Talk:Michael Signer

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A note on creating the page[edit]

I created this article because one did not exist for Mike Signer. Among the guidelines I took into consideration while writing the article were: WP:BIO, WP:BLP, WP:COI, WP:NPOV. I'd like to declare my interest: I'm a volunteer for the Mike Signer for Lieutenant Governor campaign, but the article is properly sourced. I strived to be as neutral as possible. I also recognize that this is not "my page" and I know I don't WP:OWN it, but I'd like to stay involved in the discussion as the campaign progresses. I've made the same disclosure on my user page. If you have any questions about my editing, feel free to hit me up. Patrickottenhoff (talk) 19:29, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Regarding the WP:COI and notability tags[edit]

  • Note: I've moved Patrick's original message from my talk page to here.

Hello, I was hoping you could further explain the COI and Notability tags that you posted on the Mike Signer page, which I created.

As you probably saw on the discussion page or my own user account, I am volunteering for the campaign. As I understand the COI guideline, the important thing is to make certain that I do not put the candidate's interests above Wikipedia's interests. It's for this very reason that I wrote the page very conservatively, keeping it strictly factual. If you have a specific content issue with the page as it is written, please let me know.

As for Notability, I do not see where the issue lies. I have linked six separate sources, including 2 where Signer is the direct subject, and these stories are from the Washington Post and Roll Call. I'd appreciate if you discuss how the page can be improved, or if these tags were added in haste, please consider removing them. Thanks. Patrickottenhoff (talk) 21:37, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Hi Patrick -- as regards notability, the problem comes from WP:POLITICIAN and WP:BLP1E, which sets the criteria for notability of biographies for politicians. As a general rule, we discourage articles for aspiring politicians until they've at least won the primary, barring prior notability. I looked at the Post article (the Roll Call articles are behind a paywall), and since it basically reprinted a press release in an online weblog rather than a formal article, I didn't regard that as significant coverage by a reliable secondary source independent of the subject. It's not a huge deal; I don't intend to put the article up for deletion anytime soon (so it's more of a warning that other editors might), but the notability of the article is clearly iffy until more substantial coverage can be found.
As regards WP:COI, you've done just about what you could to mitigate it, (although taking this to WP:AFC instead of writing it yourself would've been preferable), but I still think the tag is "fair warning" to our readers that the primary author on the article is somebody with a conflict of interest. If the biography becomes significant and others edit it, I expect the tag will then not be necessary. Best, RayTalk 21:59, 24 March 2009 (UTC)


Help with WP:NOTE and WP:COI[edit]

I recently created this article. I’m volunteering on this campaign and so I was especially cognizant of following WP:NOTE and WP:COI when I created the article. Editor RayAYang, however, tagged the article with these two notices. I believe that both of these tags are not warranted and wanted to ask for your help in resolving this situation. I took this issue to the Help Desk and no one has responded to me yet, so I’m hoping that someone may be able to help here.

With regards to the WP:NOTE tag, the rules state that “A person is presumed to be notable if he or she has received significant coverage in reliable secondary sources that are independent of the subject.” Signer has recently been covered by nearly a dozen newspapers, including the Washington Post and Richmond Times-Dispatch. To be more specific, RayAYang stated that WP:POLITICIAN and WP:BLP1E applied. Given the first, Signer should meet “Major figures in national or first-level sub-national political races,” especially as he had the most donors for the first fundraising period[1]. And while he is primarily notable for just this race, he was recognized in The Nation as Wesley Clark’s foreign policy adviser[2] so I think he is notable for more than this one event. He has also appeared on national cable news discussing foreign policy [3].

In the interest of making this more clear, I suggest adding this to the article:

== Lieutenant governor campaign ==
Signer officially announced his campaign for Lieutenant Governor on April 6, 2009 with a tour of 20 events across the state of Virginia. [1] For the first quarter of 2009, Signer raised $250,000 from more than 800 donors. [2] Signer has been critical of Lt. Gov. Bill Bolling for opposing a House of Delegates measure that would have used federal stimulus money to expand unemployment coverage by $125 million. [3] He has received the endorsement of prominent rural strategist David "Mudcat" Saunders. [4]

I am requesting that someone else add this also because of the COI tag on the page. RayAYang suggested the tag could be removed after others had edited the page, so I am requesting someone else to look at the article and make these edits. With regards to WP:COI, I am a volunteer for the campaign, but I worked to avoid a conflict with interest. The guidelines state that a conflict of interest exists when the writer’s goals do not align with Wikipedia, but I think you will find the tone of the article is neutral and informational and I did not make any changes. For that reason also I believe the COI tag should be removed.

Thanks in advance for your help. Patrickottenhoff (talk) 14:08, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Done. Thanks for the honesty regarding your COI. Smartse (talk) 20:05, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

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FanPOV[edit]

This page was originally created by someone on Signer's campaign but seems to have morphed into a promotional/fan page for his books, highlighting positive reviews and promotional speaking engagements. Signer meets notability guidelines, but this page seems overstuffed with material intended to serve his commercial (or potential political) interests. This level of detail seems unnecessary. DeerJerky (talk) 12:16, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

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Stand Down Order?[edit]

Any info about the stand down order Michael Signer gave to the police at the rally in Charlottesville recently? Apparently this is what led to the carnage there. --105.8.60.190 (talk) 23:20, 17 August 2017 (UTC)

  1. ^ "Signer Launches LG Campaign". The Washington Post. The Washington Post Company. 4/6/09. Retrieved 2009-04/15.  Check date values in: |access-date=, |date= (help)
  2. ^ "Signer Begins Lt. Governor Campaign". Arlington Connection. The Connection Newspapers. 4/10/09. Retrieved 2009-04/15.  Check date values in: |access-date=, |date= (help)
  3. ^ "Lieutenant governor hopeful assails GOP on vote". Martinsville Bulletin. Martinsville Bulletin, Inc. 4/10/09. Retrieved 2009-04/15.  Check date values in: |access-date=, |date= (help)
  4. ^ "Local pundit and consultant gives candidate a video boost". The Roanoke Times. The Roanoke Times. 4/9/09. Retrieved 2009-04/15.  Check date values in: |access-date=, |date= (help)