Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/American football

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American football

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was merge‎ to List of Chicago Bears team records. ✗plicit 14:40, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

List of Chicago Bears all-time record versus NFL

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Wikipedia is not a sports database. This level of detail runs afoul of WP:NOTSTATS, while also not meeting basic notability standards for lists. A higher level summary (i.e. the first table under All-Time Series) may be appropriate for merging, maybe into List of Chicago Bears team records, but this does not justify a standalone list. « Gonzo fan2007 (talk) @ 14:25, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. « Gonzo fan2007 (talk) @ 14:25, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as a highly trivial list and per WP:NOTSTATS. Frank Anchor 14:33, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Adding that I would support a selective merge to List of Chicago Bears team records on the condition that the list of Thursday/Sunday/Monday night games and holiday games are not included in such a merge. Frank Anchor 17:25, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete or merge. I don't agree at all that the information is trivial. On the other hand, this is simply a repetition of results reported at multiple places on the net. E.g., [1], [2]. If there were more context and analysis, I might view it diffferently. See NOT STATS "(Extensive listings of unexplained lists"). Gonzo's suggestion to merge the main list into List of Chicago Bears team records also makes sense. Cbl62 (talk) 16:30, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Lists and Illinois. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 18:50, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete‎. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 05:22, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Rossi Morreale

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Non-notable and poorly sourced BLP. The present sources barely mention him or are gossip about his wedding. Ditto any search. Fails WP:GNG, WP:GOSSIP, and WP:V. — Iadmc ♫^talk 04:20, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People, Popular culture, and American football. — Iadmc ♫^talk 04:20, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete — this man played minor-league American football for a few years and appeared on a bunch of TV shows of very little interest. White 720 (talk) 04:33, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@White 720 Interesting change of heart by the creator — Iadmc ♫^talk 04:41, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It happens. But only rarely so maybe don't rub it in. I thank White 720 for not using this forum to waste anyone's time where most others would. It's a kind gesture. So thanks White 720. JFHJr (㊟) 04:47, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I created this article 17 years ago after being curious about the subject's then-current project. I don't have any real attachment to the article subject, and while I can't resist a chance to save an article with last-ditch citation adding (I've succeeded before) there's no point in preserving an article for a person whose entertainment career never really took off. White 720 (talk) 05:08, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. I didn't mean any malice — Iadmc ♫^talk 05:20, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Following this referral from WP:BLPN. This subject fails WP:GNG and WP:ANYBIO. The sole extrinsic claim to N is WP:NACTOR. However, (the paucity of) BLP-worthy reliable sources underlying the claims to NACTOR makes it hard to support any particular prose or derivative filmography section. If we remove what is unreffed or supported only by the subject or allmusic, there is no encyclopedic biography. JFHJr (㊟) 04:29, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Television and Arkansas. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 10:46, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Found [[3]], but I was surprised of the lack of WP:SIGCOV considering this subject played at the highest level of college football. Let'srun (talk) 12:25, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
An enormous number of people play division 1 college football — there are 134 teams, which have like 80 players each, and no one plays more than 4 years. So there are probably 3000 new players each year. 100.36.106.199 (talk) 11:40, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Let'srun (talk) 19:03, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep‎. (non-admin closure) Cocobb8 (💬 talk • ✏️ contribs) 16:52, 23 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Fairmont State Fighting Falcons

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They don't appear to be a notable team, playing in a small, regional league. No sourced info so not sure it is worth merging anywhere. Potentially a redirect to university or league. Boleyn (talk) 16:41, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sports and West Virginia. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 17:09, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Fairmont State University#Athletics. Almost all relevant information is already located in that article. --MuZemike 14:34, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. NCAA athletic programs are virtually always notable. This team gets extensive and regular coverage and even some of the seasons for just the football team are notable. BeanieFan11 (talk) 19:28, 19 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: American football. BeanieFan11 (talk) 19:38, 19 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: The athletic teams get coverage from local sources such as [[4]] and [[5]]. I'd say this meets the WP:GNG and should be expanded, not deleted. Let'srun (talk) 19:51, 19 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per BeanieFan11 and Let'srun. Article should be expanded, not deleted or merged. Jweiss11 (talk) 22:19, 19 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per BeanieFan11 and Let'srun; NCAA athletic programs, particularly at the Division II level, almost always generate significant coverage. TheCatalyst31 ^{Reaction•Creation} 00:22, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per BeanieFan and Let'srun. This is a notable program. The 1967 Fairmont State Falcons football team actually won a national championship. Cbl62 (talk) 03:46, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

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The result was delete‎. Owen× ☎ 21:56, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Minnesota–Penn State football rivalry

AfDs for this article:

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This was soft deleted earlier this year and recreated, however the previous rationale for deleting this article remains, in that there is a lack of WP:SIGCOV from reliable secondary sources to meet the WP:NRIVALRY or WP:GNG. Don't think this qualifies for a speedy deletion, so bringing it to AfD. Let'srun (talk) 20:17, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sports, American football, Minnesota, and Pennsylvania. Let'srun (talk) 20:17, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Nom has the right of this; there's nothing here that indicates this is a notable rivalry. Fails WP:SIRS so fails WP:GNG. UtherSRG (talk) 21:58, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as a general practice, we have avoided sports rivalry articles unless there is a great deal of history and coverage. To me, this one doesn't meet muster or spirit for inclusion. I encourage enthusiastic editors to try another wiki such as an online sports almanac for details like this.--Paul McDonald (talk) 18:32, 19 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per above. Kablammo (talk) 19:56, 19 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete fails GNG as a non-notable football series. Even though the teams have a traveling trophy, that does not guarantee a "rivalry" article. There is no significant coverage of these two teams as being rivals. Frank Anchor 18:56, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep and Rename to Governor's Victory Bell. The trophy and series between the teams is notable and meets GNG per the sources below (and others), which have been written regularly since the trophy was first awarded in 1993. The sources specifically call out the trophy's creation with regards to Penn State's membership in the Big Ten, a conference well known for a multitude of trophies.

There is no requirement that a Wikipedia article on the history of competition between two teams must be a capital-"R" RIVALRY. An article can be written about a series or a trophy, assuming it meets GNG and the significant coverage goes beyond WP:ROUTINE recaps of the games, which the sources above do. PK-WIKI (talk) 19:42, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

These references all basically explain that the trophy is awarded to the winner of the game, surrounded by other WP:ROUTINE coverage (such as a pre/postgame report or a list of other traveling trophies). It does nothing to describe a rivalry between the two teams, and a traveling trophy is not inherently notable. In addition, if the article is kept, which I oppose, I believe the name should stay as is; articles about other college football games played for a traveling trophy are named "X-Y rivalry" and not after the trophy. Frank Anchor 20:18, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The references don't need to describe a rivalry between the teams, as there is no requirement that teams must be "rivals" to write a Wikipedia article about their notable series or trophy. The references above do provide significant, non-routine coverage of the trophy and series, making this article an easy keep under the name Governor's Victory Bell.

There are plenty of series listed at List of NCAA college football rivalry games where the article takes the name of the trophy, such as Wagon Wheel (trophy), Governor's Cup (Kentucky), Jefferson-Eppes Trophy, Gansz Trophy, Victory Bell (Cincinnati–Miami), etc. Those are far better names than "...football series" in my opinion, in cases such as this where "...football rivalry" is perhaps inappropriate or "not a true rivalry".

PK-WIKI (talk) 20:49, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Still a non-notable series. The presence of a traveling trophy and the routine coverage you mentioned earlier does not change that. Frank Anchor 01:15, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was merge‎ to NCAA Division III independent schools. After discounting the WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS-type arguments, we're left with a clear consensus to delete. However, the proposed selective merge target seems like a reasonable ATD. Owen× ☎ 10:46, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

List of NCAA Division III independents football records

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Topic is not notable enough for a standalone article, fails WP:NLIST and WP:NOTDIRECTORY. This is a list of records for loosely-related college football team seasons. These teams are "independent" and do not belong to conferences, only joined together because they are in a division of college football together. The text in many of these templates also show up as wikitext because of improper code writing. This list was also created as a way to try avoiding deletion of the individual templates at Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2024 June 13#Template:2023 NCAA Division III independents football records. Eagles 24/7 (C) 14:07, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: American football and Lists. Eagles 24/7 (C) 14:07, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Nothing is here connecting these records together; fails WP:NLIST. Let'srun (talk) 12:35, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: Member of an already established set of pages. (List of Division I FBS independents football standings (1973–present), List of NCAA Division II independents football records) Unless you plan on also nominating both of those for deletion to remain consistent. But I reckon that is not the plan since this is the only one hindering the deletion of the Division III independent templates. Thetreesarespeakingtome (talk) 17:57, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
WP:AGF. Let'srun (talk) 17:07, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per Thetreesarespeakingtome. At the very least, this article could be merged to NCAA Division III independent schools. Jweiss11 (talk) 03:10, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, The Herald (Benison) (talk) 15:22, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom. Wikipedia is not a stats sheet. SpacedFarmer (talk) 20:24, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Just saying - if this isn't a notable list/container article, none of the standings template pages are notable. SportingFlyer T·C 17:38, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I did not nominate other articles similar to this because I feel this one in particular is the least notable, and I don't agree that everything else would have to be deleted as a result of this discussion. WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS would apply. Eagles 24/7 (C) 16:58, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

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The result was no consensus‎. Doczilla _{Ohhhhhh, no!} 22:13, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Great Lakes Arena Football

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Very minimal significant coverage from reliable sources; majority of sources are from a suspected fan site. Could not find recent coverage in a WP:BEFORE. Fails WP:GNG. Jalen Folf (Bark[s]) 15:58, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose There's only one link to a Facebook page, the others are to a local newspaper while the others are to a very reliable site, which is in use for most minor league articles. This league is equivalent to the National League (division) in England (without the history). There's absolutely no reason to delete this article. Ccui123 (talk) 23:54, 12 June 2024 (UTC) — Note to closing admin: Ccui123 (talk • contribs) is the creator of the page that is the subject of this AfD. [reply]

Oppose I don't see any reason for deletion. This is a pro league, and the article is well sited. StanleyKey (talk) 00:41, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The problem I see here is I don't see any other source besides OurSportsCentral, Muskegon Sports, and local team sources. I'm expecting more than just those sources here. Jalen Folf (Bark[s]) 21:32, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: American football, Michigan, and Ohio. Jalen Folf (Bark[s]) 15:58, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 22:57, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose It's clearly a minor league and Our Sports Central is as good of a source you can get for leagues below the Major level. BabyBOY789 (talk) 21:06, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Additionally, there's Muskegon Sports for West Michigan Ironmen coverage, but what about coverage for the other teams? Jalen Folf (Bark[s]) 21:33, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Owen× ☎ 17:32, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: The league is not notable at all and there is no news articles on it except for small town news. Blake675 (talk) 23:52, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - other than the articles from "Muskegon Sports" there isn't anything else produced here or in the article to pass GNG. The Muskegon Sports articles are more relevant for the West Michigan Ironmen than this league anyway. Eagles 24/7 (C) 20:42, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: The Muskegon Sports articles are the only ones which could be considered to meet the WP:GNG and they mostly focus on only 1 team. Delete for a lack of WP:SIGCOV. Let'srun (talk) 12:14, 19 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Merge with West Michigan Ironmen since the league is inextricably tied to that team and what reliable sources are available for it are in the context of that team. J. Myrle Fuller (talk) 22:30, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: No consensus yet.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 17:24, 23 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

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The result was delete‎. ✗plicit 01:56, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Jaime Stein

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Lack of significant coverage in independent sources. Hirolovesswords (talk) 14:55, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People, Journalism, and Canada. Shellwood (talk) 16:46, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Radio and American football. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 17:49, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: Stein meets the WP:GNG with significant coverage from reliable sources such as [[6]], [[7]] and [[8]]. This is also WP:SIGCOV but is not independent: [[9]]. Let'srun (talk) 10:17, 3 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: We need more people to participate in AfD discussions.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Cocobb8 (💬 talk • ✏️ contribs) 15:05, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete The "oursportscentral" article is a rather typical "new job announcement" and doesn't do much to support GNG. The Vancouver Sun 2004 article is a single sentence. The Rotman article is not independent, it's one of those alumnus blurbs. While it might provide some facts it is a good bet that they come directly from the subject. The only possible significant article I see is the Vancouver Sun 2005 one. It talks about the subject as beginning a career, and given that was in 2005 I would expect to have seen later articles about a career, but I don't. Lamona (talk) 22:07, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Still no consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Cocobb8 (💬 talk • ✏️ contribs) 15:35, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: Even in .ca sources, there is hardly anything. I agree with the nom's review of the sources, most aren't helpful. Oaktree b (talk) 17:04, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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