Talk:Vladimir Putin

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 3 September 2019 and 12 December 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Matheus123455 (article contribs).

[1] vs career#2004–2008: Second presidential term|2004–2008: Second presidential term-number of vixtims

Probably, there is a mistake about the number of deaths during the Beslan school hostage crisis in the article about Putin:

1. The article about Putin tells that "The Beslan school hostage crisis took place in September 2004, in which hundreds died. Many in the Russian press and in the international media warned that the death of 130 hostages in the special forces' rescue operation during the 2002 Moscow theater hostage crisis would severely damage President Putin's popularity..."
2. The article about the Beslan school siege "also referred to as the Beslan school hostage crisis or Beslan massacre)[3][4][5] started on 1 September 2004, lasted three days, involved the illegal imprisonment of over 1,100 people as hostages (including 777 children),[6] and ended with the deaths of at least 334 people".

ONLY THE SECOND is sourced:

1. • BBC, 22 December 2006:"The Beslan school siege in September 2004 killed at least 331 people, many of them children. "
   • The Washington Post, September 7, 2004: "Russian officials revised the death toll Monday down to 334, including 156 children. But close to 200 people remained missing, out of the total number of hostages that officials now say was 1,180."
   • The Boston Globe. 8 December 2006: "[...]bringing the total death toll to 334, a Beslan activist said.[...]Two other former hostages died of their wounds last year and another died last August, which had brought the overall death toll to 333 -- a figure that does not include the hostage-takers." ".

References

Fiona Hill was the top Russia expert on NSC

Ymblanter, I submit she is well-positioned to provide this analysis and hence this edit should be restored

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vladimir_Putin&diff=929381911&oldid=929276155 --— Preceding unsigned comment added by Soibangla (talk • contribs) 18:15, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

I do not see why it should be restored. What she said is fully trivial and is a spillover of the Trump shit storms.--Ymblanter (talk) 20:21, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

Ymblanter, the section for Putin's KGB days is sparse. The edit provides details of what he was doing, from an expert, and a careful read shows her comments were not limited to Trump, but to businessmen generally, which is not trivial. It helps to understand Putin's modus operandi as the Russian leader today. soibangla (talk) 22:07, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

There is a lot of academic literature on the point much better than Fiona Hill.--Ymblanter (talk) 22:25, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

Ymblanter, I don't see why that means we shouldn't include her analysis as the top Russia expert on the NSC that advises presidents on their decisions, and other editors are free to add more to enhance the section further. soibangla (talk) 22:36, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

Open an RfC and see what other editors think.--Ymblanter (talk) 08:08, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

I oppose adding politicians opinions with this UNDUE manner in this BLP article, especially U.S. biased politicians.-SharabSalam (talk) 08:24, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Fiona Hill is not a politician. soibangla (talk) 18:28, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Ymblanter, opening an RFC is wholly disproportionate to the magnitude of the edit. soibangla (talk) 18:28, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Then you have to accept that there is no consensus to add her opinion.--Ymblanter (talk) 18:29, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Ymblanter, I have presented compelling reasons why her analysis is appropriate. You haven't provided compelling reasons to exclude it. soibangla (talk) 18:34, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

To be precise, you presented reasons which you think are compelling but nobody else thinks so. It is also your opinion that I have not provided compelling reasons, which is obviously different from mine. The policies do not say I need to convince you. The policies just say you can only add this text to the article if there is consensus for adding it. Currently, we do not have consensus.--Ymblanter (talk) 18:37, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Ymblanter, nobody else thinks so To be precise, you alone reverted it and no one else has supported your reversion. One person made a specious argument against including comments from politicians, but Hill is not a politician. soibangla (talk) 18:41, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

You probably need first to read WP:BRD and then count the number of people who posted anything in this topic.--Ymblanter (talk) 18:44, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Ymblanter, count the number of people who posted anything in this topic Thanks for making my point. I guess we're done then, huh? soibangla (talk) 18:49, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

I also oppose adding her unsubstantiated serious accusations against Putin, "when he joined the KGB in Leningrad and St. Petersburg. They went after American businessmen and set up sting operations." Extraordinary claim requires extraordinary evidences . These are serious accusations. Also her own belief that Putin was targeting Trump, is totally unneeded in this BLP article.--SharabSalam (talk) 18:53, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Putin’s secret children?

This article names the two confirmed daughters of Putin, Maria and Katerina, born to ex-wife Lyudmila. However, there are sources that state he may have a third daughter with alleged girlfriend Alina Kabaeva (whose supposed relationship with Putin has never been confirmed). Another source refers to Katerina as Putin’s third child. There were also news reports earlier this year about Kabaeva giving birth to twins. Should any of this be mentioned in the Putin article? ThePickeringtonian (talk) 23:11, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

We must follow the policies, WP:BLP and WP:RS.--Ymblanter (talk) 20:09, 11 December 2019 (UTC)

Partially Jewish?

Rumors are his grandfather &/or mother's line had Jews. Also, his surname/lastname is constructed Germanically ("in" in Putin means plural in German), which incidentally is basis for Ashkenazi Jews. Also, his skull/nose don't appear typ. Russian; and he is smart.