Talk:Michael Oren: Difference between revisions

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Biography: Politics and Government / Science and Academia C‑class

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Israel C‑class Mid‑importance

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Criticisms

I don't know if those criticisms are notable or relevant, but I separated them from his biographical details. —Quiddity 04:10, 17 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Citizenship/Possible Treason to the USA

I think that the fact that Oren, born a citizen of the USA and now an officer and propagandist for a foreign military should be highlighted. Is he still an American citizen? I don't get it, is he an Iraeli who just happened to be born in the USA or an American who later on got the Israeli citizenship for the simple fact that he is a Zionist Jew to fight off the Christian and Muslim Palestinians?

What's the difference between him and, say, Adam Gadahn or Tokyo Rose? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.211.190.176 (talk) 13:37, 11 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Moving house to a new country is not inherently an act of treason. Also, you might like to read through Wikipedia:Neutral point of view and Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons before commenting further. Thanks. --Quiddity 04:44, 2 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I have little faith in the veracity of Oren's remarks or writings based on an opinion piece he wrote for the Wall Street Journal 12/16/06. He claimed that America has always supported Israel since the time of the Pilgrims who recognized the Jews right to Zion. A bit of a stretch, but when he went into how much Harry Truman supported Israel without mentioning the agony Truman went through before agreeing to the establishment of Israel, he, Oren, presented a very distorted story. Truman's former haberdashery partner, a Jew, gained, access to Truman for Chaim Weizman. In a letter to Eleanor Roosevelt, Truman said something to the effect that he feared that the Jews like all oppressed people when given the chance would become the oppressors. ("Truman", David McCullough) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by rnau, made original comment 3/01/07, added WSJ date 3/02/07. rnau168.103.232.234 (talk)

I certainly would not call Oren a traitor, he is a historian, not a "propagandist." However, I believe that serving in a foreign military is automatic forfeiture of American citizenship, and it explicity states that on American passports. Amssports06 14:13, 7 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

No, serving in a foreign military CAN lead to forfeiture of your citizenship, but it is certainly not automatic. Think of all the Americans who volunteered to fight in the Spanish Civil War, WW1 and WWII before the US entered - many are now regarded as American heroes. Further, although I did not read the WSJ piece, what Oren says in Power, Faith and Fantasy is very different from what you are claiming he says. He doesn't say that American supported the Jews right to Zion starting with the Pilgrims - he describes the restorationist movement which was prevalent in American society in the 19th century and aimed to bring Jews back to Palestine because thats what they believed their religion required. They also hoped to covert these Jews to Christianity. The stuff about Truman's doubts about Israel and the meeting his friend insisted that he take is in the book. GabrielF 19:45, 4 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

In an interview on NPR's All Things Considered on Tuesday 18 August, Oren declared that he has renounced his American citizenship. Bangpound (talk) 21:18, 18 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

2008/09 Gaza

a few days ago CNN broadcasted a live interview with oren in a battle dress ready to fight with the ZAHAL in gaza as a reservist. he said he feels "privileged" to serve this army and also that he was chosen as a kind of military spokesperson for western media. maybe someone has another source, as i'm not sure whether a tv broadcast (from which i don't remember the exact title and date) is a recognised source for wikipedia.--Severino (talk) 13:04, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Citations are need for a proper wikipedia article.

I am unsure how most of this article's content came about. There are almost no citations in the bulk of the text. Almost every citation is to a book review in the section about his books. How do we know any of these statements about his life, IDF service and his current affiliations are true? All of the biographical details in this article need to be sourced for this to follow Wikipedia's proper format and high standards. --John Bahrain (talk) 14:25, 15 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Criticism

The Israel apologetics are having a field day editing this page, so let's make one thing perfectly clear: academic, published criticism should always be noted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shoplifter (talk • contribs) 11:15, 3 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

First of all, please abide by WP:Assume good faith and WP:No personal attacks. The issue with Finkelstein's criticism is that it is not simply criticism of the book, it also entails a personal attack, labeling Oren as a vulgar propagandist, which violates the strict conditions of WP:BLP. ShamWow (talk) 19:02, 3 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]