiability requirements and cite them properly and delete the rest. I am not sure the AK-rowdy website is a suitable reference. Might I suggest asking for a third opinion? Ruhrfisch 02:54, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
• {its not an "official" nickname. It is a nickname used by citizens. [by Allatropicalis]} Not a publisher of original thought and verifiability there must be a reliable source to include it --Ditre 16:32, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

A reliable resource to prove that citizens of akron refer to it as krackron would be records of akron citizens using it, which can be found scattered within myspace and other popular chat sites, but not all bundled together on one site. This is just one of thoes things that work differently from other info put on wikipedia.

Wikipedia is not a publisher of original thought, if its just a few citizens using it here and there then it is not wikipedia/encyclopedia acceptable. This is an online encyclopedia, not a blog. I'd also like to point out Verifiability --Ditre 22:21, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

not relevent douche bag. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.108.176.123 (talk) 18:53, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Rager Media in Akron?

The publications section of the Akron article recently had Rager Media added as well as 4 of their titles. Rager Media appears to be in Medina, and the books are not about Akron, although the authors appear to be from the city. Prior to Rager being added, the publications list included publishers in Akron or books about Akron. Should Rager and their books be on this page? Their inclusion here is close to commercial promotion. --Beirne 20:10, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

sources

I have recently tagged this article because it is lacking on references. Look very closely, citations are needed in alot of places still. --OHWiki 06:05, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

The most detailed and comprehensive account of Rager Media's presence in Akron is the Paula Schleis article about Rager on the front page of the Beacon Journal business section on May 06, 2007. The article is no longer available for free on the ABJ website, but remains in the archives. The mailing address for Rager Media is Medina, but the main editing work is done in Akron, and 3 of Rager's 5 owners are from Akron, and attended Akron Public Schools. Other secondary sources about Rager Media can be found from newspapers and magazines around the U.S. if you put "Rager Media" into any search engine in quotes. The question of Rager Media's "Akron-ness" is a slippery one, due to the nature of its largely online operation. The poetry editor, Eric T. Racher, was born and raised in Akron, but now works and lives in Bologna, Italy, and the fiction editor, James Egan, is a professor at the University of Akron. The chief editor, Christopher White, works mostly from his apartment near downtown Akron. Nonetheless, Rager Media seems to work hard to cultivate an "Akron" identity. Akronism 07:13, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Seawolf

Does anyone have any idea why the attack submarine USS Seawolf's logo/badge has the motto "Rising towards the 21st century with Akron, Ohio?"

Ajmako (talk) 18:07, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Because the city "sponsored" the ship's construction in the mid-1990's. I had a clipping about it from the Beacon Journal my parents sent me when I was overseas. Not sure exactly what it meant to sponsor the construction of a submarine, but it was a big thing for cities to do back then.

Ted Olsen a native son?

This was news to me, and when I clicked on his entry, there was no mention of Akron. Are we perhaps talking about a different Ted Olsen -- in other words, not the former solicitor general.

Otherwise, I recommend that it be deleted.

Nenthe (talk) 00:49, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Pop Culture

It seems some local bands are trying to use Wikipedia to enhance their image. I've never heard of The Morgue Boyz nor V.E.C. I think the list of famous Akronites should be regulated to people that those outside of Akron would reconize. —Preceding unsigned comment added by KasinoRoyale (talk • contribs) 18:22, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Notable natives

Why is there a section on notable natives on the main article if there is a article on List of people from Akron, Ohio. If someone has the time to edit this, they need to make sure that all of the notable people from the Akron, Ohio article are on the List of people from Akron, Ohio article and remove the Notable natives section. A See also section needs to be added and under it a wikilink to List of people from Akron, Ohio. OHWiki (talk) 01:23, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Photo caption

Dear editor, the caption under a photo in the Infrastructure heading appears to be the Ohio Bell Telephone Company building, not an apartment building. The reference would be myself I guess as I helped construct the structure in the foreground in the 60's known as Cascade Plaza. Also FirstMerit in another photo is First Merit. Please know I appreciate the greater effort on the article. I thought you might appreciate a heads up. Checkpoint one four (talk) 23:30, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

Although I did not post the captions for any of the above mentioned pictures, why not just change the captions yourself rather than provide a lengthy explanation of the error here? The fact that you posted in the talk page means you too are an editor and this article by no means has a single editor. You don't need references for a picture caption unless it is making some sort of claim that isn't in the article. Be bold with the articles, especially in things you know! --JonRidinger (talk) 00:40, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

P.S. I know for one thing Ohio Bell doesn't exist under that name, it is now AT&T (a logo which appears on the first floor of the building in the picture), so I doubt the actual building name is still the "Ohio Bell Telephone Company Building." I also checked "First Merit" and it is indeed "FirstMerit" (no space) according to their website.

In popular culture section removed

I removed this section as it was unreferenced and almost all of the entries did not seem to meet WP:NN. I think most people would characterize this as cruft. Please see some model city FAs, such as New York City or Cleveland, Ohio. They do not even have an "in popular culture" section. Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 12:31, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

And I have it removed twice again. I hope the new editors reintroducing it will start a discussion, until then we can continue removing it. To give one example: why is "In the NBC television show The Office, the fictional business Dunder Mifflin has an office located in Akron, Ohio." important for the city of Akron? The whole, rambling section of trivia could be summarised as "Akron is often used as a setting or otherwise mentioned in popular media", with a few example refs, if people feel it is really necessary to mention this (every moderately large city in the US has been mentioned in a number of TV shows and movies, this is not remarkable or noteworthy in any way): no people are going to visit Akron because it was mentioned in The Office, unlike e.g. the link between Verona and Romeo and Juliet. Fram (talk) 20:32, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

I also removed it twice. Editors need to understand that just because something has a third-party reference doesn't mean it's notable or necessary to include in an article. Always look at comparable articles that have been featured for examples of what to and what to not include in a given article. Wikipedia is not an encyclopedia of everything. --JonRidinger (talk) 01:55, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Reliable sources

Just a reminder about sources: they need to be verifiable and neutral. Wikipedia articles should not be used as a primary source in any case, but especially when that article itself is unsourced. See WP:SOURCES for more information about which sources to use and how to properly cite them. On a side note, the "fictional characters" list seems like a new incarnation of the "popular culture" section with a different name. Make sure all info in this article is encyclopedic, not just "interesting." This is an online encyclopedia, not a promotional page or a website about everything. Readers can get a very good idea of what Akron is like without the list of fictional characters who are said to be "from" the city in their given show or work. --JonRidinger (talk) 05:39, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Clutter

This article is cluttered with a large amount of irrelevant information. Such was the case for the section "Meth Capital of Ohio." Not only was there no source which named Akron the actual "Meth Capital of Ohio" but most of the information in the section was about meth labs and other statistics for Ohio, which are relevant only to articles on meth use, not an article on the city of Akron. Please make sure all information is verifiable and relevant to readers' understanding of Akron, Ohio. Just because something is "interesting" doesn't mean it's worthy to be placed in an encyclopedic article. This isn't the place for an article full of trivia. As was stated previously, the "Akron in pop culture" section, although it has third party sources, the section is largely non notable and completely unencyclopedic since pretty much every major city is mentioned in pop culture to some degree and you don't see sections for those cities, even cities that are frequently used as the locations of TV shows and movies like New York, Washington, and Los Angeles. --JonRidinger (talk) 05:27, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

We need to start hacking away at all of this crap. I'll start hopefully soon. I'd like to use this section to collaborate on getting this article back to the status it used to be. §hep • ¡Talk to me! 02:20, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

I've got a start at Talk:Akron, Ohio/Sandbox. I knocked out a lot of useless info. Help would be appreciated as I don't do too well with prose. §hep • ¡Talk to me! 01:00, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Meth capital

While this is significant information, shouldn't this section be on the page about Summit County? All sources label Summit County, not Akron specifically, as the "Meth capital of Ohio." I think some mention of the high amount of meth use should be made in this article, but the current section really doesn't fit or make much sense. --JonRidinger (talk) 22:43, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

I would agree with this statement, the Meth Capital information was removed because it specifically plagiarized from the Akron Beacon Journal article posted on Ohio.com. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 167.127.107.9 (talk) 14:11, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Appears the IP who's been editing here has undid the removal. Since it has been reported to be plagiarized I'll remove it again. §hep • ¡Talk to me! 18:38, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

what "plagiarized" are you seeing??? what two words? half a sentence?(WOW) restating true factual information isnt plagtrism —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.61.87.219 (talk) 19:28, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Restating info without a source IS plagiarism no matter how true it is. I think the problem here is that much of the section was simply lifted into this article word for word without being properly attributed (it would need to be in quotes, not just referenced). If the section is important enough to be included, then it needs to be rephrased and referenced. My personal opinion is that the "Meth Capital of Ohio" in the Beacon-Journal article is clearly referring to Summit County (not Akron specifically) so only a passing mention really needs to be included in the article (the info relative to Akron), not a section. Most of the info would be better suited for an article about meth use in Ohio. Remember, the main subject of the article is Akron, not tangential information that is related to Akron. --JonRidinger (talk) 03:42, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm frankly tired of this rude IP. The Meth section has nothing to do with Akron, "Birthplace of Televangelism" has almost nothing to do with Akron and does not deserve a full section, "Birthplace of Devilstrips" is generally unreferenced and trivial, "Riot of 1900" and "Six day Civil Disorder of July 1968" need wikified, more referencing, and cleanup (I placed cleanup tags and they were removed with no summary as to why and nothing had been changed), "Criminal Organizations" is just a bio of that Borgio guy; it is too inclusive and should be removed, "Zeppelins and blimps" is generally unreffed except for one sentence, "Cityscape" doesn't even have any prose, "Culture and entertainment" is pretty much unreffed and the music section doesn't follow the MoS, "Infrastructure" has no references, "List of events and objects the city of Akron witnessed first" and "Akron in popular culture" are way too trivial, most of the "Fictional characters" are redlinks. I know the above IP hasn't added all of those sections but they were all added by users who dropped off the map one after the other. On top of that the IP then attacks those who they believe are wrong, when I was just acting on someone saying the material was plagiarized. To the new editors: We have Policies on editing, you must follow them. §hep • ^Talk 04:01, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Adding to that, there are standards here too. Go take a look at other articles to see what constitutes a "good" or "featured" article here. You'll note they are written well and don't have a bunch of lists and trivia items; the information contained within the articles is relevant to helping the readers understand the main subject better, but not giving them an exhaustive history of EVERYTHING related to the subject. For a few excellent examples, see:

• Boston
• Cleveland, Ohio
• Ann Arbor, Michigan
• New York City
• Houston
• Washington, DC

These are a few examples of featured (meaning the best of the best) articles. For a larger list of featured or just well-written articles, see Wikipedia:WikiProject_Cities#Progress. There is no reason this article can't be a featured article, however, it is a long way from being such due to the enormous amount of trivial and tangential information (and unsourced speculation) it contains. --JonRidinger (talk) 04:19, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

"Birthplace of Devilstrips"

I removed this section because not only is it largely irrelevant to the article (it's trivia, not encyclopedic) but it makes it sound like the devilstrip concept (which is a term that appears to be unique to Akron) was established in Akron. The section itself said that a devilstrip is referred to by other terms (tree lawn, sidewalk buffer, etc.) in different parts of the country, so to say that Akron is the "birthplace" of them is neither true nor is it verifiable. The only thing that Akron may have been the "birthplace" of is the term devilstrip, not the concept. As such, devilstrip falls under trivia and even then it isn't significant trivia as it is a term virtually unknown outside of Akron. There are many more sections that need to be either removed completely or reduced and better integrated into this article. Please do not place this section back into the article. --JonRidinger (talk) 18:54, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Zeppelins and blimps

I removed this section because it was bascially a word-for-word copy of the source listed at the end seen here. While the manufacturing of zeppelins and blimps is a notable part of the history of Akron, it needs to be written in our own words. Even with the source listed in the footnotes, it is still considered plagiarism and is against Wikipedia policy to simply cut and paste the contents of a webpage to an article. On top of that much of the information lifted from the source was about zeppelins, not about Akron, which again in the subject here. Citing a source does not give an author the right to quote an entire article (especially without using quotes to denote the fact that it is from somewhere else). --JonRidinger (talk) 19:15, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Plagiarism

Please become familiar with the concept of plagiarism. Just because a few words are reordered and one small citation is made at the end of a section does not mean it is not plagiarism, which is defined on Wikipedia as "the use or close imitation of the language and thoughts of another author and the representation of them as one's own original work." (Wikipedia: Plagiarism, emphasis added). I removed several sections because they were almost identical to the sources at the end. Some of the sections had additional information that was largely tangential and was unsourced at that. --JonRidinger (talk) 19:35, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Editors

It seems a duo has been formed to disrupt the page, there edits are questionable, one of the two are from kent which had there stadium spray painted with "AK-Rowdy" so some envy comes into play. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.61.87.219 (talk) 20:30, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Hi there. First of all, others are never to speak badly of other users. Please read WP:CIVIL. The location or hometown of a user has nothing to do with the content dispute of the article you currently have. Your page modifications which go against are policies and guidelines are the disruptive edits and the page will be restored to an acceptable quality whether you believe the changes are needed or not. I suggest you take some time to actually read our policies and stop the disruption. Further disruption may result in a block. §hep • ^Talk 20:38, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

The "duo" consists of experienced editors who want this article to be much better than it currently is; an encyclopedic article instead of a collection of tangential trivia. All of our edits have been fully explained on the talk page and in the edit summaries and both of us have established user accounts and user pages. And what does the vandalism of Dix Stadium have to do with anything? --JonRidinger (talk) 20:44, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

I would state that one editor is "sensitive" for his calls of foul, but it might result in a block?????(i dont even remember cursing, threatening of any sort. the duo is the only 2 out the whole wikipedia community to have problems which leaves concearn of a conspiracy. but fair enough for now the article will be in crisp clean top rate shape by weeks end. Ak-Rowdy stadium formaly known as dick's stadium is one editor's college team home which his page says hes from —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.61.87.219 (talk) 20:56, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Please read the talk page above this. There are other editors who have expressed the same editorial concerns that Stepshep and I have; we have just been the most consistent and kept with it. Why? Because we want this article to be as good as the ones I listed above and we are familiar with Wikipedia's policies and standards. Why those editors have stopped editing is their own business; perhaps they are frustrated or just busy with other projects. Regardless, your comments are way out of line, particularly your attempt to somehow connect the childish vandalism of Dix Stadium way back from this summer to the removal of questionable and plagiarized content from the Akron, Ohio Wikipedia article as if the two have any connection whatsoever. If you are concerned that my connection to Kent State University somehow affects my editing of Akron-related articles, please look at the edit histories of Akron Zips and Akron Zips men's basketball both of which I have made contributions to with sources, the men's basketball article in particular. Again, I am concerned with making articles well-written and encyclopedic, not promoting a certain subject. As far as I'm concerned this is another article that I happen to have some local connection to that really needs a lot of work. Removing the above-mentioned content is only one step. --JonRidinger (talk) 23:02, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

removing allowed pictures, refferenced material, and un plagtrized content is Vandalism--Rubohcity (talk) 23:47, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

clearly things got out of hand here, i believe in respect for every fellow man. it seems the ip whose been editing clearly is only trying to help but in his good faiths are going kinda overboard, i care as much about the place as you so i must ask you politly to please not add anymore information unless its welly known. Also for the well established members to quit be so rash in editing the page please i will trim down on the article more in due time p.s. its wikipedia so keep it cool--Rubohcity (talk) 01:52, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I blocked the IP editor for 3RR violations. With all due respect, you did not edit for four days, then showed up twenty minutes after I blocked the IP. I suspect you are either working together or are one and the same. Be that as it may, your edits and those of the IP do not follow the Manual of Style, or are copyright violations. Wikipedia operates on consensus and by following the models of better articles that meet the highest standards (which Akron's article currently does not). I have looked at your uploads of images on Commons and found many more copyvios. I have flagged them on Commons as copyvios and will remove the images from the article next. That is why we are reverting the edits. Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 02:04, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

thanks for the insite(wondering why noone replied) did you also block the other to editors?? LOL NO yes it may seem that way but i just been quietly observing the edits daily and the last got out of hand and no one came to fix it so i felt it was left to me--Rubohcity (talk) 02:35, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Adding to that, anyone can edit this article; no one owns it, so if it needs to be trimmed back, any editor not only can do it, but should if they have sufficient evidence and spell out their reasonings. The reason the "well-established" members seem "rash" is because of the policy of being bold and their knowledge and understanding of Wikipedia policies and standards. Basically, if you know something is against policy, remove it or fix it so it is in line with policy; don't just wait for someone else to do it. Further, be careful with pictures, even ones that are legitimate public domain, so that the article doesn't become cluttered with pictures or looks awkward because of their placement. Not every picture related to Akron has a place in this article, but especially non-free images from other websites. There is such a thing as too many pictures. Legitimate public domain (free) pictures uploaded to the Commons can have a gallery link placed in the article page as well. --JonRidinger (talk) 02:40, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Thanks for the explanation of your sudden appearance here today. I did not revert the other editors as Wikipedia:Three-revert rule explictly does not count the removal of copyright violations towards 3RR. Wikipedia opeartes on consensus and has a Manual of style and policies and guidelines this needs to follow too. There are also model articles that are featured and this does not yet meet those standards. I will reply on your talk page about the copyvios you keep uploading on Commons. Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 02:50, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

We do agree that this Diff is a net loss? Or am I missing something? §hep • ^Talk 04:02, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I prefer the daytime photo. Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 04:10, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I do as well...it's clearer in more ways than one. I like night photos, but for a lead picture like this, I prefer a daytime skyline photo. --JonRidinger (talk) 04:17, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I do not because it is more updated updated, plus the daytime photo is already being used as cityscape like in cleveland's--Rubohcity (talk) 04:40, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Cleveland's cityscape also details the cityscape. A picture alone cannot support a section. §hep • ^Talk 01:22, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

what do you mean by detail?--Rubohcity (talk) 23:29, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Detail (Verb) §hep • ^Talk 23:34, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

so it will be done.--Rubohcity (talk) 23:37, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Just because you don't like something doesn't mean it isn't going ot happen. Three users agreed that the daytime photo in the infobox was the best choice, by consensus the image was changed. To remove duplication the "cityscape" section was removed. What's wrong with what I've done? §hep • ^Talk 23:51, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

The facts are simply this, the article has a picture, cityscape has a picture with details, and there is no sense in deleting any one of them aslong as in similar form to other accepted articles.--Rubohcity (talk) 23:56, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

A caption does not constitute a section, or even detail the entire landscape of the city. Take a look at Cleveland or Houston. Architecture, neighborhoods, suburbs, history of the layout; that's what it will take to support a section on the cityscape. §hep • ^Talk 00:00, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

so basically, if i make a downtown Akron article(which ive been working on and is semi done) and make it a blue link as in the cleveland and houston then all will be fair?--Rubohcity (talk) 00:06, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

No. There's other parts to Akron's cityscape besides the downtown. 00:13, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

please clarify what you mean? and what needs to be done so it is accepted like Cleveland and Houstons?--Rubohcity (talk) 00:16, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Copyvio photos removed

User:Rubohcity insists on uploading copyvio photos to Commons and adding them to this article. Some examples this user has uploaded and insists on restoring to this article after I removed them follow:

• File:AkronRoadRunner.jpg clearly says in the Metadata that it is the work of an Akron Beacon Journal photographer, and so is not a free image. I note this was deleted from Commons as a copyvio before, when it was called File:Marathon pt 02.jpg.
• File:Metro RTA Transit Center aerial view.jpg is clearly taken from the Metro website here, which has no indication of any free license. It is thus a copyvio.
• File:Akron's Art museum.jpg is clearly the same as this image], which has no indication of any free license. It is thus a copyvio.

Please see WP:COPYVIO, which says in part that Contributors should take steps to remove any copyright violations that they find.. I have done that and will continue to do so. Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 03:12, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Miss a couple hours miss a lot. I completely agree with your edits and will do the same if I notice the images being readded. §hep • ^Talk 03:15, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I also removed the File:SummitCountyMethSites.jpg as Rubohcity identified the source as the Akron Public Library, which gives no indication of a free license. Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 03:22, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Same with me. Please understand this isn't just the edit police here trying to crush everything certain editors are attempting to add; the policies on copyrighted photos and content are to protect Wikipedia from copyright infringement lawsuits. On the Commons, you can ONLY upload your own photos (photos you took with your camera). Here on Wikipedia copyrighted photos can be uploaded but only when a free version is unavailable and not possible (like a logo or an historic photo of something that doesn't exist anymore). Even in those exceptions, rationales must be given and the use of those pictures must have a detailed rationale for each article it is used in (see File:KSU seal.png and File:KentStateGoldenFlashes.png for examples of multiple rationales). All of us are here to help make sure everyone understands the policies. Please ask! --JonRidinger (talk) 03:27, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

thank you again for schooling me, i now know the meaning of "free" on here, i thought it had something to do with buying(embarrising) p.s. this is how wikipedia should be and continue on going--Rubohcity (talk) 03:35, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Most of us have been there, so no need to be embarrassed in not totally understanding. The important thing is that hopefully now you do understand and can help improve the article by making sure others don't make the same mistake and by possibly getting your own pictures with your own camera so there is no debate. --JonRidinger (talk) 03:51, 15 January 2009 (UTC)