Talk:Al-Qaeda

Archives

1 2 3 4

Bosnia =

Old version restored, discuss any changes here.

I propose to add something about the rumoured or real (I don't follow this closely enough) extremist camps in the post-war period. --HanzoHattori (talk) 11:12, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Hanzo (and others), I did discuss the proposed changes here. The main problems with the version you are reverting to is that it focuses on the secular nature of the local Bosnian Muslims instead of describing the links between Bosnia and Al Qaeda (which the other version focuses on). Yes, the large majority of Bosnian Muslims are fairly secular, but what the sources (notably Kohlmann) state is that the Bosnian War and the participation of the Bosnian Mujahideen played an important role in giving Al Qaeda access to Europe and radicalized many European muslims (both inside and outside Bosnia). By not stating this the other version is misrepresenting the source.Osli73 (talk) 11:24, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Just propose the actual changes and we'll discuss. About this one, I already said it's misinformation ("Western intervention created" thing). You may propose something well-sourced on these camps if you want, for a starter. --HanzoHattori (talk) 11:28, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Hanzo, I did propose a change and there was no opposition to it. I'm not quite sure why you feel the version I proposed is "misinformation". It is based on some well respected sources (Kohlmann and Holbrook amongst others). However, it is the version you are proposing which (a) doesn't deal with the subject (ie WP:COATRACK)and (b) misrepresent the sources (ie WP:OR). Since I don't think we're going to see eye to eye on this, I suggest that we take our respective versions and get some outside/3rd party comments. How about that?Osli73 (talk) 11:53, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Also: in this section we DON'T discuss Osli's Wikipedia background. --HanzoHattori (talk) 11:32, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

The 'background' is that I've often come head to head with what I believe are nationalist motivated editors. However, I don't think you, Hanzo, are one.Osli73 (talk) 11:55, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

OSLI, propose your CHANGES TO THE OLD VERSION (it's not even mine!) HERE. And wait for consensus. --HanzoHattori (talk) 12:09, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Hanzo - Two comments;

• First (again) I did propse the changes here on the Talk page and then went ahead. I'm sorry if you missed that discussion.
• Second, I realize it may not be 'your' version but by reverting to it you are endorsing it over the one I am proposing.

How about the outside mediation? Otherwise I'm afraid we will get nowhere.Osli73 (talk) 12:42, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

No, I asked you to PROPOSE CHANGES TO THE EXISTING VERSION (the restored one from before the edit wars). Like what and where (exactly) would you add or remove and why.

Your rival version was scrapped too. It's here for a possible discussion if someone'd like to comment on this:

Following the end of the Bosnian War and, especially, after the 11 September attacks on the World Trade Center, Serbian propaganda started to fabricate the links between the group of Muslim foreign volunteers that fought in Bosnia, and Al Qaeda, in order to move the focus from the genocide committed by Serb forces in Bosnia to more interesting topic such as terrorism. According to Radio Free Europe produced research by Vlado Azinovic about alleged links between Bosnia and Al Qaeda Al Qaeda in Bosnia: Myth Or Present Danger, the claims about Al Qaeda in Bosnia are unverified and mostly fabricated. The presence of Wahhabism and of the remaining Muslim fighters do not qualify Bosnia as a particular threat to international security, according to the Azinovic's conclusion. Further more, Azinovic quotes Evan F. Kohlmann:

Serb propaganda throughout the whole war had portrayed the Bosnian Muslims as violent extremists, fundamentalists, and as eager to jump on the bandwagon of the mujahedin.

I don't think it's good but the original (RFE/RL's Al Qaeda in Bosnia: Myth Or Present Danger) sounds like a good source (and it's actually a book[1]).

In the meantime, I cleaned up the whole article. --HanzoHattori (talk) 03:03, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Apologies for jumping into the middle of this, but I think user:Osli73's version here is better. It's much better sourced than the proposed alternative, which essentially denies that there were any extremist elements in Bosnia at all. If that is indeed the case, than that paragraph really doesn't belong in the article at all, and would be better-placed in the Serb Propaganda article. However, the presence of Muslim extremists in the Bosnian conflict is undeniable, and Osli's sources make a credible attempt to connect them to al-Qaeda. Maybe as a compromise we could include both version? Dchall1 (talk) 15:05, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Dchall1, I agree that we should integrate the two versions, see my reply below. No one denies the fact of Islamic volunteers presence in the Bosnian war, but this article deals with Al Qaida not with foreign volunteers. There is no offical document of any international organization in Bosnia (such as NATO, EUFOR, EUPM) to support the claim of Al Qaida existence in Bosnia. On the other hand there are a lot of speculation and certainly propaganda. If we want to talk about foreign volunteers we have to mention those facts. But please read my proposal below. The Dragon of Bosnia (talk) 18:48, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Also, I think the newly-added paragraph on Srebrenica is entirely irrelevant. Again, the focus is more on the Serbs and Serbian propaganda, while the subject connection to al-Qaeda is tenuous at best. Any objections to removing it? Dchall1 (talk) 15:07, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Dchall1, I've gone ahead and done just that. Also removed some other bit which was completely unsourced.Osli73 (talk) 14:57, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

"essentially denies that there were any extremist elements in Bosnia at all." Excuse me? "Several close associates of Osama bin Laden (most notably, Saudi Khalid bin Udah bin Muhammad al-Harbi, alias Abu Sulaiman al-Makki) joined the conflict in Bosnia." denies what? --HanzoHattori (talk) 17:39, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Hanzo, the version you have now is fine. I was referring to the proposal Following the end of the Bosnian War... above, which is unacceptably POV-ish. That said, Osli's version has some important points. Can't we integrate the two instead of revert-warring? Dchall1 (talk) 21:38, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

DoB, you stop this too. --HanzoHattori (talk) 17:41, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Also, why won't you (both) take this dispute back to Bosnian Mujahideen? --HanzoHattori (talk) 17:45, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Dragon's proposals

I am trying to discuss it, but Osli73 stopped to co-operate. Bosnian Mujahideen article is under mediation, maybe it will be deleted. The problem is Bosnian Mujahideen article was written by Osli73 who is trying to connect it to Al Qaida which is the first mistake here (these two articles are not the same subject, so the link to the "main article" (Bosnian Mujahideen) should be removed). He created this article because he didn't like the existing ones covering the same topic such as 7th Muslim Brigade or simply Mujahideen.

I would ask you first to read the discussion in Talk:Bosnian Mujahideen, because I already provided the evidence for my claims. The most important claim here is the title of the article is wrong. The first sentence of this article begins with this words: "Bosnian Mujahideen (also referred to as El Mujaheed or El Mujahid)...". This is completely wrong introduction, and wrong title. There is no source in Osli73's whole article which supports this title: Bosnian Mujahideen. Second, the sentence also says, "also referred to as El Mujahideen". But it isn't referred to as El Mujahideen because Bosnian Mujadideen is fabricated term or original research made by Osli73, which he now tries to promote in different articles. On the other hand, El Mujahideen is completely different term. El Mujahideen is a military unit. There are already two articles which cover the subject of this wrong title article, the first article is Mujahideen, the second article is 7th Muslim Brigade. There is also the third article called The role of foreign fighters in the Bosnian war which also covers this. There were other terms such as Arab mujahideen or Arab fighters when referring to their role in Bosnian war, but the Bosnian Mujadideen is neologism created by Osli73, the term isn't validated by the ICTY nor by any other court on this planet (Wikipedia:Verifiability:Articles should rely on reliable, third-party published sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy.). Osli73 created this redundant article just because he didn't like the existing articles and he wanted to connect Bosnia somehow with terrorism in order to move the focus from the genocide article, so he joined the two terms together Bosnia and Mujahideen. Just read his explanation about his motive for writing this article. After that he nominated 7th Muslim Brigade for deletion?! But that is not how Wikipedia works.

I agree that we should integrate two versions. Here is my improved version, so please read it:

During the Yugoslav wars, Bosnia-Herzegovina received humanitarian aid from Islamic countries as well as from the West, because of intensive and widespread killing, mass rapes, death camps, ethnic cleansing committed by Serb and, to a lesser extent, Croat forces. The main targets were Bosnian Muslim civilians. The world's highest court concluded that these crimes, committed during the 1992 -95 war, were crimes against humanity and genocide (dolus specialis) regarding Srebrenica region according to the Genocide Convention.

Following such massacres, a few hundreds of Arab volunteers came across Croatia into Bosnia to help the Bosnian Army protect the Bosnian Muslim civilian population. The number of the El-Mudžahid volunteers is still disputed, from around 300 to 1,500.

Following the end of the Bosnian War and, especially, after the 11 September attacks on the World Trade Center, Serbian propaganda started to fabricate the links between the group of Muslim foreign volunteers that fought in Bosnia, and Al Qaeda, in order to move the focus from the genocide committed by Serb forces in Bosnia to more interesting topic such as terrorism. According to Radio Free Europe produced research by Vlado Azinovic about alleged links between Bosnia and Al Qaeda Al Qaeda in Bosnia: Myth Or Present Danger, the claims about Al Qaeda in Bosnia are unverified and mostly fabricated. The presence of Wahhabism and of the remaining Muslim fighters do not qualify Bosnia as a particular threat to international security, according to the Azinovic's conclusion. Further more, Azinovic quotes Evan F. Kohlmann:

Serb propaganda throughout the whole war had portrayed the Bosnian Muslims as violent extremists, fundamentalists, and as eager to jump on the bandwagon of the mujahedin.

The Srebrenica Genocide, was the July 1995 killing of an estimated 8,000 Bosniak (Bosnian Muslim) boys and men, in the region of Srebrenica in Bosnia and Herzegovina by units of the Army of Republika Srpska (VRS) and a paramilitary unit from Serbia known as the "Scorpions" under the command of General Ratko Mladić during the Bosnian War. The Serb propaganda tried to deny the genocide and to present victims as the terrorists or foreign Islamic fighters. On September 21, 2003, president Bill Clinton honored the dead and condemned the genocidal madness. After his visit some of Serb media portrayed him as the Al Qaida supporter. Serb historian Carl Savich, described Bill Clintons's visit to Srebrenica Genocide Memorial as a visit to the killed mujahedeen soldiers at Srebrenica and to the memorial in Arabic, not Slavic "Bosnian" language.

As you can see I base this on ICTY findings and Radio Free Europe research not on media reports. Regards. The Dragon of Bosnia (talk) 18:33, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Re: Bosnian Mujahideen - I see. Now, it's not about Srebrenica, it's about aQ involvement (I believe there were absolutely no Qaeda-connected elements in the Srebrenica pocket) and it's not about the Serb propaganda neither (I actually remember claims of "Islamic terrorists" etc, but it's on par with claims the German attack on Warsaw Ghetto was a legitimate action against "Jewish terrorists"). I know what you want to say, but it's not really about the crimes of war, unless related to the Qaeda members. Else it's just off-topic. The introduction as it is in the article right now is okay for me, actually maybe even bit to long while politically-militarily explaining the conflict (other chapters of the article usually don't get such treatment).

However, According to Radio Free Europe produced research by Vlado Azinovic about alleged links between Bosnia and Al Qaeda Al Qaeda in Bosnia: Myth Or Present Danger, the claims about Al Qaeda in Bosnia are unverified and mostly fabricated. The presence of Wahhabism and of the remaining Muslim fighters do not qualify Bosnia as a particular threat to international security, according to the Azinovic's conclusion. is valid, just needs a link (like the review of this book I already mentioned above) and a slight rewording (Al Qaeda to al-Qaeda etc).

The actual figures on volunteers' numbers cited too would be a good addition (I didn't check the sources), but it should be mentioned only a faction was bin Laden-connected in any way (1,500 would be a huge number if someone thought they were all AQ fighters, for example more than many estimates of the strenght of al-Qaeda in Iraq at any given moment). --HanzoHattori (talk) 18:59, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

• Here is the link to the Radio Free Europe research. The numbers are also presented there. ([2] 400 is probably the most realistic number, according to the document request evidence.

The Dragon of Bosnia (talk) 19:23, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Now wait for the other people to speak out their opinion. --HanzoHattori (talk) 19:38, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

It is a part of Serbian propaganda to portrey Bosnian Muslims as terrorists.That phrase Terrorists in Bosnian was never used untill 9/11. I as a Croat(Croatians fought Bosnian Muslims at one time) can compare mudjahedeen forces in Bosnia something like mudjahedeens in Afganistan during the SSSR(Russian) occupation.They were used by USA to fight Soviets. For the same reason they were brought to Bosnia.To fight (communist) Serbs. Terrorists and Bosnia are a part of Serb propaganda.((GriffinSB) (talk) 19:54, 23 December 2007 (UTC)).

Bill clinton is al-qaeda, its all about getting power. serbs were right to kill the terrorists. serbs are not communists. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.234.105.91 (talk) 17:09, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Lock this article

I swear, you guys are like children. How about a lock until Wikipedia's Bosnian Edit War is resolved? --HanzoHattori (talk) 18:14, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

You don't like children? --RenniePet (talk) 20:05, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

But somebody needs to add the Bhutto assassination. 68.219.59.150 (talk) 03:17, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Only the current pakistani regime, claims that al-Qaeda was involved, one day after the assassination. It wouldn't be a good idea, before we get trustworthy proof. Wikipedia isn't here for rumors, but documentated facts. -- Kirjapan (talk) 07:52, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

Actually

Actually practically nothing at all is written about Pakistan (just 2 links). Many regional sections lack any summaries. --HanzoHattori (talk) 23:12, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

Regarding "alliance of" or just an "Islamic militant terrorist organization"

Quote: "... Alija Izetbegovic was willing to accept any help it could get, military or financial, including that of a number of Islamic organisations, such as al-Qaeda.". Here, al-Qaeda is called an islamic organisation, while the article starts with "... is an international alliance of Islamic militant terrorist organizations...". Shouldn't that be fixed? -- Kirjapan (talk) 13:26, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

What "fixed"? Al-Qaeda is Islamic organization (too). --HanzoHattori (talk) 14:55, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

It's hard to figure out what they are, with all the misinformation from the neoconservatists and the current US government. -- Kirjapan (talk) 07:30, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

Proposed change:

Al-Qaeda (also al-Qaida or al-Qa'ida or al-Qa'idah) (Arabic: القاعدة‎ al-qāʕida, translation: The Base) is an international Islamic militant terrorist organization, or alliance of organizations, founded in 1988[4] by Azzam (later replaced by Osama Bin Laden...

I've seldom heard of it refered to as an alliance of organizations except in wikipedia --BoogaLouie (talk) 17:29, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

You mean, it might be Atheist? Or Christian? --HanzoHattori (talk) 13:17, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

OK, how about:

Al-Qaeda (also al-Qaida or al-Qa'ida or al-Qa'idah) (Arabic: القاعدة‎ al-qāʕida, translation: The Base) is an international Islamic militant terrorist organization, or an international alliance of Islamic militant terrorist organizations, founded in 1988[4] by Azzam (later replaced by Osama Bin Laden... --BoogaLouie (talk) 20:39, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Claims to be an actual name

The claims of the BBC documentary are easily refuted. The whole passage should be deleted. A simple Lexus Nexus search shows that the arab media has been using the term Al-Qaeda in 1994. It was NOT first used in 1998 as contended by this BBC show. Fruthermore, documents exist that are labeled Al-Qaeda since 1989.

Why was this information deleted from the main page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.192.31.8 (talk) 15:20, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Documentation would be appreciated, when making such claims. -- Kirjapan (talk) 07:46, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I agree references would be very much appreciated. The BBC documentary doesn't contend that the name was first used in 1998 by the way. The text in the article cites an executive order issued by Bill Clinton, issued in 1998 that refers to "al-Qaeda" as the name of an organisation, but the documentary didn't mention it. Other documents have used the words "al-qaeda" for possibly centuries, but not as the name of an organisation. It just means "the base" normally. Perhaps that is a source of confusion here. This seems to be the case with the Bosnian document too, where the words "al-qaeda" are used to refer to a military base rather than the name of an organisation.--Distinguisher (talk) 00:34, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Maybe if my edit wasn't revereted you wouldn't be so confused. The Arab media reported on Al Qaida in 1994. A bomb manual was found in the 93 WTC bombers that was labeled "Al Qaida" that was dated 1989. This was all sourced in the edit that was reverted. Chudogg (talk) 04:50, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

I find it childish my full referenced edit gets reverted and I ask why and I'm told to find references. Whatever. Here ya go.

AL AHRAM WEEKLY, "The Afghan connection" April 14, 1994:

I left Egypt with enormous popular and official support which was only appreciated later with shock by the regime. All the procedures were legal when I left in the middle of 1985, went to Jeddah and from there to Pakistan where I worked as a doctor with the Mujahedin, Zawahri said. When he settled in Peshawar he established, with Bin Laden's financial help, Al-Qa'ida (the base) to host Arab volunteers. The first and most active group that went to Afghanistan was made up of Adli Youssef, Ali Abdel-Fattah and Mohamed El-Islambouli who moved on after his stopover in Jeddah. "They all went to Peshawar via Saudi Arabia and played a leading role in organising the Arab-Afghan groups," an Islamist defendant said.

When Zawahri managed to convince Bin Laden to establish Al-Qa'ida, Jihad members from a variety of Arab states came to have a hostel of their own.

AL AHRAM WEEKLY, "Faces of Militancy" April 14, 1994:

In 1985, he went to Saudi Arabia where he worked in a hospital. It was during this period that he met Osama Bin Laden, who established Al-Qa'ida, a base for volunteers en route from Egypt to Afghanistan.

These are from a Major Egyptian Newspaper translated into English. I'm sure a professional academic researcher could find numerous records of the Al Qaida organization published around this time.

As far as the WTC bombers, Stephen Engelberg. One Man and a Global Web of Violence. The New York Times January 14, 2001:

"Two separate translations of the document, one done at the request of The New York Times, show that the heading said Al Qaeda -- which translates as The Base, the name of Mr. bin Laden's group. In addition, the document lists a publication date of 1989, a year after Mr. bin Laden founded his organization."

Let me know if that settles your confusion. :::Chudogg (talk) 15:47, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Osama bin Laden himself stated in the year 2001 that bases had been established and maintained for the enlistment and instruction of volunteers. "We used to call the training camp al-Qaeda." [3] Therefore it should not come as any surprise that a training manual turned up with the name 'al-Qaeda' written on it. Nobody disputes that instances of 'al-Qaeda' can be found dating back several years -- the question, Adam Curtis contends, is did the term refer to the name of an actual organisation, or just the training camps themselves. In support of the latter position, Curtis argues that there is no evidence of Bin Laden using the term 'al Qaeda' to refer to the name of an international terrorist organisation until after the September 11th attacks, when he realised that this was the name the Americans had seized on. On the other hand, you have produced two sources that argue in favour of the former position. It's not for us to say which is correct. Only that all notable views must be included. I simply ask that you do this without deleting information already present in the article. smb (talk) 16:38, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

First, I didn't delete any information out of the article (although I do contend as much in my post above). I put the historical account of the term Al Qaida as it is on record, which somebody didn't see fit and deleted it. As it stands, the reader is under the impression the first use of the term is in 1998 by the Clinton administration, this is a monumentous falsehood.

I did not simply "produced two sources that argue in favour of the former position" as you contend. The sources were from an Egyptian Newspaper in early 1994, that contend that Bin Laden's organization was called Al Qaida. I hope you realize the significance of this in countering somebody's arguement that "the west" began using the term in 1998. I would be willing to bet that than academic study of the origins of the term would find many Arabic media had used the term itself. Al Ahram is one of the few translated into English.

Further media accounts document the term "Al Qaida" (and various spellings) through 1996, especially after the July Khobar Towers. Many translate the term as "The Foundation" after Islamic Salvation Foundation. Not as "The Base". (This was also in my orginal post)

Adam Curtis's theory relies heavily on disproving the testimony of Al Fadl as a fraud, mostly by trying to document him as an opportuneer (which is usually contended against every defector throughout history at some point or another). However, his testimony was corraborerated by another unrelated defector as well as intelligence the agencies already had. I've been meaning to research this and document it further.

However, even if one were to accept his testimony has false, his contention that the west began using the term "Al Qaida" to use RICO laws against Bin Laden is so patently absurd as his organization had already been referred to that long before any of that nonsense came to play.

Oh an as far as " It's not for us to say which is correct." Please show a little consistency. I presented an accurate historical accounting of the claims of Salman Pak and had "Universal Census" and "SSIC" thrown in my face to delete any and all information that wasn't a simple debunking of claims. Don't worry. I'll be getting back to that.Chudogg (talk) 17:43, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Is this silly debate still going on? I haven't been paying close attention to this page but I thought this was settled a long time ago. It was over a year ago now that I provided evidence that bin Laden used the term in 1989 on written documents to refer to an actual organization. Claims that the US invented the term in 1998 are beyond delusional. I'm looking at the article now and the evidence is still there:

Others such as CNN journalist Peter Bergen and author Lawrence Wright dispute Burke's contention. Bergen argues that two documents seized from the Sarajevo office of the Illinois-based Benevolence International Foundation show that the organization was established in August, 1988. Both of these documents contain minutes of meetings held to establish a new military group and contain the term "al-qaeda". [33]

The paragraph following presents another written document produced by Lawrence Wright. The only problem here is the first line; there is no other reference to "Burke's contention" in the article, and if we're talking about Jason Burke, it is a gross oversimplification of his position to claim that he says the US invented the term al Qaeda.

I'd say the Adam Curtis stuff should be a footnote at best; having a paragraph (and indeed a whole section) devoted to this "theory" is a bit ridiculous. Has he written any published work or conducted any independent investigation of the evidence that exists about al-Qaeda? Has he consulted document experts or even claimed that these documents are forgeries? Or is this whole "theory" a rather bizarre misunderstanding of some claim made in the documentary? I suspect the latter, especially since Curtis' "theory" is not even directly sourced, other than a vague reference to a three-part documentary. I have seen a good bit of the documentary, and I don't recall this particular claim. I do recall the claim - more consistent with Burke's analysis - that al qaeda is not just (or even primarily) an organization, and that the west has exaggerated al qaeda's power and turned it into a much more threatening entity, but that is not the same as the nonsense spouted here.

Unfortunately the page is protected now so this will have to stay, but when it is unprotected I suggest removing the Curtis stuff completely and changing the name of the following section so that it is clear that there really isn't a credible dispute about whether there was an organization named "al-qaeda" prior to the US saying so. csloat (talk) 07:40, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

flag

It just occurred to me that Al Qaeda does not have a flag. Do they have any symbol or flag that represents them? Kingturtle (talk) 02:30, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

To my best knowledge several actually. It was discussed before, too. --HanzoHattori (talk) 23:13, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

Abu Ebeida El-Banashiri

"Abu Ebeida El-Banashiri" in the bin Ladin quote needs a pipelink to Abu Ubaidah al-Banshiri. --Cam (talk) 16:39, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Al Qaida as a CIA related organisation

This video tell that 9.11 was made by cia in the goal to colonize and control the world.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3qiv7_aaron-russo-sur-le-911-le-cfr-et-ro_politics

It says that al qaida was also created by usa for the same reasons.

Cia put micro chip in ossama bin laden's brain to control it.

Osama bin laden live actually in hawai with girls sex alcohol and drugs and that al qaida is nothing but an urban legend created as a pretext for american colonialism.

Obscur macons-lions-sionist jews-evengelists leaders of usa have created the 11 september, al qaida, islamic terrorism , ethnic conflicts and evengelical missionaries to colonize control and exploit the world.

Can this hypthesis be added to this article?

Hanzukik (talk) 11:42, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Knowing the idiot's censorsing this article, I'm sure it can be. Go Ahead! 72.192.31.8 (talk) 14:55, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

No, it can't. all that is in conspiracy theories about 9/11. Aaron Russo is not a notable source and it is not in English. --BoogaLouie (talk) 01:39, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Thank you Boogalouie you enlightened me so Al qaida is a mere religiocentrist fachistic terrorist organisation.

But it's still strange that all qaida "operations" were exploited by usa to control middle east and central asia energy resources. Hanzukik (talk) 17:07, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

How does the united states control OPEC? We still pay for gas don't we? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.212.100.18 (talk) 00:52, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Diaa Rashwan

I do not want to wade into the middle of this edit war that, frankly, I do not understand, all I would like to request is a simple edit to an early paragraph that uses the name Diaa Rashwan and does not explain who this person is. I had to google the name to find out that he is a Dr. associated with the Al-Ahram Center. Could we just change it to say Dr. Diaa Rashwan, with the Al-Ahram Center for Political and Strategic Studies. This would led those comments the weight I feel they deserve. thanksDragyn07 (talk) 10:00, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Thai Interwikilink

Since the page is locked, I'm wondering if anyone can add th:อัลกออิดะห์ into the page. Thank you. --Manop - TH (talk) 16:19, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

conspiracy theories about 9/11

Is there an evidence to back up the the 'conspiracy theory' that AlQaeda were responsible for 9/11. Bush did say that he had proof but it was never released and as far as I know Bin Laden's 'confession' was a fabricated video.

Any sources for "Al-Qaeda has attacked civilian and military targets in various countries, the most notable being the September 11, 2001 attacks."

Any sources for "Evidence points to suicide squads led by al-Qaeda military commander Mohammed Atta as the culprits of the attacks, with bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri, Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, and Hambali as the key planners and part of the political and military command."

This might sound silly but for such a claim there seems to be no sound sources. 86.11.162.102 (talk) 08:10, 16 January 2008 (UTC)