Talk:Periplus of the Erythraean Sea

Muziris

The location of Muziris is not the main subject here. That should be left to the article on Muziris. While its whereabouts are still matter to differences in opinion, the stronger opinion is somewhere near to Kodungalloor. Being a matter of confusion, its better to avoid that discussion in this article. Hence dropping the lines about the location of Muziris.NMKuttiady (talk) 10:43, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Could Rhapta have been in modern-day Mozambique?

Does anyone have access to a copy of the "Periplus"? - either in the original Greek or in translation?

Carl Peters implies that it states that Rhapta lay, not at the mouth of its river, but some distance upstream, adding that this requirement would fit Quelimane quite well. But is he quoting the "Periplus" correctly?

Incidentally, remembering the successful Phoenician circumnavigation of Africa in 600 BC, it is by no means impossible that subsequent travellers would have ventured as far as the mouth of the Zambesi (or even beyond) - at the time when the "Periplus" was being compiled. I used to work in the Zimbabwean Meteorological Office, and can confirm that alternations in the coastal wind pattern did facilitate two-way journeys there. --DLMcN (talk) 17:58, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Reply

Dear David: Please note that I am travelling at the moment and having touble getting decent internet access, and won't be able to access my books and notes until after I return home later this month. I have three different English translations of the Periplus at home - of which, perhaps the most trustworthy one is that by Lionel Casson (based on an ealier one) which contains detailed notes as well as the Greek original. I will compare the accounts of Raphta after I get home and report back.

That said, perhaps you could start by checking out William H. Schoff's translation which has been digitalised and is online at: [1].

I think your supposition that other travellers, after the original Phoenician circumnavigation of Africa c. 600 BCE, probably sailed down the east coast of Africa is almost beyond question. There is evidence for this in both Western Classical and Chinese literature. I can give you more details on this if you wish, after I return home. Please remind me, though for, as I mentioned above, I am getting very forgetful (and also I will be very busy and distracted after I return). All best wishes, John Hill (talk) 11:16, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

Many thanks, John, for your helpful reply.

My interest stems from my involvement in the controversy surrounding Ancient Zimbabwe (and its principal monument Great Zimbabwe) ... i.e., I am wondering if knowledge of the gold riches there, might actually date back a couple of thousand years. The earliest known reference to gold deposits in that (approximate) area is, I think, by Cosmas Indicopleustes of Alexandria in the sixth century AD.--DLMcN (talk) 18:36, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

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Chain of Aphrodite

The Erythrian or Red Sea ports on the coast of Egypt starting with Mursilis and running through Bernice were at the time the Periplus of the Erythrian Sea was written known as the chain of Aphrodite. See http://www.amazon.com/Atlas-Ancient-Egypt-Cultural/dp/0871963345 Each port was an oasis with tall strong trees called Terabithim by the Phoenicians, suitable for use as masts. Between the port of Philidelphia (Pi Ha Hiroth in Egyptian, modern Quasir, Biblical Elim) and Elat at the head of the Gulf of Aqaba there was a booming trade from the 12th dynasty onward bringing mortuary goods to the Temple of Karnak across the sea from Egypts 18th dynasty capital at Thebes where Hatshepsets fleet delivered the linen cloth from Byblos, bitumen and natron from the dead sea coming down the wadi arabah and the , Frankincense, and Myhr traveling up the mountains and along the coast from the bab al mandab strait between Ethi Ophir and punt (Ethiopia and Yemen) to mummify the dead in return for Nub (gold) from Nubia taken at Berbnice.Metaphysical Engineering (talk) 02:04, 25 May 2014 (UTC)

The Land of Punt is believed to have been centered in the Horn region and the Red Sea coast of Sudan, partly because the main incense producing (not just incense exporting) area is centered in northeastern Somalia [2]. Some recent oxygen isotopic analysis also suggests that Eritrea and Ethiopia constitute the particular parts of Punt where an Ancient Egyptian expedition brought back some baboons from as gifts [3]. Middayexpress (talk) 12:13, 25 May 2014 (UTC)

Both Frankincense from Interior Yemen and Myhr from interior Somalia were brought to the coasts at Musa north of the the straits according to the Periplus 21. Beyond these places, in a bay at the foot of the left side of this gulf, there is a place by the shore called Muza, a market-town established by law, distant altogether from Berenice for those sailing southward, about twelve thousand stadia. I measured the distance on Google Maps http://depts.washington.edu/silkroad/texts/periplus/map/periplus_map.html. The last time I was there I noted the mountains in the area were rich with baboons. The area known as Ophone was the base of the trade on the horn

http://books.google.com/books?pg=PA387&lpg=PA387&dq=mussel+Harbour+red+sea+antiquity+modern&sig=rtcCK5_Gqakgq69pPTdOCeE_u3w&ei=ilCDU9G1O-HIsAToxYGIBg&id=SyhOAAAAcAAJ&ots=jInlZp0Wty&output=text Gives the Greek and Roman geography and there are distances given from Myos Hormos to locate Bernice and from Bernice to locate Musa. The latitude of ltlyos-Hormos is fixed by Bruce, D'Anville, &c., at 27° N.(27°N 34°E) Its situation is determined by a cluster of islands, called Jojfateen by modern navigators, of which the three largest lie opposite to an indcnture of the Aegyptian coast.Metaphysical Engineering (talk) 14:51, 26 May 2014 (UTC)