Talk:George Grosz

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
	This article is supported by the arts and entertainment work group.

Visual arts

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Visual arts, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of visual arts on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Visual artsWikipedia:WikiProject Visual artsTemplate:WikiProject Visual artsvisual arts articles

Germany High‑importance

	Germany portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Germany, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Germany on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GermanyWikipedia:WikiProject GermanyTemplate:WikiProject GermanyGermany articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Socialism

	Socialism portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Socialism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of socialism on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SocialismWikipedia:WikiProject SocialismTemplate:WikiProject Socialismsocialism articles
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Change of name

Available sources speak of different reasons for changing his name. He was opposed to German nationalism. Quote: The visual arts in Germany 1890-1937: Utopia and despair Shearer West Manchester University Press Page 122 Grosz's disgust with the Germans, whom he depicted as fat and stupid, led him to obsessive pro-Americanism and an official change of his name from Georg to George.

--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 21:14, 28 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Schaffes-s

I have reverted a revert on an edit of mine which changed the spelling of Grosz's birth name from having a schaffes-s, to the more modern double-s. While I agree that the name was spelled with a schaffes-s on the actual birth certificate, the schaffes-s is in fact totally identical to a double-s, and the schaffes-s symbol is no longer used in German, and has never been used in English. It may be unintelligible to many English readers. The fact that Grosz changed the spelling of his name may be missed by readers, for example, if they do not understand how to read the schaffes-s. I think that for the purpose of an English-langugae article, the schaffes-s should be avoided. - Wwallacee (talk) 09:38, 4 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

For one, it is not called a "schaffes-s" but either "scharfes S" or "Eszett" - and it is not identical with the doouble s - nor is it true that it is no longer used in German, it is - see here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%9F Albrecht Conz (talk) 14:11, 4 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Albrecht, you're being totally ridiculous. Whether or not I spelled the word correctly, the recht-schreib reform decided to phase out the scharfes S and replace it with a double-S, particularly after a vowel. There are many Germans with this surname who spell it with double-S: see for instance the German Wikipedia article on Heinrich Gross. This standardised spelling is supposed to avoid the kind of confusion we are discussing here. More importantly this is an English encyclopedia! To spell his name with the scharfes S would be like spelling an Egyptian writer's name using Arabic letters. In English speaking countries the surname "Gross" is quite common and is spelled with a double S. Accordingly, I have reverted your revert. -Wwallacee (talk) 17:13, 9 April 2017 (UTC) Wwallacee (talk) 17:13, 9 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Albrecht, you immediately undid my revision of your edit, but without any explanation on the talk page. Accordingly, I am reverting - again. - Wwallacee (talk) 17:26, 9 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

You don't give me five miniutes to type out my comment? That's getting silly. Albrecht Conz (talk) 17:31, 9 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Now here's a second try: I am not confident that someone who doesn't know how to spell "Rechtschreibreform" is qualified to make informed comments about it. The reform did not "phase out" the letter ß, it made changes to its usage, and those changes do not apply to names of people or towns etc. George Grosz' birthname was spelled "Groß" and that's that. The argument that the letter "ß" presents a great hurdle for English speakers means that all such letters should be abolished, and I'm not aware of a Wikipedia policy that states that ä, ö, ü, ç, ğ etc. have to go and be replaced by "English" letters meaning Motörhead will have to become "Motorhead", Recep Tayyip Erdoğan will become Erdogan, and Æthelred and Æthelberht will have to be moved to "Ethelred and Ethelbert". Albrecht Conz (talk) 17:42, 9 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

By the way, other than the formal resaon to stick to the spelling "Groß" this is also important in order to understand how he came to chose the name he is known by. As an opponent of militarism during WWI he decided to "de-Germanise" and internationalise his name - and thus Georg became the French or English "George", while in his surname he replaced the German "ß" with "sz". Now, the latter replacement is not arbitrary. One of the most common names the letter "ß" is known by is "Eszett" - meaning "SZ". Ever since typewriters and similar techniques became common it has been general usage in German to replace "ß" with "sz" when typing on a typewriter / keyboard that does not provide an ß-key. This means Grosz used this existing rule to internationalise his name. Thus to change his birthname from "Groß" to "Gross" makes nonsense of this.Albrecht Conz (talk) 17:59, 9 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

OK, I'll tell you what, I am going to split the difference by putting in both spellings, and adding in what you just said as a footnote. - Wwallacee (talk) 11:24, 10 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on George Grosz. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:42, 3 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Arrest, trial for blasphemy, confiscation of sudio works

It would seem that Ecce Homo (1923), Christ in a Gas Mask, and orher works confiscated and used against Grosz in the context of a blasphemy conviction should have a place in this article. Has anyone else an interest in this subject? It was quite prescient in the 1920s and thus intolerable by Nazi standadas. Vesuvius Dogg (talk) 10:01, 16 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]