Talk:List of best-selling music artists

All sources must be published by highly Reliable Third Parties

Let me emphasize that we are to accept only highly reliable sources here at List of best-selling music artists (examples of those could be found at the reference section of the page). We've had lots of folks here in the past who have made attempts in adding artists to this page with sources that aren't reliable, and those edits have been quickly reverted. If one is not sure of the reliability of a source which is going to be submitted to support the sales figures of an artist, I suggest that editors discuss that here at the talk page first before proceeding. Thanks.--Harout72 (talk) 17:31, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

Deep Purple

Deep Purlpe had never solf more than 100 million copies. Their best selling album, Machine Head hadn't sold that more than 4 million copies.

Error with Enya

The musician Enya is listed under the category of selling 50 to 74 million albums where right in her biography on wikipedia, it states that she has sold around 77 million albums, which in that case would have her bumped up to the section of selling 75 to 99 million albums, —Preceding unsigned comment added by PatrioticBoy1993 (talk • contribs) 19:46, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

Coldplay

Coldplay needs to be on this list. They've sold 50 million albums —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.161.153.156 (talk) 21:18, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

the word "categorically" is incorrect in this context

categorical means: "without exceptions or conditions; absolute; unqualified and unconditional: a categorical denial". although it can also mean: "of, pertaining to, or in a category", the first meaning is far more commonly used and accepted. Given that this article can in no way be categorical because it already states "This information cannot be listed officially, as there is no organization that has recorded global music sales.", it would be much better to re-phrase the sentence as: "This list documents the world's best-selling music artists alphabetically and by categories." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tc847 (talk • contribs) 15:50, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

Queen

Can somebody please move Queen as estimates put them at over 300 million records sold. Someone keeps moving it, there are pleanty of links on the Queen page that confirm this. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.21.128.64 (talk) 18:22, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

References should be third-party sources, as mentioned higher up this Talk page. A band's own site doesn't qualify as such. Loganberry (Talk) 14:16, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Queen more than 300 million albums sold, EMI Group Press release February 2009: http://www.emigroup.com/Press/2009/press17.htm —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.138.253.84 (talk) 01:23, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Bee Gees

The Bee Gee's were Australian not from the United Kingdom. If you have listed AC/DC as Australian surely you can do the same for the Bee Gee's. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.20.54.227 (talk) 22:35, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

I'm just passing by here, so don't know the criteria, but if it's birthplace then United Kingdom isn't accurate either as the Gibbs were born on the Isle of Man, which is not part of the UK. Loganberry (Talk) 14:17, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Yes, The Isle Of Mann is part of the UK. They also lived in England for a long time, making them British. They are, in fact, British-Australian - just like AC/DC. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.115.36.202 (talk) 02:34, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

It is quite imperative that editors understand that we are to state only the country the acts are formed in, and not the country they were born in or as some editors may believe the citizenship they hold. Again guys, we are not to care about a nationality here, just the country they represent; in other words, the country artists have begun their careers in. --Harout72 (talk) 00:06, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

That's not true. Nowhere does it state we are to list them as the country that they formed in. Instead, we are to list the country which they represent and belong to - and therefore the country they formed in is irrelevant.

Error with Luis Miguel

Genre: Latin/Pop/Bolero/Ballad. Not Mariachi. Ignaciobm (talk) 14:37, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

Hall & Oates?

Hall & Oates's Wikpedia article and their own website claim that they have sold over 60 million albums. Behind The Music claim they are the most successful duo of all time, which would put them ahead of Pet Shop Boys and (debatably) The Carpenters. I don't know whether these are reliable enough sources, but it seems worth mentioning.

Error with Johnny Cash

On Johnny Cash's Wikipedia page it states he sold over 90 million records in his career. However, on this page it has him under the 51 - 74 million. I have found many sources that back up his 90 million sales. I think someone who knows how should put him in the right place, I do not. I'm just a Cash fan who wonders why he isn't getting the right credit on this page.

Thank you for your time. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.16.111.111 (talk) 20:26, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

I removed the statement at the page of Johnny Cash which spoke of the 90 million records, because it was supported by this source which does not mention anything about record-sales. Here, on this page; however, sources of that kind would not be qualified as reliable even if they included record sales. We only accept highly reliable third party sources here. Examples could be found here.--Harout72 (talk) 15:26, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

I have found a few sites that back up Cash's 90 million sales, I'm not sure if they qualify or not. Maybe someone does.

http://www.monstersandcritics.com/people/archive/peoplearchive.php/Johnny_Cash/biography/

http://www.answers.com/topic/johnny-cash

http://www.wayango.com/johnny-cash/bio/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.16.111.111 (talk) 16:28, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

The sources you are providing cannot be regarded as reliable, please see here what sort of sources are accepted here at this page.--Harout72 (talk) 16:51, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Green Day

Green Day have sold over 65 million records worldwide, they should be on the list. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Samuelity (talk • contribs) 14:56, 15 April 2009 (UTC) Signed.

YES, Green Day have sold over 65 million records worldwide. The source is very reliable: [1]. I do not envision any problems adding them to this list.. What do you think Harout72? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Borkan85 (talk • contribs) 8:40, 2 May 2009 (UTC) Signed.

I am afraid it's not reliable whatsoever. All articles that we use here to support artists' stay must come from prominent news services. Such would be CNN, FOX News, Times, BBC, NBC, ABC etc. Major record company publishings are acceptable as well. See examples of those here --Harout72 (talk) 16:57, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

But the link above is the Live Nation - Major Record & Concert Promoting Company! Still Don't Understand You Borkan85 (talk) 11:05, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

Examples of Major record companies would be Warner Music, Sony/BMG, Universal Music.--Harout72 (talk) 15:02, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

No Beatles?!!!

Hey - where's THE BEATLES??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.17.84.250 (talk) 18:51, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

Somebody messed around with the article, I reverted their edits. The Beatles are back!! Percxyz (talk) 19:00, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

T.Rex

T.Rex sold more that that number. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wyora (talk • contribs) 22:00, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

Andrea Bocelli

Bocelli is not just an opera singer, he is also a classical singer (not the same thing), and aboave all a pop singer, wish is why he has sold so many albums (the best selling ones were the pop ones). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.68.244.107 (talk) 06:44, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Why dont add more categories?

Hi, just a question, why dont add new categories for artists who are considered "best sellers" like Alicia Keys, who have sold 28 million albums, or Sarah Brightman, who has sold 26. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.219.57.226 (talk) 22:44, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Unless artists have sold over 50 million records worldwide it's not worth mentioning them here as inclusion of those under 50 million would make the list unbelievably long as well as non-challenging.--Harout72 (talk) 01:14, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Alanis Morissette

Alanis MUST to be on this list. She has sold more than 55 million albums worldwide. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Borkan85 (talk) 21:18, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

1. Your edit has been reverted due to supporting Alanis Morissette's stay with a source that no longer exists, the reliability of which might have been questionable even if it was still available.

2. Do not remove artists from the list without leaving explanations in the edit-history or without discussing it here at the talk-page first. Regards.--Harout72 (talk) 16:50, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

Sorry, I really didn't caught the eye on this discussion. I have found another source what do you think? [2] I think this one is more reliable! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Borkan85 (talk) 8:18, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

I am afraid that won't do either as we are to accept articles published by prominent news services only. Examples of those could be found here.--Harout72 (talk) 16:52, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

What about this one& [3] I Still Don't Understand You! Borkan85 (talk) 11:40, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

Unlike other page where maybe some of the statements could be supported by alike sources like the one you have above, here, we are to accept only articles published by prominent news services to avoid inflated record-sales figures. Examples of those prominent news services would be CNN, FOX News, Times, BBC, NBC, ABC etc. Please see the section of references to see what we so far have accepted.--Harout72 (talk) 15:08, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

Okay, let's continue our discussion about Morissette's sales. Let's count: Jagged Little Pill = 33 million [4] Supposed Former Infatuation Junkie = 8 million [5] Under Rug Swept = 4 million [6] So-Called Chaos = 385.000 [7] Flavors of Entanglement = nearly 1 million worldwide MTV Unplugged = 6 million [8] and others Feast on Scraps 100.000, Jagged Little Pill Acoustic 70.000, Jagged Little Pill Live 3 million, Live In Navajo Nation 200.000, The Collection 500.000... So, At LEAST 50 MILLION!!! I TOTALLY Don't understand you! Borkan85 (talk) 03:58, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

First, let me just say that your edit has been reverted due to a poor source. Having said that, all sources above which you are utilizing to support your argument with cannot be regarded as reliable. It's futile to continue this discussion unless you come forward with reliable sources. Regards.--Harout72 (talk) 15:16, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

Combining Album, singles and downloads makes the comparison pointless.

There must be sime weighting between albums and singles. How can downloading 2 songs from one album be worth twice as much as buying the album?

If I download 6 songs from Thriller (which I am sure people do), hw can that be worth be worth six times the sales of buying Sgt Pepper?

I have two Rolling Stones singles and one Led Zep album, so do I have twice as many Stones as zep. or do I have 6 times as many Zep as Stones. Unless you know the format, you can't give the answer unless you know the format, which is no way to judge populatiry, volume of sales or anything else.

Error found in the 200 Million Plus Category

According calculations, and perhaps I may have mis-calculated, but both Mariah Carey and Celine Dion have not sold over 200 million albums, yet they are in the category of those who have accomplished this feat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.210.214.202 (talk) 04:54, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Both artists are supported by reliable sources which confirm their sales of over 200 million records worldwide.--Harout72 (talk) 16:48, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Total units, or full-length album sales?

In terms of singles, videos, albums and EPs combined, the Beatles are definitely over 1 billion. In terms of full-length album sales, they top out around 400 million. That said, I think many of the "sources" cited in this list are not clear as to which they mean.

Oafah (talk) 16:54, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

The figures within sources represent the total worldwide sales, that is Albums, Singles, Music-Videos, Compilation-Albums and Downloads combined. Some News Services may use the word "Records"and others may use the word "Albums" to describe where artists' total sales stand; however, both phrases refer to one thing only Records.--Harout72 (talk) 23:31, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Valeriya She couldn't sell More than other Prominent Artists

Valeriya is Russian singer who was breakthru artist since 1995 and 2001 in Russia. But the probable fact that she sold over 100 million records is absolutely false. Despite the source (it's the only one, we have no other sources) is prominent, the author of this message just supposed the sales. or it was just mistake in sales. Trust me, I live in Russia, and I clearly know that the only prominent artist of our country who sold more than 100 and even more than 200 million is the Alla Pugacheva. And I think it is such audacity to add Valeriya to this list. Yes, she is known in Russia, not much however, but she is absolutely unknown worldwide. Borkan85 (talk) 05:05, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

We are to base ourselves on what the prominent news services report and not what editors like yourself assume. Currently, Valeriya is supported by a reliable source and that's all that matters. Do not remove artists from the list without discussing first. In fact, this happens one more time I won't hesitate a second to take you to WP:AN/I as most of your edits at this page so far have been disruptive. Regards. --Harout72 (talk) 23:36, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

Certainly, the source seems to be reliable. But 100 million her records sold is very, very unlikely. Very. Unlikely. She is very far from being that popular in Russia and Russia is very far from being a country where people actually buy music legally. Garik 11 (talk) 10:08, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Hey, I have found an interview with Valeria's husband and producer Prigozhin where the 100 mln sales is called a "canard". Yet Prigozhin claims that although there is no official statistics available, he believes such sales numbers "are more than achievable, although may look arguable". In a word, it's a lie. Sadly, according to Wikipedia's "reliable source" rule, this lie will stay here. Garik 11 (talk) 10:31, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Well, if we seem to have inflated figures while using highly reliable sources (most of which thoroughly study figures before releasing their articles), imagine what would happen to this page if we allowed editors bring in sources that editors like Borkan85 above are fond of. Unfortunately, this is all we can do, rely ourselves on what's been reported. However, if there is another prominent news service which has reported Valeriya's sales otherwise (lower than 100 million) than feel free to present it here. Perhaps, we could replace the current one with that. The interview above does not seem to be coming from a reliable source.--Harout72 (talk) 15:12, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

The source above is just as reliable as a specialised show business site in Russia can be. I don't know how competent you are to judge its reliability. Unfortunately, we do seem to have no option but to trust a deluded yet English "prominent news service". Garik 11 (talk) 17:26, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

I am competent enough to realize that Russia has reliable sources; unfortunately, the one above, I highly doubt, is one of them. As I mentioned above, try and locate a highly reliable source which perhaps has reported a lower sales figure, and I'd be more than happy to degrade the artist Valeriya. However, if you disagree with my decision you could always refer to the folks at WP:RSN with the source in question. However, there seems to be more than one reliable source confirming her 100 million units in sales, this article is by Times Online Regards.--Harout72 (talk) 00:09, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

Well, I'm just curious, why do you doubt its reliability? Is it because of your outstanding command of Russian? Or because of its unimpressive design? Then here's yet another interview with Prigozhin (and Valeria) from a specialised music site where he says basically the same: 100 million sales is not official numbers, there is no any proof or statistics, but he just thinks this number is possible, mainly because in Russia people buy pirated music in uncontrolled amounts. It is obvious that 100 mln sales is just what it was called above - a canard designed by Valeria's management to impress naive Westerners. It seems that everybody in Russia thinks so. But again, I do not disagree with you personally, because you just seem so very deluded by deluded media which by Wiki standards are considered reliable sources. Garik 11 (talk) 08:24, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

While your more recent source seems somewhat reliable, the content within doesn't seem to contain anything promising enough that could easily contradict what the deluded highly reliable sources claim (as you put it). In other words, the husband/composer does not refute the 100 million sold records during the interview (although, I too believe that it is an inflated figure rigged for promotional purposes). One must understand; however, that removing an artist from the list while supported by reliable sources could collapse the entire system which we all follow to keep wikipedia clean. Therefore, we need an article (from a reliable source) which unlike the one above clearly states either a lower sales figure for Valeriya or claims something that firmly refutes the invented record-sales. Haven't Russian prominent news services like Izvestia, Pravda or any other news services published anything that could help our argument? Any reliable source would do as long as we don't turn the removal of this artist into a controversy later on. --Harout72 (talk) 20:52, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

Again, I never said that we must remove her from the list, at least not now having that little information that we have. I am well aware of Wikipedia policies and try to follow them. But I am just hoping that thoughtful readers and editors would read this discussion page and be not so trustful in what they read in the article and supporting sources. Also, I was going to say a lot about Izvestia, Pravda you mentioned and many other things Russia-wise, but that could just turn into a long and unproductive discussion. It is good to know that you realise that those are inflated sales figures though. Garik 11 (talk) 20:39, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

Believe me, if it were up to me, I'd toss out most of the acts within the 50-74 million section and degrade the rest of them (including AC/DC, The Beatles, Alla Pugacheva, Bee Gees etc.) as I am a person who believes in only the total figures that Gold, Platinum and Diamond Certifications represent. However, very few prominent news services have people for this sort of stuff who study sales figures before they throw in numbers into their music related articles. Anyways, let me know if you come across anything for Valeriya, that could help us proceed further. --Harout72 (talk) 23:32, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

the beatles and paul mccartney

i have just seen that with michael jackson there stands from 1967 to present, so since he only made records with the jackson 5 in the first years we can't include those albums or you also need to give paul mccartney a boost of 1.3 billion albums because he sold them with his old band just like michael. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.196.225.242 (talk) 19:54, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

We currently have four reliable sources for Michael Jackson, the sales figures within all of which refer to his solo career. The years, however, are only there to show as to when artists have begun their singing career. In other words, one should not think that the ranking is based upon how many million of records an artist has sold during or starting from a specific period but rather the ranking is based upon what the total sales-figure represents, which in the case of Jackson, for example, does not include the sales of The Jackson 5.--Harout72 (talk) 23:37, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

Carlos Santana

Carlos Santana should be replace by Santana. All of Carlos' great and chart-topping albums have been issued with the Sanatana band. The sale's figure show sales by the Santana band combined with the solo sales of Carlos Santana.

It may seem that since the band is named after his last name it is the same to say Santana than Carlos Santana but it isn't. It is not the same to say Jon Bon Jovi than the band Bon Jovi. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.118.27.157 (talk) 21:05, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

I am not sure I follow you, the current source by BBC is for Santana, not Santana (Band). The source does nowhere state that the figure is for Santana and Santana Band combined. --Harout72 (talk) 23:55, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

Frank Sinatra

Frank Sinatra has sold over 600 million albums http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/toptenlists/Best_Selling_Musicians —Preceding unsigned comment added by HollywoodGame (talk • contribs) 17:21, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

That's not a reliable source, I'm afraid. --Harout72 (talk) 23:21, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

Tupac Shakur

Tupac has sold over 80 million albums. It actually states on his own wiki page. MTV also reported this as Eminem is closing in on Tupacs album sales, please change thanks http://www.borntoredefine.com/15-most-influential-musicians/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Roscoe1874 (talk • contribs) 15:43, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

He's currently supported by a reliable source according to which, Shakur has sold 70 million albums. The source; however, you are providing above is not a reliable one I'm afraid. --Harout72 (talk) 04:10, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

If you have a guiness book of world records look in it, over 75 million. That 'reliable source' is old. He's sold more than eminem, fact. Although Eminem is catching up but 2pac is the biggest selling hip hop artist

http://www.last.fm/music/2Pac http://www.hip-hop-dance.net/tupac-shakur.html http://www.billboard.music-skins.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_121_1537

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.218.47.163 (talk) 13:30, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

None of the above sources can be regarded as reliable. I notice, it's stated in some of the sources provided above that Shakur has sold over 50 million albums in USA alone (including this one, which from the first glance may appear to be reliable from its deceptive Billboard logo). To prove that those are not reliable sources and the given figures within are exaggerated, I am providing here the RIAA's Certifications which I went through one by one and I am counting 37.5 million albums, 6 million singles and 250,000 videos for Shakur. All in all, Shakur has not sold 50 million records in US (that's albums, singles and videos combined), not to mention that 37.5 million albums in sales according to Certifications immediately disagrees with the statements published within the sources above. --Harout72 (talk) 23:41, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

So even though 2pac is in the guiness book of records for being the biggest selling hip hop artist of all time, Eminem is above him in the list. Makes a lot of sense

http://www.bbc.co.uk/music/reviews/f89x BBC, there's your reliable source http://www.bbc.co.uk/music/reviews/f89x —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.94.38 (talk) 21:41, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

I don't have the first clue whether Eminem has surpassed Shakur sales-wise or not, what I do know; however,is that all artists on this page must be supported by reliable sources. That said, this source does not seem reliable at all; although, it may appear to be by its deceptive BBC logo. Take a look at what it says at the top of the page information comes from MusicBrainz. You can add or edit information about Pac's Life at musicbrainz.org.. That is a clear case of an unreliable source.--Harout72 (talk) 01:15, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

To say that the BBC is not a reliable source is unbelievable, you say it's been taken from another site but the fact is the BBC has put it on their website. I've just checked through your own page and it's clear this isn't the first time you have vandalised this page. Please stop changing it .--Roscoe1874 (talk) 04:19, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

That's not a BBC page, I am quite certain when I see a BBC page, we have lots of references for List of best-selling music artists coming from BBC, one example of BBC would be this. These kinds of pages; however, are Wiki mirror pages or copied somewhere else as it is the case of the source you seem quite confident about. Please, don't revert edits without discussions, I have been policing this page for a very long time and have tried my best to maintain it well.--Harout72 (talk) 04:29, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Shania Twain

One of the best selling artists of the Soundscan era is Canadian country singer Shania Twain. She has sold more than 60 million copies worldwide but isn't on any list.

She's on the list now, she definitely deserves to be on the list, thanks for bringing it to my attention.--Harout72 (talk) 04:56, 19 May 2009 (UTC)