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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by John Hill (talk | contribs) at 01:58, 27 February 2011 ({{WikiProjectBannerShell|1= added - importance rating upgraded). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 13:45, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

"Shijia", I think it should be "Hereditary Families" instead of "Hereditary Houses". Anermay (talk) 15:54, 23 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

About Shijia

In Chinese "世家", the first character means "Hereditary", this is noncontroversial. But for the second character "家", it is complex and hard to translate with one word. In ancient Chinese language, this character means more than a family, but a tiny kingdom. It contains hosts, servants, land, property and sometimes armies. It is usually a vassal of a kingdom. It is led by chief of the clan just like kingdom by the king. But above all the core of "家" is the clan of its hosts. So I changed it to "Hereditary Clans". --Anermay (talk) 10:12, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Contents

Many thanks to Guss of the Dutch wiki, who made and formatted a complete list of the contents by chapter. I found this very useful so I have translated it. I did consult the original titles to try to ensure the translation is correct. Will add links later.Evangeline (talk) 07:40, 10 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

about the spreading and supplement of shiji,could anyone find source in English?What I could find is written in Chinese,that would make no sense in English wiki.Gisbrother (talk) 08:22, 7 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

the commentaries

As I vaguely remember from my graduate classes, there are three major commentaries on the Shi ji from the Tang era; these commentaries are of immense importance in interpreting the often-obscure language of the 2,000-year-old history. Someone more knowledgeable should, I think, at least refer to these in the article. Jakob37 (talk) 02:09, 7 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

translation

the follow section need grammar correction：source materials, edition ,annotations and commentaries Gisbrother (talk) 16:52, 17 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have fixed about half the "Source Materials" section. No time for the last two paragraphs. Will try to do later. Evangeline (talk) 22:43, 23 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There are so many Chinese characters.are they all necessary?Gisbrother (talk) 15:54, 25 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe not. I don't feel strongly about it. I just left the Chinese characters in because the first editor, who was not a native English speaker, put them in under "Sources." But if you think it makes the article hard to read, feel free to take them out. The Chinese characters are all found below in the list of chapters anyway.Evangeline (talk) 23:57, 26 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Please leave them in!! --JWB (talk) 01:48, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Would the following sentence make readers confused that Spring and Autumn Annals of Yanzi is a work of Guan?

I have read Guan's Mu Min... and the Spring and Autumn Annals of Yanzi

  • the chapter Qingzhong (轻重,literally Light and Heavy) talks about what is important and what is less important.
  • Chengma (Chariot and horses) isn't a chapter but many chapters on economy and war.
  • Dayue liezhuan 大宛列傳 may be Dayuan liezhuan
  • Fan Yu Cai Ze liezhuan, 范睢蔡澤列傳 may be Fan Sui Cai Ze liezhuan
  • 谍记 and 谱谍 only talk about grandfather father son grandson and so on,no events. 历 talk about events and which year an event happend.

Gisbrother (talk) 16:55, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you so much, Gisbrother! I have used all your corrections. I hope this version is better. Evangeline (talk) 20:23, 28 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Editions

I translated the Editions section from the Chinese Wiki.

Evangeline (talk) 08:56, 29 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Request for Ancient Chinese History References in the Sons of noah article

Hi! I was curious if anyone has good references on what descendant of Noah is supposed by scholars to be the father of the Sinitic peoples...--Gniniv (talk) 23:34, 10 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I am not aware of any sons of Noah specifically identified with Chinese mythological figures. But an ancestor of Noah, Enoch, was identified by a school of 17-18th century French Jesuits, known as Figurists, with Fu Xi. John Webb identified Noah himself with Emperor Yao, and thought that people of China and India descended from his son Shem. See e.g. any of David E. Mungello's books on Jesuits in China: a bit at http://books.google.com/books?id=ioOfxzJe8AQC&pg=PA100 in his recent The great encounter..., and a lot more in his Curious land; go to http://books.google.com/books?id=wb4yPw4ZgZQC and search for "Noah" (in particular, p. 179, 337 there). -- Vmenkov (talk) 23:56, 10 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the info...--Gniniv (talk) 23:59, 10 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Names

what other names do scholars use except Records of the Grand Historian? Gisbrother (talk) 11:37, 5 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The most recent scholarly translation (still ongoing) is William Nienhauser's published by the University of Indiana, which will be the first complete translation into English. It is called "The Grand Scribe's Records". Herbert Giles translated Shiji as Historical Record. Nienhauser may have used a different name for his translation just because of copyright laws. Evangeline (talk) 00:23, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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