Talk:English Defence League
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Protest in Hinkley, Lesictershire
I don't know wether it should be added but they are protesting in Hinckley today. Just thought it needed to be added to the protests. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.30.115.137 (talk) 17:43, 5 March 2011 (UTC)
Man banned from trains after racially abusing family on platform
A report of an EDL member with "33 previous convictions included other racially aggravated offending linked to his association with the EDL" appeared in The Sheffield Star, 11 March 2009. Does this deserve a place in the article. ? Emeraude (talk) 14:52, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
- Think your link has gone wrong: [1]. I think the fact that EDL membership seems to be categorisable as anti-social behaviour for the purposes of a CRASBO is significant for inclusion in the article. I'm unsure whether the details of this particular case are though. Has it received any other coverage?
- PS, I think I'm right in saying that the Sheffield Star takes its content down quite quickly, so you may want to archive it before it disappears. --FormerIP (talk) 15:13, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
- Actually, I had mistyped the link; now corrected. Sheffield Star keeps its stories in archive, so it shouldn't disappear. I expect this will appear in other papers, including nationals. It's on The Star 's website because it today's news related to a local person in a local court; others will pick it up if they haven't already. Emeraude (talk) 16:15, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
In fact, they have already :
- BBC Lincs: Lincoln man banned from English Defence League meetings
- Newmarket Journal: Racist banned from EDL gatherings
- Lincoln Police Force Lincoln Man Given EDL CRASBO
- Lincolnshire Echo: English Defence League racist gets criminal Asbo after abusing Asian family
Many other local and evening papers are printing this as well. Should be more than enough to go on. Emeraude (talk) 16:24, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
No it does not, this is one member 9any evidacen hes a prominant member? I seem to recall that a similar incident in which the EDL member was threatend was blocked becaseu single incidents inviolving single mebers is not notable.Slatersteven (talk) 14:31, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
- Agree, I am sure members of the mainstream parties are also arrested from time to time. Its only notable if the person is a prominent member, or if a RS says that such behaviour is an inherent part of being a member of EDL, or that EDL members are constantly being arrested in such a manner. --Snowded TALK 17:26, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
Sweden Democrats
Sweden Democrats are described as far-right in multiple news sources [2] and a Google Books search shows up similar descriptions, please stop removing this. Sweden Democrats avoids mentioning this, a pov problem there. --Dougweller (talk) 19:58, 5 April 2011 (UTC)
- Agreed, its also a very badly written article! --Snowded TALK 19:59, 5 April 2011 (UTC)
- Many sources also do NOT describe them as "Far Right" - probably because, conventionally speaking, they aren't! Look at the article on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden_Democrats It does not use the "Far Right" label, which is normally reserved for fascistic groups. AFolkSingersBeard (talk) 11:11, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- The WP article does say things like "introduced a uniform ban in 1996", "in 1999 they rejected Nazism", "influenced by the French National Front", " Expressen ... retains the ban on Sweden Democrat advertising". This doesn't make them sound very MOR. Why their article isn't very clear about how they are viewed in terms of political position I wouldn't like to say, but Wikipedia is often not very accurate on these matters. --FormerIP (talk) 11:25, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- This is why I do not like non-slef applied lables. There seems to be a few sources that call the SD far right, but its not in the artilce and most sources seem to avoid callinig them anything they do not call themsleves. But i tink the SD artciel needs lookinig at.Slatersteven (talk) 12:41, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- We may call them far right if there is academic consensus to describe them that way. It is important to use good sources however, because the term far right can be used very loosely, for example to describe UKIP the the U.S. Tea Party. However I have not found any sources for this. It may be that they are too obscure. TFD (talk) 14:13, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- Too obscure? they have more support then the BNP and EDl combined. How much less obsure do you want?Slatersteven (talk) 14:17, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- I'm a bit lost. Numerous sources describe the SD as far right. We can qualify and say 'described as far-right', but we certainly have the sources. Dougweller (talk) 14:41, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- Well provide them then. The BNP got 563,000 votes in the 2010 election, compared with 339,000 for the Sweden Democrats and has a rich history which traces back to the NF and the BUF. Also, the Swedish may not gain the same attention in literature on right-wing politics. TFD (talk) 14:52, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- Thye SD got 5.7% of the vote and 20 MPs, how many has the BNP got? I think thats my point. Its not that they are less far right then the BNP but that the BNP have been targeted for that accusation.Slatersteven (talk) 15:03, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- " merely put back in what your far-right ally 86.96.227.90 had taken out" This is completely unacceptable as an edit description Mutliculturalist. And you know it. Alexandre8 (talk) 19:10, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- Thye SD got 5.7% of the vote and 20 MPs, how many has the BNP got? I think thats my point. Its not that they are less far right then the BNP but that the BNP have been targeted for that accusation.Slatersteven (talk) 15:03, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- Well provide them then. The BNP got 563,000 votes in the 2010 election, compared with 339,000 for the Sweden Democrats and has a rich history which traces back to the NF and the BUF. Also, the Swedish may not gain the same attention in literature on right-wing politics. TFD (talk) 14:52, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- I'm a bit lost. Numerous sources describe the SD as far right. We can qualify and say 'described as far-right', but we certainly have the sources. Dougweller (talk) 14:41, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- Too obscure? they have more support then the BNP and EDl combined. How much less obsure do you want?Slatersteven (talk) 14:17, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- We may call them far right if there is academic consensus to describe them that way. It is important to use good sources however, because the term far right can be used very loosely, for example to describe UKIP the the U.S. Tea Party. However I have not found any sources for this. It may be that they are too obscure. TFD (talk) 14:13, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- This is why I do not like non-slef applied lables. There seems to be a few sources that call the SD far right, but its not in the artilce and most sources seem to avoid callinig them anything they do not call themsleves. But i tink the SD artciel needs lookinig at.Slatersteven (talk) 12:41, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
- The WP article does say things like "introduced a uniform ban in 1996", "in 1999 they rejected Nazism", "influenced by the French National Front", " Expressen ... retains the ban on Sweden Democrat advertising". This doesn't make them sound very MOR. Why their article isn't very clear about how they are viewed in terms of political position I wouldn't like to say, but Wikipedia is often not very accurate on these matters. --FormerIP (talk) 11:25, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
While the article now says that the SD had "long-standing ties" with the NF, the source actually only says that the NF "was one of the larger sources of inspiration during the latter half of the 1980s" (before the SD rather became inspired by other parties such as the French NF from the 1990s). As the claim is not supported by the given source, I will remove it as I did with all the other ambigious information about this that is not really relevant to this particular article (nor uncontroversially correct). – Bellatores (t.) 11:24, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
- I deleted the whole thing. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the foundation of EDL, it might have a place in the Swedish article, it might have a place in the international section on this one although it seems to be very minor. --Snowded TALK 11:34, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
Edit request from Brown2695, 7 May 2011
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The English Defence League is not a "Far Right" organisation, It is a Peacefull Peoples Movement
Brown2695 (talk) 20:22, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Not done 4 sources say it is. CTJF83 22:14, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
- I expect there are far more than four sources that prove it is far right! By the way, Brown2695, "Peaceful" only has one "l". Multiculturalist (talk) 14:06, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
- And "People's" has an apostrophe. Emeraude (talk) 16:56, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
- Considering that an organizations place on the political spectrum is arbitrary, I doubt you could find a single article that "proves" anything of the sort. Wikipedia editors these days are really gotten to be sub par, pretentious and left leaning. Kinda annoying...
- And "People's" has an apostrophe. Emeraude (talk) 16:56, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
- I expect there are far more than four sources that prove it is far right! By the way, Brown2695, "Peaceful" only has one "l". Multiculturalist (talk) 14:06, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
Edit request from Craig.w.mcg, 25 May 2011
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EDL not Far-Right just right
Craig.w.mcg (talk) 10:19, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
Wikipedia relies on verifiable evidence. There are four reliable sources listed that describe the EDL as far right, more than sufficent for our purposes. There are many more sources for this. If you have reliable sources saying the EDL is not far right, please post them here. Emeraude (talk) 13:57, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Alpha Quadrant talk 22:21, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
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