Talk:AC/DC

Userbox!

Just created a new userbox for AC/DC fan's:

This user is a fan of AC/DC.

Use: {{User AC/DC Fan}}

Rudd/Slade

I have reverted the edit that places Slade in the current line-up. Though I don't think Rudd is likely to come back, we can't change membership based on one live performance because we "think" it means he will do the whole tour. IMO its too soon to make a change and there is no source to support the edit. Flat Out let's discuss it 06:07, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

I agree, but I'd even go further. Is there any official confirmation that Stevie is now part of the band and Malcolm is not? The official website still lists Mal and Phil as band members, even though Mal will never play with them again. This may be not too different from what happens in Toto, where Mike Porcaro is still considered a band member in spite of him suffering from ALS and, consequentially, unable to ever play again. The band, obviously, uses other bass players, but they are considered stand-ins for the titular.--Gorpik (talk) 11:52, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

I disagree, as stated in the other article talk page for three reasons essentially. (1) It's the de facto lineup. Press releases confirm the plan for the tour is Slade, not Rudd. Rudd's trial is still months away, so he's not going anywhere anytime soon. (2) If Rudd comes back, change the article again, but let's try to keep current with that latest information. (3) Not accusing anyone here, but IMO we should be weary of sentimentality affecting our judgment. For example, Malcolm: Founding member, long-time member, but not a current member. The same sentimental attachments can be given to Rudd for fans of the band, but if he's not banging the drums, there's no plans for him to bang the drums, and someone else is, he's not a current member. Just my two cents. --Bark (talk) 18:08, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Chris Slade has joined the band as a real band member and not just as a live member. He is seen in the new AC/DC music video (Rock the Blues Away)too.

I don't know if Rudd will return or not but it's a fact that Chris Slade is a band member now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wasp-1992 (talk • contribs) 03:42, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

No sentimentality on may side, at least. After all, I like Slade much better than Rudd. But it is not so unusual for bands to have musicians (recording or touring) who are not considered band members. What I am saying is: if the official web page says that the band is Johnson, the Young brothers, Williams and Rudd, Wikipedia should not go against that.--Gorpik (talk) 09:09, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

There were severel statements that Malcolm and Phil are out of the band. The bands website is not the only official source.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Wasp-1992 (talk • contribs) 09:43, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

Where are those statements from official sources? If they exist, do they also say that either Stevie or Slade are part of the band? Not just "Chris Slade will play drums in the forthcoming tour", but "We welcome Chris back to the band", or the like. Darryl Jones has been playing with the Rolling Stones ever since Bill Wyman left, but he is not part of the band.--Gorpik (talk) 11:29, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

The official facebook page from Chris Slade. Anyway when Rudd re-joined the band in 1994 there was no official announcement from the bands management too. Does that mean that he never really was a band member during 1994-2015? No.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Wasp-1992 (talk • contribs) 08:14, 11 February 2015‎

Press releases and interviews are the most dynamic source of information, and AC/DC has issued enough of them for a reasonable person to conclude the official line-up is Angus, Cliff, Brian, Stevie, and Chris. Many are cited in the band's articles currently. Official web pages may not be as dynamic as you think, especially if the band in technology averse. There's no need to split hairs, IMO. There's a fair chance that right now the only band member from a legal standpoint is Angus! Everyone else came on board later, and Malcolm may not be of sound mind to effect any legal control. We certainly wouldn't just have Angus as the only listed band member. I just don't think we should retain out-dated information based on lawyering and arbitrary criteria (i.e. Some 19-year-old webmaster has to publish the web site update. Chris Slade has to complete the tour. Chris Slade has to be on a new album. Phil Rudd needs to be sentenced to a prison term. Etc.) when we can just keep it dynamic based on the press releases, interviews, and based on who are actually on the stage playing. Like I previously said, if things change, we stay dynamic and effect the change again. We aren't publishing a book with a deadline on a final version. We're updating a dynamic web site, and if we leave Rudd listed as the drummer, the article becomes intentionally inaccurate.--Bark (talk) 13:30, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

There are also official band photos with Stevie Young and Chris Slade. Another sign for their full membership in the band. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wasp-1992 (talk • contribs) 14:28, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

we don't guess, or make assumptions based on photos or feelings etc. We wait for a reliable source. If you have sources for the changes please cite them. Flat Out let's discuss it 22:25, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

With all due respect, I believe the source is cited. Rolling Stone just confirmed Slade is the drummer for the North American leg of the tour, at least. Rolling Stone's article also calls Rudd's previous comments of still being the drummer as dubious. So I ask you, do you have a source that Rudd is still the drummer as of February 5, 2015 or later? (http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/ac-dc-announce-north-american-rock-or-bust-tour-dates-20150211).--Bark (talk) 22:48, 11 February 2015 (UTC)

Phil Rudd said earlier that year: "I wanna have my job back". His words were pretty clear about the fact that he is not in the band anymore. Chris Slade is the bands current drummer. And just because he didn't played on the new album it doesn't mean that je is just a live member. He is a real band member. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wasp-1992 (talk • contribs) 00:19, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

I am not sure if you know what we mean by providing sources or not, you could read WP:42 or WP:RS if you wanted to understand why you can't make changes based on opinion or rumour or intuition. The most important point here is that we are all required to edit by consensus. Please refrain from edit warring with other editors and provide reliable and verifiable sources to support the changes you wish to make. Flat Out let's discuss it 03:36, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

It's now all over the news that Slade has replaced Rudd for the forthcoming tour, finding references isn't hard. Can the infobox be changed now? Stub Mandrel (talk) 12:22, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

[[1]] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stub Mandrel (talk • contribs) 12:25, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

I don't think anybody has expressed any doubt that Slade will replace Rudd in the forthcoming tour. The question is: is he a temporary or a definitive replacement? I have not read a line, barring speculations, to suggest that Rudd is out of the band for good. And neither Angus nor Brian have been too quiet recently.--Gorpik (talk) 14:40, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

I think those here who are reverting edits back to Rudd, stating "cite a reliable source," not giving what (in their opinion) would constitute as much (since there is obviously a disagreement as to what meets the threshold and what does not), not offering any potential compromises, not acknowledging the currently cited sources (and potential ones, i.e. I noticed my Rolling Stone link was ignored), and also not citing any reliable sources composed after February 5, 2015 that definitely states that Rudd is still the official drummer are treading close to Wikipedia:Wikilawyering, maybe Wikipedia:Ownership of articles. Edit reversions and citing policies in the face of edits that you disagree with (if you will indulge my previous two citations of Wikipedia policy here), are the beginnings of edit warring and not in the "spirit" of Wikipedia when there's no attempt to bridge the gap. I think it should be Slade, but I have not engaged in edit reverts. Therefore, I hope this still demonstrates my good faith. As a compromise, I would be willing to put an end date on Rudd's membership for 2015, keep Slade in former members and touring members, and then slap an outdated article banner here until such time that there is definitive word on who the official drummer is, i.e. list no current drummers. Would that be acceptable to all? Are there any other attempts at compromise here?--Bark (talk) 20:39, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

I don't see that deliberately making the article out of date as a resonable outcome. What we know is that Rudd was out of favour due to unreliability during the recording of the last album, and that he is stuck in NZ and unable to tour at this point. We also know that AC/DC chose Slade for the live appearance at Grammy's and that he is commwncing the tour with the band. Personally I feel that having Slade as a touring member is the perfect compromise until Rudd's position is known. I'm pretty sure we treated Stevie Young and Malcolm in the same way until Malcolm's end was definitive. Cheers Flat Out let's discuss it 01:58, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

(http://loudwire.com/acdc-2015-north-american-tour/) - To sum up, Slade has been announced as the drummer for the entire World Tour, not just the U.S. leg. Also, there is a publicity shot of the band, all five members, with Slade in and Rudd not. IMO, the Malcolm situation was different, as it was psychological/health related and details were released sparingly due to obvious discretionary concerns. Rudd's mess is a matter of public record. So, what's the criteria? What's the benchmark? Does he have to finish the tour? Does he have to record the next album, if there is one? Do the press releases have to say, "Rudd out/Slade in" for it to reach it?

Seriously though, if we are in a "cite your source" mode as the only response to requests to build consensus, cite a source published after February 5, 2015 that definitively states Rudd is AC/DC's current drummer. If you can't find one, he should not be listed here as the current drummer.--Bark (talk) 16:01, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

@Bark: Chris Slade has been called a live member just because he did not played on the new album 'Rock Or Bust'. But he is not only playing live shows - he also attempts video and photo shootings. This is a very important point because a temporary replacement wouldn't be able to do that. Wasp-1992 (talk) 20:55, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

IMO, that is splitting hairs. I honestly don't understand the "retain Rudd" argument. There's no recent source to support the argument that he's still in the band. Given the circumstances, which are unique, I believe the "retain Rudd" requires the same level of citation as "change to Slade" does. Since this issue was born on February 5, 2015, the publication date of the citation needs to be on or after that date.--Bark (talk) 16:01, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

I can understand that some fans from Rudd cannot accept that he was replaced by Chris Slade but this is a simple fact. -Wasp-1992 (talk) 19:49, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia is an encyclopedia not a fan site. Provide some reliable and verifiable sources to support your suggested changes or stop arguing. Flat Out let's discuss it 01:46, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

Here: http://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/feb/13/acdc-confirm-chris-slade-will-replace-phil-rudd-2015-tour. Phil Rudd is not in the band anymore. Chris Slade is the current line up's drummer. Wasp-1992 (talk) 15:58, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

that confirms he is a touring member, that isn't in dispute. Flat Out let's discuss it 19:54, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

Bb what are your thoughts here? The band is touring with Slade, Rudd's status is up in the air but seeing as they are only playing live for the foreseeable future (at least a year) it is possibly a moot point.Flat Out let's discuss it 20:02, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

What is weird is that the Facebook page lists Johnson, Rudd, Angus Young, Stevie Young, and Cliff Williams as the current lineup; yet Slade appears in band photos. Will the band ever make an announcement about this issue? 173.51.130.250 (talk) 04:02, 14 February 2015 (UTC)

Just got back from a break. I don't see any sources saying that Rudd has left. Slade has been announced for the tour but not as a full-time member or anything else. As far as I can see he's a temporary member. Anything chucked into any AC/DC article without a reliable source will be removed. Bretonbanquet (talk) 16:24, 16 February 2015 (UTC)

How about an interview that the LA Times just did with Brian Johnson dated April 9th, 2015? http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/music/la-et-ms-coachella-acdc-20150409-story.html#page=1 In that article, Brian Johnson states: "You pick yourself up, dust yourself down and just keep going," said the frontman, instantly recognizable in his trademark black T-shirt and flat cap. "You live on, and you have a wonderful memory of them always with you, but you're not going to stop doing what you do. Otherwise, you die inside, you know? And we would die — I would, if I didn't do what I was doing. There'd be nothing." He paused as though suddenly aware of how serious he sounded. Then he laughed.

Notice the pronoun "them". 67.224.16.233 (talk) 01:12, 12 April 2015 (UTC)Jack Sprat

Not even close to being a good enough source to say Rudd has permanently left. Johnson says "them" but that's not conclusively referring to more than one person, nor does it mention specifically who he's talking about. Bretonbanquet (talk) 15:11, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

Phil Rudd has left because because of legal troubles. Chris Slade replaced him. Their live performance at the Grammys can be threated as a "official statement". Wasp-1992 (talk) 19:02, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

@Wasp-1992: No it can not, using the Grammy's performance as a reference would be an "Official assumption", and as you know we don't do assumptions. Mlpearc (open channel) 19:39, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

It's not just a "assumption" because it's a fact. Chris Slade has written that the drums are under "old management" on his official facebook page one day earlier.Wasp-1992 (talk) 19:46, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

Let's not go over old ground please. We don't make changes without consensus and consensus is built on reliable sources of which there aren't any. Flat Out let's discuss it 02:47, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

I am just seeking the truth from facts.Wasp-1992 (talk) 14:05, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

What in the world... was the compromise we reached that ACDC now has 2 active drummers? Putting both Rudd and Slade in the info box is NOT a valid compromise. It is up to debate which one is the official member, but nobody thinks the band has 2 drummers. We must keep it at Rudd until the issue is resolved, as he is the most recent confirmed drummer. Joshua0228 (talk) 21:40, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Why this case is so complicated? The facts are very simple: -Chris Slade appears on official band photos -Chris Slade is a part of the Rock Or Bust world tour. -Chris Slade even confirmed by himself that he is back in the band on facebook. Wasp-1992 (talk) 01:26, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Look people it's simple, Rudd is the current drummer until an official word from the AC/DC camp is released, end of story. Mlpearc (open channel) 01:35, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Someone should ask them about that topic in a interview.Wasp-1992 (talk) 02:27, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Nah. They won't talk about it. They are probably reading this talk page right now and laughing as their loyal fans duke it out over small legal technicalities. If I was Slade I would be laughing as people tried to figure out what I am. Joshua0228 (talk) 03:23, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

"CHRIS SLADE is the current drummer for AC/DC. Previously drumming for Michael Schenker, Manfred Mann's Earthband, Uriah Heep, ASIA, Tom Jones, The Firm, Gary Moore, Jimmy Page, David Gilmour, Gary Numan, Olivia Newton John, Count Basie etc. etc" Source: https://facebook.com/page/about.php?id=250282005103235&ref=m_notif&notif_t=group_highlights Wasp-1992 (talk) 00:17, 16 April 2015 (UTC)

Request for closure. Mlpearc (open channel) 00:27, 16 April 2015 (UTC)

Support Flat Out let's discuss it 05:25, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Bon Scott and Malcolm Young are still listed as members on the official website. Maybe the band has given them positions for life in the band, like they do to the leaders in North Korea (DPRK)? Why aren't they listed as official members then if we're going to use the official website as the end all, be all for defining who is a member or not? What the definition of a member is may be the better question here? Furthermore, the term being used in the article here is "current member" and currently, Slade is a member. To call him a former member like he is in the sidebar, while he's currently performing all the duties of the band's drummer reeks of politics more than reality. If some hipster from Coachella were to be exposed to the band for the first time, look them up here on Wikipedia, and see that Phil Rudd is the current drummer, would that make sense? It's not what they witnessed, is it? This article lists Slade as a former member. Maybe you want to call Slade, "Drummer pro tem" at this point until something more official, to the liking of the dissenters here, comes out. I certainly would not consider Phil a current member as he is not performing the duties of the band's drummer at present and Rudd himself stated he wants his job back, indicating that he no longer has it, but agreed, the band has been anything but clear about it. It might make better sense to list him in the current members list along with Slade, but notate it as situation undetermined. That would be a factual assessment of the current situation, and better than the current handling of it which doesn't represent what people would see when they actually go see the band this year, would it not? It's not as if bands haven't had two drummers before. 67.224.16.233 (talk) 18:21, 16 April 2015 (UTC)Jack B. Nimble

We aren't using the official site as the "be all and end all." The infobox is a snapshot of information only, the band membership which includes a current drummer and a live drummer is contained in the body of the article and is supported by reliable sources. Flat Out let's discuss it 05:25, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Yesterday I read a piece of news about Coachella and it said something like: "Malcolm Young has been replaced by his nephew Stevie, while Chris Slade is filling in for Phil Rudd, who is currently having trouble with [...]". This also matches the line-up provided by the official Facebook page: Stevie is now part of the band, but Slade is just filling in for Rudd. Will this become a permanent replacement? Maybe there is not even a "permanent"; the band might call it a day after this tour, according to recent news. Now, adding a note to the infobox, beside Phil Rudd name, might be in order.--Gorpik (talk) 08:33, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

The article mentioned where they said Chris was filling in for Phil was from MetalHammer and they were writing about an article where the Telegraph interviewed Brian Johnson. Nowhere in the original article was there a mention that Chris is just a fill in. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/11539723/Brian-Johnson-I-think-they-made-a-mistake-about-Jeremy-Clarkson.html This article is factually incorrect by having the sidebar list Chris as a past member instead of current. As far as being a touring member only, that too is factually incorrect as he is doing publicity photos and music videos as well. He is doing everything that a band's drummer would do. The only question is whether he doing so temporarily or on a permanent basis, which is why I suggested the "pro tem" moniker in obvious futility. If you speak of consensus, then I ask you to read through all of the discussion here and it appears that the ones who are keeping the article as is, factually incorrect, are a couple of members with obvious Mod or Admin rights who would rather keep the article incorrect until they receive verification on such a level that is rarely seen on other articles, as opposed to writing the article in a more factual manner. Call it what you will, it is no longer a matter of editing by consensus, but by personal motivation and feelings on the matter. 67.224.16.233 (talk) 15:05, 17 April 2015 (UTC) Jack B. Nimble

Former members in band template

Should all 15 former official members be listed in the band's template to make the list complete and accurate? I think doing so would make sense. 173.51.130.250 (talk) 01:24, 15 February 2015 (UTC)

Phil Rudd's troubles

Since Phil Rudd is still having troubles, I don't think his name should be in the "current members" column, --123.2.142.50 (talk) 02:37, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

123.2.142.50 until a reliable source says he is out he is a current member . Flat Out let's discuss it 02:58, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 April 2015

In the list on the members Phil Rudd has been swaped with Chris Slade as the current drummer. Frozenmax17 (talk) 10:51, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

There is a discussion going on in this page about this issue. You should contribute to it instead of asking for semi-protection.--Gorpik (talk) 11:02, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Not done: checked, not so. Mlpearc (open channel) 12:50, 17 April 2015 (UTC)