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Template talk:Infobox river

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Coordinates: 49°26′02″N 0°12′24″E / 49.43389°N 0.20667°E / 49.43389; 0.20667
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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Cewbot (talk | contribs) at 22:22, 1 July 2024 (Maintain {{WPBS}}: 2 WikiProject templates. Create {{WPBS}}.). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

native_name title

The use of Native name is offensive to many cultures, can it be remove and replace with first nations name Gnangarra 11:02, 28 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

It might be better to use indigenous_name, for generality. According to Indigenous peoples#North America, "Indigenous peoples in Canada comprise the First Nations, Inuit and Métis", so first_nations would exclude Inuit and Métis. Mitch Ames (talk) 12:11, 28 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
thats fine as long the offensive "native" is removed. Gnangarra 12:16, 28 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Some thoughts (as a non-Indigenous Australian editor) ...
Given that:
  • {{Infobox river}} displays the native_name in the main part of the box, with the field name displayed as "Native name", whereas other_name displays the name at the top, under the name, with no field name (example diff)
  • {{Infobox Australian place}} has native_name (and not other_name) which is displayed at the top with no other text (eg Brisbane (Meanjin), Rottnest Island (Wadjemup)).
  • {{Infobox Australian place}} "has been extensively customised for Australia" and states in the instructions that "Native is a deprecated archaic term in the Australian context, but is used in this template for consistency with other templates. Please don't use the term in articles."
Is there some reason why native_name is displayed differently in rivers vs Australian places? Does {{Infobox Australian place}} move it to the top only to avoid the need to display the deprecated/archaic/offensive text "Native name"?
Would it be better if all rivers and other "places" (using Category:Place infobox templates) displayed the native/indigenous name the same way?
Would renaming native_name break anything, in particular other templates?
Mitch Ames (talk) 01:17, 29 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
To avoid the displayed label "Native name", the parameter |name_other= can be used which will display other name(s) unlabelled below |name=. Messing with |name_native= would certainly cause problems in articles like Rhine, Danube, and similar. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 01:45, 29 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
This parameter gets confused all the time native name has nothing to do with being indigenous. Is the wording/language used by the population in question...Moscow vs Москва..|native_name = Country's name (usually full name) in its official/defacto language(s), hence in italics (double quotemarks).
Москва. Moxy- 02:12, 29 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
This is English Wikipedia and in English "native" is loaded word that carries a lot offense thanks to colonialism of the British. the title saying Natvie name, should at least be transient and capable of being changed to reflect the language code ie de say it German, nys say its nyungar, the actual word native doesnt need to be there. We dont need to offend people just fill in a box what ever happened to WP:NPOV and our key pillar as being neutral? Gnangarra 09:22, 5 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
the title saying Natvie name, should at least be transient and capable of being changed to reflect the language code ie de say it German, nys say its nyungar, the actual word native doesnt need to be there. — I don't think that would work if there is more than one such name (eg Rhine). Perhaps simply displaying "Indigenous" instead of "Native" (keeping the template parameter name for back-compatibility, but also allowing indigenous_name) would be a simpler solution. This has the advantage of keeping the same heading text in all infoboxes, which helps the reader looking for that specific thing. It also means that someone not familiar with the word (for example) "Nyungar" doesn't have to click the link to find out what a "Nyungar name" is. Mitch Ames (talk) 23:28, 5 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ok "native" is a linguists term used for " first language" or " mother tongue" called a "L1" name.... it may or may not be indigenous in nature. First language as in "You are a native speaker of that language" that in most cases is not an indigenous one. Indigenous_name is a patamater we could add...changing native_name = to "first language" could be done but we would need a wider talk because anyone educated in linguistics is aware of meaning in this case.Love, Nigel; Ansaldo, Umberto (2010). "The native speaker and the mother tongue". Language Sciences. 32 (6). Elsevier BV: 589–593. doi:10.1016/j.langsci.2010.09.003. ISSN 0388-0001. Moxy- 04:09, 6 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
According to First language, with my emphasis here: "A first language (L1), native language, ... is the first language or dialect that a person has been exposed to ...". There are variations described in that article, but they are all relative to the speaker. That suggests that L1 is a function of a person, not a country or river, so the concept appears meaningless in the context of an article about a place. If the "native name" is the name in the "native language" then that is the language of the reader of the article (not the writer). Is there a linguist term to define the native language of the indigenous people of a place? Mitch Ames (talk) 05:25, 6 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Autochthonous language Moxy- 08:09, 6 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Autochthonous language redirects to Indigenous language, which supports my original suggestion of "Indigenous name". Mitch Ames (talk) 08:15, 6 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
yup....so new parameter here? Moxy- 08:19, 6 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Template-protected edit request on 11 August 2023

Please swap rows 3 and 4, so that the sequence is min / av / max. This will then match the width and depth outputs. — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 09:39, 11 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

 Done – Jonesey95 (talk) 12:50, 11 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Please revert this change, the parameters were ordered that way for a reason. See the discussion from merger of Geobox river into this template. Shannon [ Talk ] 21:08, 12 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
arrow Reverted, please be ready to discuss with @GhostInTheMachine — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 21:17, 12 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. Shannon [ Talk ] 21:59, 12 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The archived discussion is lengthy – which bit should I be looking at? — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 17:06, 14 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Shannon: ! — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 20:18, 23 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Topographic maps

It would be ideal if this infobox had a parameter for topographic maps as there is for {{Infobox mountain}}. Volcanoguy 04:18, 1 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Wouldn't most notable rivers cross more than one 1:25000 topographic map? Would it be a list of topo maps? — hike395 (talk) 14:17, 1 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It would probably be a big list for major rivers (which I don't recommend) but the same could be said for major mountain ranges (e.g. Rockies, Andes, Alps). There's a lot of articles about small rivers and creeks that would appear on only one to a couple topo maps. Volcanoguy 19:36, 1 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I normally use {{Break}} for listing topo maps in {{Infobox mountain}} as can be seen in Mount Edziza volcanic complex. Volcanoguy 21:19, 1 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Documentation

The template uses and the Check for unknown parameters call checks for 152 parameters. The template data listed 135 of these and I have imported the 17 extras. However, there are no template data descriptions at all and the Parameter names and descriptions section described just 59 60 62 parameters. I am reluctant to add missing parameters without a suitable description, but will attempt to add ones I do understand. Please review my descriptions and add more — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 11:08, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Parameter names and descriptions section

Unused parameters?

Additional image or map parameters

Are these available on this template, like on Template:Infobox settlement or Template:Infobox public transit? Trying to figure out if it is possible to include multiple maps in the infobox. See Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)#Preference_of_using_OpenStreetMaps. Shannon [ Talk ] 16:06, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Shannon1 I sandboxed that at template:Infobox river/sandbox here is an example output, note hidden map and shown map.

Seine
The Seine in Paris
Map
Native namela Seine (French)
Location
CountryFrance
Physical characteristics
Source 
 • locationSource-Seine
MouthEnglish Channel (Template:Lang-fr)
 • location
Le Havre/Honfleur
 • coordinates
49°26′02″N 0°12′24″E / 49.43389°N 0.20667°E / 49.43389; 0.20667
 • elevation
0 m (0 ft)
Length777 km (483 mi)
Basin size79,000 km2 (31,000 sq mi)
Discharge 
 • locationLe Havre
 • average560 m3/s (20,000 cu ft/s)
Basin features
River systemSeine basin
Tributaries 
 • leftYonne, Loing, Eure, Risle
 • rightOurce, Aube, Marne, Oise, Epte

Addition of discharge regime parameter

Hi,

I recently expanded the article about the discharge regime (which was previously grouped with river regime) to the point where it is not a stub anymore. I tried to decentralize it from the Alpine region where it is most commonly used and make it more globally balanced and I think now the article is developed to the point that a parameter for discharge regime could also be added to the infobox. I am thinking that the parameter would give just basic information about the regime, i.e. temperate pluvial, mediterranean, Texan, tropical pluvial/intertropical, equatorial, nival, nivo-glacial, glacial, nivo-pluvial, pluvio-nival, uniform, complex; and not all the subdivisions that are listed, maybe with addition of the month when the peak occurs, e.g. tropical pluvial (peak in September). What do you think? Garygo golob (talk) 09:00, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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