Talk:Nazism and race

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The latters[edit]

What is the meaning of The latters here - Jews or Gypsies and Jews? I would suggest to rewrite the sentence.Xx236 08:06, 30 August 2007 (UTC)


it is stated that the nazis had a 'ladder' for racial clasification. it would be good to publish the ladder, or simply post the various positions. all it says in this artcile is nordics at the top and jews and gypsies at the bottom. what of the inbetweens? surely the nazis classed the world's population in more catagories than gypsie/jew and nordic? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 14:38, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

According to the article Racial policy of Nazi Germany,

"All white people (Europeans) were considered to be Aryan as long as they had no Jewish ancestry (Nuremberg Laws) under the definition as "Indo-European".... The fate of black people from 1933 to 1945 in Nazi Germany and in German-occupied territories ranged from isolation to persecution, sterilization, medical experimentation, incarceration, brutality, and murder. However, there was no systematic program for their elimination as there was for Jews and other groups.... About 10,000 Japanese nationals (mostly diplomats and military officials) residing in Germany were given "Honorary Aryan" citizenship with more privileges than any other "non-Aryan" ethnonational group."

So, while I wondered about nonwhites after reading "Lowest of all in the Nazi racial policy were Gypsies and Jews" it does appear that the Nazis valued blacks above Jews. The information on Asians is still unsatisfactory. In their efforts to dismantle the Soviet Union, the Nazis did create a Turkestan legion, which fit well with Pan-Turkism's well-documented ties to Nazism itself as well as to Fascist Japan's Altaicist counterpart to Aryanism. Just as it appears that Hitler was focused on the local Slavic-Jewish enemy, built alliances "fellow Aryan" Nords, and loosely exploited faraway foreigners; so Japan particularly hated and exterminated the Chinese, built alliances with "fellow Altaic" Mongols and Koreans, and tried to use the Jews. The million dollar question is how did Germany treat enemy Asians, such as the Chinese, rather than their Japanese allies or Turkic anti-Russian sycophant opportunists. Shrigley (talk) 01:58, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

Moral Decay post WWI - Pendulum movement...?[edit]

The ability of Nazism and Facism to develop were in part the result of the immoral decay that ocurred in Europe especially Germany after WWI and the fall of the Monarchs and the class structure ?

In reference to Marlene Dietrich who was apart of the cultural decay scene of the times....

This is not currently part of this listing and should be included to improve the article.

--Caesar J.B. Squitti: Son of Maryann Rosso and Arthur Natale Squitti (talk) 21:36, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Google books shows some information on the 'moral decay' post WWI

Seems this is not included.

--Caesar J.B. Squitti: Son of Maryann Rosso and Arthur Natale Squitti (talk) 22:13, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Difficult section[edit]

This section is abstruse and needs to be rewritten in more lay terms. There are too many links in this paragraph which are necessary to follow to gather a base understanding.- (talk) 18:24, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

Philosophers and other theoreticians participated in the elaboration of Nazi ideology. The relationship between Heidegger and Nazism has remained a controversial subject in the history of philosophy, even today. According to the philosopher Emmanuel Faye, Heidegger said of Spinoza that he was "ein Fremdkörper in der Philosophie", a "foreign body in philosophy" – Faye notes that Fremdkörper was a term which belonged to the Nazi glossary, and not to classical German[2]. The jurist Carl Schmitt elaborated a philosophy of law praising the Führerprinzip and the German people, while Alfred Baeumler instrumentalized Nietzsche's thought, in particular his concept of the "Will to Power", in an attempt to justify Nazism.

In the section 'Origins', the paragraph which gives an account of the prevailing views concerning race relations in both American and Britain in the early 20th century is irrelevant and thereby removed. It decidedly gives a brief account on some views regarding race, mainly in America, but fails to correlate any substantial relationship or link with Nazism and race. It would better serve readers if it were appropriately placed in Wiki pages concerning American and British eugenics. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 16:51, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Content about how Nazis defined race[edit]

One hears so often about how Hitler wasn't blue-eyed blond-haired like a "real" Aryan, yet when you read the history it seems like the Nazis defined Aryanness as much or more along phrenological lines, i.e. shape of the skull, nose, etc. Perhaps some discussion of how race was defined under Nazism, since it does not seem to be the same as the current-day English-speaking world? Historian932 (talk) 04:51, 27 December 2009 (UTC)

First off, Hitler *WAS* blue-eyed. By Nazi racial ideology, he just wasn't particularly Nordic but rather "Dinaric", which was supposed to be a blue-eyed, dark-haired group of Aryans that had supposedly developed in the Alps. --2003:56:6D1B:C668:D038:8B98:BD5D:B109 (talk) 07:23, 3 May 2015 (UTC)

Persecution of Jews has nothing to do with race[edit]

It should be noted that the Nazis persecuted Jews not because of their race. There were no racial tests performed on large scale and the most prominent German anthropologists of the time admitted that it was impossible to reliably distinguish Jews by the racial criteria as the majority of German Jews belonged to the same racial groups as Germans did. So accusing Jews of belonging to another race was nothing more than a popular propaganda, like accusing them of being Communists etc. It is of note that racism was very popular those times, and not only in Germany, so the Nazis just employed a popular topic to attack the Jews.--MathFacts (talk) 13:44, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

in the propaganda documentary "the eternal Jew" made by the Nazi party they outline physical characteristics that Jews have. and also note that they look very similar to the German people and to the untrained eye would go unnoticed. they claim physical things like "big noises" and "rough hair". — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mattyyboyy86 (talkcontribs) 21:12, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

The same can be also applied to Slavs: saying Slavs are of different race than Germans is a complete nonsense, non only now but was also those days.--MathFacts (talk) 14:17, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

The Nazis fiercely believed in race, it wasn't just propaganda to win the masses. The smarter and more educated Nazis were pretty frustrated at the fact that the science of their day couldn't find any decisive evidence for their definitions of race and used to say that science was just not advanced enough yet, but that it soon would be. --2003:56:6D1B:C668:D038:8B98:BD5D:B109 (talk) 07:27, 3 May 2015 (UTC)
The Nazis were harmful idiots about that issue and many other issues. (Sources: the three-volume history of the Third Reich by Evans and the Kershaw biography of Hitler, both of which going into Nazi "race" propaganda in detail.) -- WeijiBaikeBianji (talk, how I edit) 13:30, 3 May 2015 (UTC)

An intro phrase[edit]

re: Ironically, pre-War Poland's population, deemed to be exterminated, had more citizens of Nordic race than pre-war Germany.[2]

The cited ref does not seem to support this statement. Also "ironically" seems to be a wikipedian's judgement, which should be avoided in wikipedia. Staszek Lem (talk) 20:56, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

This "deemed to be exterminated" sounds ironic and pejorative. Moreover, the statement about Poland having higher number of Nordic race than Germany is absolutely false. The pre-war Poland was a mix of ethnic Poles (who at the time were around 37% Nordic, which was clearly not such a "largely dominant" type) with Jews, Tatars, many other Slavs and ethnic groups from Southeast Europe, Armenians, Gypsies etc, while the pre-war Germany was rather a racially "homogeneous" country with domination of the Nordic type. My source is Jan Czekanowski and his book "Człowiek w Czasie i Przestrzeni" ("A Human in Time and Space") written in 1934, my re-edition comes from the 1960s, page 127. Thank you. Yatzhek (talk) 17:43, 29 April 2014 (UTC)