Talk:Peru/Archive 1

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

PLEASE, ACTUALIZE THE HDI

The HDI of Peru in 2006 (published in 2008) is 788. Also actualize the economical indicators... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.230.137.99 (talk) 06:14, 9 April 2009 (UTC)

Link

Victor12 I would like to submit the following article in the OTHER section. It's a travel piece but with a much broader scope and mandate. It takes issue with the guide books that counsel against renting a car in Peru. My position is that if millions of Peruvians successfully negotiate their passage from point A to point B everyday, why can't the tourist be among those millions. My article dispells the myths and fears re driving in Peru. The article also has much to offer re tourism. Here's the link: http://www.artsandopinion.com/2006_v5_n2/lewis-21.htm Thanking you in advance for the consideration. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Artsandopinion (talk • contribs) 02:39, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

You do realize Wikipedia is not a travel guide, right? You should try Wikitravel instead. --Victor12 (talk) 17:46, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

From weber

really a good link: * Centro Argentino de Estudios Internacionales, Foreign Policy think tank, free downloadable e-books in English and Spanish on politics and economics in the entire Latin American region —Preceding unsigned comment added by Franz weber (talk • contribs) 13:14, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

Spanish is not the sole official language

http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761570790_3/Peru_(country).html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.99.176.206 (talk) 18:46, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

who cares, no one speaks quechua. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.230.112.17 (talk) 14:01, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

The current constitution, drafted in 1993, says the following about the official language(s):

Artículo 48°. Son idiomas oficiales el castellano y, en las zonas donde predominen, también lo son el quechua, el aimara y las demás lenguas aborígenes, según la ley.

Which means:

Article 48°. The official languages are Spanish and, in the areas where they are predominant, also Quechua, Aymara and the other aboriginal languages, according to law.

That's exactly what is explained in the infobox and I think this is a more accurate description than the one given by Encarta. --Victor12 (talk) 15:12, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

If what you say is right, then Peru would have more than 60 official languages. Avilezj (talk) 13:17, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

No one speaks Quechua you moron? My mother is Peruvian and we speak Quechua. In excess of 10 million people speak Quechua. Microsoft is now catering to Quechua speakers through a modified form of office. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.89.71.71 (talk) 05:20, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

The population that speak quechua is great. Even Google had created a search engine in quechua.

http://www.google.com/intl/qu/ --Chalaco01 (talk) 17:28, June 30 2008 (UTC)

Peru v. Perú

I do not know if this has been previously discussed, but isn't it just Perú with an accent, even in English? --Charleenmerced ^Talk 14:27, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

In English the name is written Peru without a diacritic just like México is written Mexico and Panamá spelled Panama. --Victor12 (talk) 15:11, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Your right it should be spelled that way since the page is about that country Darksorce (talk) 04:38, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Semi-protect?

This page has been targeted a few times today by anons. Will it be necessary to semi-protect it? Sandy of the CSARs (talk) 00:27, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Economic data and possible vandalism

Since the article was put on the main page, the economic data has changed. Is this due to sneaky vandalism? --Descendall (talk) 22:14, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

I checked the infobox data against the IMF report; only one minor change was needed. I also reverted the edits to the Economy section which indulged in WP:Recentism and POV while lacking references. --Victor12 (talk) 22:55, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO EDIT THE GDP DATA, NOMINAL AND PPP? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.179.104.87 (talk) 03:42, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Trial of Fujimori

This page currently reads:

Under the presidency of Alberto Fujimori (1990–2000), the country started to recover; however, accusations of authoritarianism, corruption, and human rights violations forced his resignation after the controversial 2000 elections. Since the end of the Fujimori regime, Peru has tried to fight corruption while sustaining economic growth; the current president is Alan García.

I wonder if the page should briefly mention that Fujimori is currently on trial. On one hand, I want to avoid "presentism," but on the other hand this is pretty noteable. I can't think of any other countries in the world that are currently trying one of their democratically-elected presidents for murder. Peru is in a really unusual (perhaps even unique) position with that trial. --Descendall (talk) 23:37, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

• The fact that Fujimori is on trial is notable enough IMO, a similar ocurrence happened with a Romanian president in the 80's (he was sentenced to death after his trial)--Andersmusician VOTE 14:57, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

It should be mentioned but only very briefly like a sentence on it. My two cents.--Jersey Devil (talk) 16:34, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

IMHO mentioning the trial would incur in WP:RECENTISM. There's already a fair bit about Fujimori and his government in the History section, adding more would make this section unbalanced. I agree that the trial is important but not enough to be mentioned in a six paragraph abstract of 5,000 years of history. --Victor12 (talk) 18:44, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree with Victor12. --ErickAgain (talk) 21:44, 1 March 2008 (UTC).

I have to agree with Victor12, trial shouldn't be included in a history section resuming more than a century unless that topic entirely has to do or modifies previous history. Also I didn't didn't notice about the recentism policy, relevant one. user:andersmusician --200.106.111.246 (talk) 14:36, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I entirely disagree. The history section and the article in general, per succeeding comment, is entirely deficient.Tom Cod (talk) 05:39, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Very Short

the article is extremely short —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.240.90.245 (talk) 20:47, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Graphic

Please!!!!!!!!! Whoever cans, please put this image in History section:

Any sources for that timeline? Anyway, there doesn't seem to be enough space to place it here. --Victor12 (talk) 02:25, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Ask that on History of Peru, cegato —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.230.116.28 (talk) 03:35, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Poverty rate's changed and so economy

Poverty in Peru during 2007 decreased by 5.2 percent compared to 2006, from 44.5 to 39.3 percent, stated the head of the National Institute of Statistics and Informatics (INEI), you can visit the web page or even the Peruvian government portal, and check it out.

This article needs to be updated. I tried to edit some REAL facts about my country. But it seems, it's "protected". Please can anyone UPDATE the information about Peru? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Giover187 (talk • contribs) 15:10, May 29, 2008

It states on the main page:'Chinese arrived in the 1850s as a replacement for slave workers and have since become a major influence in Peruvian society.[70]' Can you be more specific of what 'major influence' you have in mind? Is it what they do? Their numbers? Do they run chinese gangs and spread corruption? Are they mostly communists? Can someone give the number how many chinese live in Peru? Do they assimiliate well or just like in the other countries they stay in their chinatowns and do not integrate with the local population??? Thanks Berry —Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.111.222.143 (talk) 03:04, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

2007 census results are already in the webpage of INEI

PLEASE, UPDATE THE INFO, THE LINK IS: http://censos.inei.gob.pe/censos2007/documentos/Resultado_CPV2007.pdf —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.43.127.174 (talk) 02:29, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Economy GDP nominal

GDP (nominal) 2007 estimate

-  	Total 	$101.504 billion (55th)X wrong, should BE 109.069
-  	Per capita 	$3,616 (87th)  

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.177.189.194 (talk) 01:56, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Any sources for that? Current numbers are based on IMF data. --Victor12 (talk) 14:39, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Suggestion on correcting the pronunciation of Republica Del Peru

According to the current Spanish IPA symbols for transcriptions, the pronunciation is typed as Spanish pronunciation: [re̞ˈpuβ̞lika ð̞e̞l pe̞ˈɾu] Could anyone who has got access on this article correct it? Thanks. 84.120.160.88 (talk) 17:26, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Any source for this transcription so we can add the reference too? --Victor12 (talk) 22:26, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Tourist information and Assistance office, Iperu.

Add this section at Peru article. Ist about the tourist information and assistance office, free service for tourist provided by Peruvian governmet offices Promperu (promotes Peru) and INDECOPI (Consumer's defense office).

Tourist Information and Assistance Service

Peru features a tourist information and assistance service called iperú, where visitors can ask about official tourist information on Peru, as well as assistance if the tourist feels the service paid for was not provided as advertised. Iperu is a free service that works 24 hours, all year round, has offices in many important cities and destinations in Peru:

• Arequipa.
• Ayacucho.
• Cusco.
• Amazonas - Chachapoyas.
• Ancash - Huaraz.
• Loreto - Iquitos.
• Lima.
• Puno.
• La Libertad - Trujillo.
• Piura.
• Lambayeque - Chiclayo.
• Tacna.

Peru official website: www.peru.info English version

Iperu website: www.peru.info/iperu English version.

24/7 Iperu telephone: (511) 574-800.

E-mail: iperu@promperu.gob.pe

Wikipedia is not a travel guide. --Victor12 (talk) 15:45, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

perugovernment bureaucreats really shouldn't edit wikipedia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.121.180.91 (talk) 05:32, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Peruvian Amazon Rainforest

Dear friends... I create the article in spanish and english about the Peruvian Amazon. Please, add internal links of this arcicle to Peruvian and amazon articles (like flora and fauna, legends, peruvian geogaphy...). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.81.22.201 (talk) 16:22, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Travel agencies recommended in united states

Include here Travel Agency.

Travel Agencies that offer tourist packages to Peru. Here we enumerate the travel agencies more important and reliable.

1.- www.turismonuevomundo.com [1] 2.- www.ole.travel [2] 3.- www.vacationsuperdeals.com [3]

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcomedina (talk • contribs) 12:46, July 2, 2008

Wikipedia is not a travel guide. --Victor12 (talk) 19:48, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Economy section Peru article

I added certain figures regarding the Peruvian economy under the economy section however they were deleted due to trying to avoid WP:RECENTISM. In accordance to this I re-added the data and added short descriptions of economic time periods throughtout Peruvian history in accordance to WP:RECENTISM. This was again deleted for adding information that was not relevant enough to be put in the article and therefore making the article to long. My original reason for adding the economic figures was because I felt that if some figures were present such as HDI, poverty rate, gdp, that more data should be present. I do beleive that information not relevant enough to be in the country article should be removed in interest of length however if some data is going to be listed then all the data should be listed. And if this is not possible it should be ommitted in its entirety and just be present in the subpage article. Anyways, the information I originally added was only a paragraph in length and included figures such as economic growth, a few sentences of economic projections, and information on the Bolsa de Valores, all of which I beleive are extremley important facts regarding to current and future issues.

Vivaperucarajo (talk) 03:10, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

For the record, here is the aforementioned paragraph:

In 2007, the Peruvian economy grew 9%, the largest growth rate in all of South America. . Poverty has been reduced substancially in the past decade as in 2004, it was slightly under 50%, in 2006 was at 45%, and in 2008 is at 39%. According to government sources, poverty is projected to be reduced to under 10% in eight years , and the President Alan Garcia has stated that by this time Peru will cease to be a third world nation. The Lima Stock Exchange grew 185.24% in 2006 and in 2007 grew 168.3% making it one of the fastest growing stock exchanges in the world. Inflation is the lowest in Latin America at only 1.8%

Currently (i.e. without this added bit) the "Economy" section provides data on HDI, per capita GDP, percentage of poor population, a breakup of GDP between the different economic sectors, and the country's main exports, plus a little bit on the country's recent economic history. The new paragraph adds the 2007 growth rate, poverty figures for three years instead of one, government growth projections, rate of growth of the Lima Stock Exchange and inflation. Commenting each of these points I think that:

• A single year's growth rate is not a very meaningful variable as it can vary widely from one year to the next. A more meaningful statement about economic growth is already in the article and reads: Reforms have permitted sustained economic growth since 1993, except for a slump after the 1997 Asian financial crisis. Here we talk about a period of years not just one. Furthermore it seems that the only purpose of this sentence is to add the claim that Peru is the fastest growing nation in South America which is not very humble, not very relevant (one year you can be on top and the next not) and quite chauvinistic.
• The most recent poverty figure is already in the article, what's the point of having the last three years? Sure, poverty has receded but it can grow back as easily. The bit on poverty in the added paragraph seems an excess of triumphalism.
• The same goes for the bit on government forecasts, these are just predictions, not hard data. It is not certain that they'll come true. Plus, it seems totally inappropriate to use an encyclopedic article to voice the president's opinions on how good is government is.
• On the Stock Exchange, I think this is quite irrelevant as only a tiny minority of Peruvian enterprises actively participate in the Stock Exchange so it does not say much about the economy of the country as a whole. Furthermore, it seems the only point of this sentence is to mention that it is one of the fastest growing stock exchanges in the world, that is, more nationalism
• As for inflation, I'd say the same arguments mentioned about economic growth apply here.

To summarize, I don't think the new paragraph improves the article, it goes into minor details and is openly chauvinistic. IMHO it would deteriorate an article which is already recognized as on of the best at wiki. --Victor12 (talk) 14:55, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

You could make the argument that the economic projections are innececary because as you have said they are not certain, however I do not see how listing real economic figures such as economic growth, stock exchange growth, or inflation qualify as nationalism or as you put it chauvinism. For example if I had written "inflation is the lowest in south america at 1.8% making Peru the best economy to invest in South America" I could see your point but all I have written are actual facts that are relevant and not added extra adjectives or my own personal opinions. And as nationalism is based on personal opinions what I have written has no relation to nationalism. Additionally, the CIA world factbook served as a refrence for some of my figures and I dont see why the CIA would have Peruvian nationalistic feelings. As for the stock exchange many of the largest mining companies in Peru are listed on this exchange and mining is the largest contigent of the Peruvian economy. Additionally, in any economy a stock exchange is always an important contigent, no matter the overall impact it has. Nevertheless, the companies listed on the BVL are not a "tiny minority" of Peruvian entersprises. I have noticed your concern to do anything to "deteriorate" the article from its current state compromising its recognition as a featured article on wikipedia. I do not beleive that it is a reason to delete information off an article just because of a certain "status" on wikipedia. Regarding some of the claims that some of the figures are unneccecary due to them being not permanent I had thought I solved that according to WP:RECENTISM by adding an economic history section. Anyways I do not see why listing current economic data goes against WP:RECENTISM if it is not the only time period that data is listed for.

--Vivaperucarajo (talk) 03:08, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

OK, so now we agree that projections are not appropriate for this article, right? As for the rest:

• On the stock exchange the claim that mining is the largest contigent (sic) of the Peruvian economy is a commons misconception. As you can see on this report by the Peruvian Central Bank (see page 204) mining is smaller than agriculture, manufacturing, trade, others services and taxes as a percentage of the GDP. It is only bigger than construction (barely) and fishing so basically the Lima Stock Exchange is still small and not very representative of the economy as a whole.
• Now on WP:RECENTISM, the problem with putting one year figures for economic growth or inflation is that these numbers don't say much about the country as they only represent the rate of change over the last year. If you say the economy of X country grew 4% you don't give much meaningful info about that country's economy: is it big? is it small? is it undergoing a process of sustainable growth? is that growth temporary, or has it been continuous over the years? Those kind of important questions are not answered, instead, the sentence focus on just the rate of change over the last year. This seems to me like WP:RECENTISM as it stresses fairly recent events over a more balanced view.

For these regions I think these statements should not be added to the article. --Victor12 (talk) 02:38, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Peru map is huge!

The map with the different provinces of Peru seems to have eaten one of those growth enhancement pills. Is this on purpose or is it an error. I really don't like how it looks at this point.--MarshalN20 (talk) 00:05, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

why is peruvian popuation say 15% which is around 4 million and when you see european peruvian of any descent it come out to be more —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.236.30.253 (talk) 22:53, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

Seviche

Hi.

The official name of the fish dish is now "Seviche". Although many variations has been accepted (like "Cebiche" or "Sebiche"), the Peruvian Ministry of Production has formalized its name with a Ministerial Resolution. Now the Seviche even has its own celebration day: June 28.

I think the section "Culture" of this page (and the label below the Seviche picture) must be updated accordly.

Saludos,

--drmad/paperclip (talk) 05:30, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Military section

Please can someone review the Military section? It has been added without any discussion on the talk page. Is it relevant in this form? It uses different lay-out. --ErickAgain (talk) 12:17, 18 November 2008 (UTC).

I just removed the Military section for two reasons. First it used the same text as the Military of Peru article and second, this topic is already dealt with in the Government section, which already provides a link to Military of Peru article. So, I think there's no point in this extra section. I also reverted the change from "extremely poor" to "impoverished" as "extremely poor" is a better match to official Peruvian terminology as used by INEI. --Victor12 (talk) 21:36, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

Date of recognition

The English Wikipedia gives 1824 as the year, but the Spanish Wikipedia gives August 14, 1879 as the date. Which is correct? Josh (talk) 12:41, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

actually different countries recognized the peruvian entity at diferent moments in history, being Spain the last one to do so(1879). --Andersmusician NO 21:43, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

new image

This picture really illustrates the ethnic composition of Peru.

Schoolgirls at the national parade.

--201.230.196.102 (talk) 20:19, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

I agree. I think it's stereotypical that the only picture of a Peruvian person in the article has to be from an Andean woman.--[|!*//MarshalN20\\*!|] (talk) 16:58, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

I disagree, this proposed new image has a clear focus on the blond girl which is at the center of the pic and happens to be the only girl looking at the camera. This girl hardly illustrates the ethnic composition of Peru. The current pic is much better as it depicts the Amerindian group which happens to be the main contributor to the current Peruvian demographic composition. --Victor12 (talk) 04:25, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

The point is not to focus on one of the people in the picture, but rather to focus on all three people pictured. If this picture is not satisfactory, a new one should definately be found in order to show a more factual depiction of Peruvian demographics. Victor12, you comment that the Amerindian group "happens to be the main contriutor to the current Peruvian demographic composition," but the article itself states: 45% Amerindian, 37% Mestizo (mixed Amerindian and European), 15% White, and 3% black, Japanese, Chinese . So by 8% the article is only going to include solely the stereotypical picture of an Amerindian woman, while completely ignoring the Mestizo population. I don't think that's the right thing to do.--[|!*//MarshalN20\\*!|] (talk) 16:45, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

Actually the focus of the pic is quite important as it is quite obvious that the blond girl is the main subject of the image. BTW, blond people are quite rare in Peru, so this is hardly a representative depiction of Peruvian demographics. As for the Amerindians being the main contributors to the current composition of the Peruvian population I think the numbers are pretty obvious, the "mestizo" group is just the mixture of Amerindian and European so they are also Amerindian to a large extent as you can see by comparing estimates of the native population at the time of the Conquest (even taking into account its demographic collapse) with the numbers of white immigrants to Peru. Besides the current picture is a very good one so I can't see why it bothers you so much to have it in the article. --Victor12 (talk) 04:14, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Your comment parades around my suggestion without directly answering the main point of it. As I mentioned in my earlier statement, "if this picture is not satisfactory [...]," which makes your "BTW [...]" an unnecessary overstatement. "Mestizo" is not the same thing as Amerindian, because if you're going to say that they are "Amerindian to a large extent," then I can also claim that they are European to a large extent. A Mestizo is a mixture of both Amerindians and Europeans, as you stated. What bothers me about the current picture is that it is a stereotypical depiction of Peruvian demographics. I am not asking for the picture to be removed, I'm asking for either a Mestizo to be pictured separately in that same section or for a picture with a better demonstration of Peruvian demographics to be pictured.--[|!*//MarshalN20\\*!|] (talk) 21:46, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Actually, when you say if you're going to say that they are "Amerindian to a large extent," then I can also claim that they are "European to a large extent" you are missing my point about the numbers of Amerindians and Europeans. It is quite evident that European immigration could not compare numerically to the native Amerindian population. So, by the numbers alone it is quite clear that Amerindian is the main component of the Peruvian demographics. If that is so I fail to see why you claim this pic to be stereotypical. As for having another pic in this section I don't think the text is big enough to have two pics without going against the Wikipedia Manual of Style, that is without sandwiching text between images. --Victor12 (talk) 23:11, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Demographics

I think this article should stress that Peruvian census does not contain information about population ethnicity so only rough estimates, based in undisclosed source, are available. The racial structure mentioned in this article was estimated by the CIA - The World Factbook and it's not an official data. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Viclimay (talk • contribs) 21:41, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Poverty

Please, according to INEI (National Statistics Institute of Peru) the poverty level in 2008 was 36,2%, see this link with the official anounce: http://www.inei.gob.pe/web/NotaPrensa/Attach/8316.pdf . 39% was the poverty level in 2007. Please change it. --Wikiperuvian (talk) 02:56, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Done. --Victor12 (talk) 01:53, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Update Urgently Needed

The 2009 revolt of rainforest tribal people should not only be mentioned, but have its own in-depth section putting it in context. The context includes:

Ethnic Politics: The rise of the indigenous left in Latin America. Examples include the election of ethnically native presidents in Venezuela and Bolivia, the Zapatista movement in Mexico (related to resistance to free trade agreements as well as historic oppression of indigenous people) and in Peru itself, the (often coerced) involvement of Andean natives in the Shining Path movement, and the current support of the Andean people to etnocentric and nationalist para-militar groups such as the Etnocacerista movement of Antauro Humala (The take over of a police station in the town of Andahuaylas in 2005 by the Etnocacerista movement had the support of the mayority of the town's population). The events in Peru are of course related to the Kayapo resistance in Brazil, and similar efforts in Southeast Asia; there is also a parallel with the Nigerian tribal resistance to oil exploitation and resulting environmental damage.

Ecological Politics: The environmental / Green movement tends to represent the interests and concerns of 'First World' Caucasians of middle and upper economic strata, and generally limits its tactics and strategies to counterproductive deals with the corporate sector, lobbying (usually without lasting or substantial success) for legislation, and occasional symbolic ritualized confrontations (e.g., Greenpeace presence in whaling operations, anti-nuclear civil disobedience). However, the Peruvian resistance is part of a 500-year-long struggle of colonized peoples to defend their ancient ways of life, which depend on a viable ecosystem with autonomous species living life on their own terms. Since they're facing genocide in most cases, and negotiated agreements are almost invariably broken by their conquerors, these people rarely have the option of moderation.

Economics: Pressures on rainforests and other natural resources were increased severely by the 1965-1985 era of World Bank loans and IMF demands, and since 1985 by so-called free trade agreements. The Peruvian government's efforts to accelerate the exploitation of the Amazon are presumably an effort to bring Peru into 'the new global economy'. Only when the real value of the Amazon is recognized by the global financial system will the real value of the tribal resistance be fully appreciated.

I don't know enough about the recent events, or about Peru, to contribute the section that's needed. But it seems obvious that these events are of great historical significance, and not only for Peru itself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chelydra (talk • contribs) 09:36, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

This topic has its own article at 2009 Peruvian political crisis. IMHO to have a section dedicated to this incident in the article about the whole country would incur in WP:UNDUEWEIGHT and thus be against Wikipedia's guidelines. --Victor12 (talk) 13:24, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Not only undue weight but also a case of WP:Recentism. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia not a newspaper. Also please do not make titles with ALL CAPS thanks.--Jersey Devil (talk) 15:58, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Title is no longer all caps. The fact that Peru is on the front lines of two of the most historically significant developments of the past two decades (or milennia, depending on your point of view) — the global financial transformations of free trade and finance-driven resource give-aways, and the devastation of the Amazon (not to mention indigineous people) puts this is a different category than the usual news story, and I'm glad to see it's got its own article. THIS page should have a clear link to it (unless I overlooked it).

Urgent update: Gini index in 2008

According to INEI (National Statistics Institute of Peru) the Gini index in 2008 was 0.479, please check the official document in this link: http://censos.inei.gob.pe/DocumentosPublicos/Pobreza/2008/Informe_Tecnico.pdf

I think 0.479 is equivalent to 47,9 because the 2002 Gini index was 54,6. Please change it.

Is 47,9 a high Gini index or a medium one?

--Wikiperuvian (talk) 23:33, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Aneything above 4.5 is high i'll put down 48.--J intela (talk) 20:30, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

Image of Machu Picchu not visible when printed

The image of Machu Picchu does not appear in the printed version of this article. Is there a reason for this?--$%MarshalN20%$ (talk) 20:31, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

PLEASE, ADD A TITLE ABOUT " EDUCATION"

The Topics could be. History: During the Pre-Inka, Inka, Virreynato, Republica. Today: Nursery School, Primary, Secondary and Tertiary Education (Technical and University). Education quality (who is in charge of the university quality), the degrees obtained at the different universities (list of Universities, year created - with a link to their web site). Agreements between the Peruvian Universities and other Peruvian, Peruvian and other countries. Definition or explanation of what Licentiate is (Professional Title) and what a License is (Professional License obtained from the Colegio Profesional). Famous Peruvians in the Arts and Sciences. Discoveries they have done. With Links.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.158.98.35 (talk) 17:10, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

El "Grieve": The First South American vehicle

I was quite surprised to find that Peru had built the first South American automobile. You can read it in this article. Do any of you think that this information could somehow be included in this article? I'll try to find books and other sources for reference checks.--$%MarshalN20%$ (talk) 23:27, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

El Callao, the Pacific Port for Brazilian Exports and Imports from Asia

The importance of El Callao port is increasing as it becomes the more obvious alternative for Brazilian Exports and Imports from Asia, especially from China. There are important infraestructure projects linking El Callao to Sao Paulo.--88.24.243.147 (talk) 02:14, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Geography

It's inaccurate to say that Peru is geographically divided in only three regions. That's the most common way of dividing the territory, but it's inaccurate. There are several geographical areas that won't fit in just one of the categories. The article should say: the country is commonly divided in that way, however, there are several ways of categorizing the peruvian geographical areas (check Brack) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Andreas1991 (talk • contribs) 22:20, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

European inmigrants

Isn't the number of Austrian immigrants (germanic, croatian, hungarian, slavics in general) bigger than the number of Arab immigrants? Shouldn't they be included?

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.180.193.59 (talk) 14:46, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

Health

I think that a short section on health should be added. Are there any objections? Sarcelles (talk) 17:24, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

What would be its purpose and fruitful contribution to the article?--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 22:22, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Three youngest mothers ever - coincidence?

Is it just an outlandish coincidence that the three youngest mothers ever are all from Peru and within a few hundred miles of each other? Does the culture there encourage pedophilia or something? Given the midwestern and southern locations of the American cases, it seems plausible. 68.8.99.245 (talk) 18:07, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Do you have any valid sources for the claim? Otherwise that's just a bunch of BS.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 22:21, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Official Language

Quechua is also the official language of Peru so it should be added in the language box of the article if anyone could do that please —Preceding unsigned comment added by Darksorce (talk • contribs) 00:07, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

At the bottom of the infobox there's a message that explains: "Quechua, Aymara and other indigenous languages are co-official in the areas where they are predominant." SamEV (talk) 01:23, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

Although In 1975, during Juan Velasco Alvarado's presidency, was legally declared Quechua an official language of Peru the status of Quechua in Peruvian society is discussed, noting specific social and political factors contributing to the dying out of the Quechua language, functional domains the language serves, and possible measures to improve its status. The relationship of those functional domains to Peruvian language policies is also explored. An introductory section provides background information on the principles and purposes of language planning, describes Peru's population and the history of its language use and distribution, and reviews recent literature on diglossia and language status planning. The functional domains of Quechua are then outlined in the context of current theory, and ways in which the domains affect Quechua's status in a Spanish-dominated society are considered, particularly in the formation of language policy. It is concluded that despite predictions that Quechua is headed for extinction, there is potential for maintenance of the language in some domains, such as provincial or group domains. While Quechua will never again be the dominant language, it will continue to be valued by the highland communities that continue to speak it. Development of a national daily newspaper, magazine, or radio program in Quechua is suggested as a means of heightening awareness and visibility of the language. Ccrazymann (talk) 22:27, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

Angamos Picture

I would like to take out this picture from the history section. What purpose does it serve in terms of the Peru article? The other pictures in the article show the independence of Peru, the famed Inca ruins, Peru's geography, etc. However, the Angamos picture depicts a naval loss for Peru in a war that Peru lost as well. It's not as if the country has not won any important wars (Peru has defeated Ecuador twice, defeated Spain twice, etc.), and there have been more important historical matters in Peru beyond the War of the Pacific. I argue that we either free up space in that section by deleting that picture or replacing it with a more modern historical picture (is there not something also representative of Peru?).--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 03:57, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Peruvian News

This website provides news about Peru on a daily basis. All peruvians need or want to be informed about their homeland.

• PeruanoNews Peruvian News —Preceding unsigned comment added by Peruanoedwire (talk • contribs) 08:09, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Cultural and Travel Information for Peru

[http: //www.everythingperu.com Everything Peru] provides a wealth of cultural information, travel information (including reviews from travelers), and news about Peru. —Preceding unsigned comment added by LolaWhit47 (talk • contribs) 04:53, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

Heads of state and government

I'm pretty sure that President, Vice President, and Prime Minister have been vandalized on the right-hand side.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jcrossen1 (talk • contribs) 21:53, 31 March 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Josephschwenker, 1 April 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} Change Peru's President from "Joe Arrieta's left nut" to Alan Garcia Perez. Change Peru's Vice President from "his right nut" to Luis Giampietri.Josephschwenker (talk) 02:00, 1 April 2010 (UTC) Change Peru's Prime Minister from "Joe's intestine" to Yehude Simon Munaro.

Josephschwenker (talk) 02:00, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Already done Thanks for pointing out that vandalism. Someone (Jersey Devil (talk)) has already corrected it and blocked the vandal. Cheers, Celestra (talk) 02:47, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Education

It should be mentioned briefly. Are there any objections?Sarcelles (talk) 17:20, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Penal system

I'm watching the Joran van der Sloot article and he obviously does not belong in this article, yet I think adding some details about the Peruvian penal/court system to this article could shed some light on the subject. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.38.208.30 (talk) 16:04, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

History of Peru section

The history of Peru section should simply be a brief outline of Peruvian history, not an anthropological study of the first cultures. This whole paragraph should be removed and placed in a better location in specific articles:

In the early 21st century, archeologists have discovered new evidence of ancient pre-Ceramic complex cultures. In 2005 Tom D. Dillehay and his team announced the discovery of three irrigation canals that were 5400 years old, and a possible fourth that is 6700 years old, all in the Zaña Valley in northern Peru, evidence of community activity to support improved agriculture at a much earlier date than previously believed. In 2006, Robert Benfer and a research team discovered a 4200-year-old observatory at Buena Vista, a site in the Andes several kilometers north of present-day Lima. They believe the observatory was related to the society's reliance on agriculture and understanding the seasons. The site includes the oldest three-dimensional sculptures found thus far in South America. In 2007 the archeologist Walter Alva and his team found a 4000-year-old temple and murals at Ventarrón, in the northwest Lambayeque region. The temple contained ceremonial offerings gained from exchange with Peruvian jungle societies, as well as those from the Ecuadoran coast. Such finds show sophisticated, monumental construction requiring large-scale organization of labor, suggesting that hierarchical, complex cultures arose in South America much earlier than scholars had thought.

Best regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 04:54, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

I agree, I've just moved the text to the History of Peru article. --Victor12 (talk) 13:40, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Thank you Victor.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 04:42, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Health

It should be mentioned briefly. Are there any objections?Sarcelles (talk) 10:57, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

I agree, the infant mortality rate in Peru is the second highest in South America, and the degree of risk of contracting infectious diseases is "very high". Major infectious diseases include malaria, typhoid fever, leptospirosis, dengue fever, yellow and dengue fever as well as bacterial waterborne diseases due to unsafe water sanitation and supplies!!. 22:02 12 Dec 2010. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.184.0.232 (talk) 09:03, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Religion

To discuss any of the successor states arising out of the Spanish Empire without even a mention of religion is unthinkable. This article needs some explanation of the structure, status, and role of of Roman Catholicism (still over 80 percent of the population, at least nominally) in the country. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.154.108.231 (talk) 14:15, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

The article has varius mentions of Roman Catholic culture in Peru, such as the census of religion and the effects of religion in Peruvian art and education. Not much else is needed in this article in regards to that subject. However, if you're interested in contributing more information in regards to that matter, please feel free to expand the following article:

• Roman Catholicism in Peru

Thank you for your comment. Best regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 04:26, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Edit Conflict: Census

I'm noticing there seems to be an edit conflict in regards to the census of the Native American peoples and their rapid decline as a result of infectious diseases. I'm opening this space up so that we can comment on it and come to a solution. All the best of wishes.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 15:11, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

A rapid decline in indigenous people in peru? Are you out of your mind or something?!?! Amerindians are the LARGEST ethnic group in Peru!!!!! They account for a whooping 45% of the population, that's almost half! What rapid decline are you talking about???????????. 22:20 12 Dec 2010. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.184.0.232 (talk) 09:21, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

It takes only a bit of education to learn that infections such as smallpox wiped out large sectors of the Native American population in Peru. Peruvian historiography takes into the account the people of the Viceroyalty of Peru (as far back as the Nueva Castilla era, when Pizarro governed) as part of Peruvian history. Also, note that Native Americans/Amerindians are a diverse group of people that range from the Quechuas (North and South), Aymaras, and the various Amazon tribes. The largest somewhat more homogeneous group of demographics in Peru are the Mestizos, or mixed native and European ancestry (which for the most part is Spanish and native), just like in Chile (where you claim to be writing from [4]). Best regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 20:31, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

I've restored the original text on the demographic decline of the amerindian population, which quotes Cook. Cook is not only a reliable source but the most respected on this subject in the academic world. You can check any modern history of Peru, for instance Klaren's or Hunefeldt's and you'll see him quoted on this topic. Further discussion about Peruvian demographics after the Spanish Conquest should go on the Demographics of Peru or in the Spanish Conquest of Peru articles. The Peru article is supposed to be a summary of the main info about the country; it does not need to represent every viewpoint on each of its subtopics. --Victor12 (talk) 19:50, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

70% White and White-Amerindian

According to a 2008 survey by the Instituto de Opinión Pública de la Pontificia Universidad Católica del Perú, 70% is considered White and White-Amerindian, 30% are considered by other groups. http://iop.pucp.edu.pe/images/documentos/2008%20ENERO%20LIMA%20LIMA.pdf --Vasco-peruano (talk) 01:00, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

That's just a survey and it only concerns Lima, not the whole of Peru. --Victor12 (talk) 02:25, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

Etymology of Peru

I recently read some works by Inca Garcilaso de la Vega in which he gives his explanation for the name of Peru. Should his version of the etymology be taken into account, or is Porras Barrenechea's explanation the standard (i.e., academically accepted) position? Best regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 05:08, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

The main difference between Garcilaso and Porras is that Garcilaso as all other chroniclers is a primary source whereas Porras is a secondary source, as such, Porras is more reliable having the advantage of writing several centuries after Garcilaso examining a wider variety of sources and having an academic background which allowed him a better analysis. Thus, I think Porras should be left to stand on its own in that section. --Victor12 (talk) 21:46, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

Picture of Peruvians

I like the pictures chosen. They represent three of the main or traditional racial groups that exist in Peru. However, I find it rather insulting to have only full names for individuals of mainly afro and European descent. We should choose a representative and recognizable individual of mainly indigenous or Quechua extraction displaying his or her full name!!. Options could be Alejandro Toledo, Alberto Pizango, Magaly Solier, Martín Chambi, etc, etc. One more detail, If I am not wrong the number of Afro and Asian Peruvians are very similar. Thus, by not including Asian Peruvians in the mix we are discriminating against this group. Again there are several examples of Asian Peruvians from Alberto and Keiko Fujimori to Erasmo Wong. Viclimay (talk) 19:47, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Formerly, the picture used to be one of an Andean woman and child. The pictures are there to show either a good demographics picture or (in the case one is not available) a current notable person.

Amerindians

The Amerindian man from Pisac is a Featured Image (regarded as one of the best by the community). He does not have a name for the public, but the picture exemplifies the culture of the demographic group (which is the purpose of the picture). In that sense, there is no need for the picture to be changed.

Notable people

When there is a lack of a good demographics picture, the article resorts to current globally notable people . In this case we have Jefferson Farfan, who is a symbol of both Peruvian sports and the Afro-Peruvian. The article also shows Mantilla, a European Peruvian who serves mainly to show Peruvian women (Yes, she is a former model, so it's a bit of a tongue-in-cheek picture). Ideally, if you can find a better picture of these demographic groups, there would be no need to have notable people.

In regards to Asians, remember that we have to include currently famous people. In this aspect Wong is not currently notable. Considering the history of Peru, including Keiko or Alberto Fujimori in a demographics section is both a political statement and not a very appropiate one (especially since Alberto Fujimori has been condemned by the Peruvian Judicial system).

Best regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 00:48, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

I do agree with you on the use of political figures because they can be highly controversial. However, they are not the only Asian Peruvians. They seem to be very active in the making of the Peruvian culinary boom. e.g. Javier Wong (who is often described as a guru of Peruvian ceviche), Humberto Sato (owner of Costanera 700 arguably the best sea food restaurant in the country). Regarding the picture of the man from Pisac I actually like it and I will put it on it's own. However, the way this selection was chosen or edited might misled, unintentionally, some readers into thinking that there is not any notable Peruvian of mainly indigenous background. Cheers Viclimay (talk) 15:02, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Your concerns are understood, and I believe they are correct. However, I only have limited resources available for pictures. Remember that pictures are subject to copyright laws as they belong to the people who take them. If you can upload your own photos and set them under a public license, we can certainly include them in the article. Remember that Wikipedia is made by the free content of users like yourself. The more you contribute, the better. Best of wishes.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 15:41, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from AurelioG

The quick fact table on the left of the page lists Peru as the 43rd country population wise, however the page with the complete list linked from the number lists Peru as number 40. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AurelioG (talk • contribs)

Done — Bility (talk) 19:10, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

Badly lacking: a Politics of Peru new section

In the article, the treatment of Peru's contemporary politics is not just lacking, it is terribly poor and dismal. In this respect, the article is outdated, too. An urgent overhaul, or better: a whole new section on the subject, a new article perhaps, are badly needed. --AVM (talk) 14:50, 18 April 2011 (UTC)

Why is it outdated, official results on this year Congressional election are not out yet and as for the presidential election we still have a run-off election to get a new president so until then I think no mayor update is needed. As for needing a new article, we already have Politics of Peru. --Victor12 (talk) 04:14, 19 April 2011 (UTC)

I agree with Victor12. The Government section already serves the purpose of being a summary of the information. No tag is necessary because the material is correct.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 23:48, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

New President

Sorry for the quick addition - the new president wasn't added, but his bio exists in the database. I updated who is president and will get to fleshing this out ASAP. LTC (Ret.) David J. Cormier (talk) 23:03, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Hello, he is not the president yet, he will assume office on July 28. --Victor12 (talk) 04:16, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Wars with Ecuador

As I was reading the history section, I noticed an important part of Peruvian history which is not in the text: The border conflicts with Ecuador. In particular, the war of the 1940s, which established the Rio Protocol and the borders. I'd be willing to include maybe a sentence or two on the subject, but first I'd like to know if anyone else would like to give it a shot, any other ideas and suggestions, or if anyone is opposed to the idea. Best regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 05:15, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Here is a sample sentence which could be included in either the 4th or 5th paragraphs of the History section:

The Rio Protocol of 1942 defined Peru's borders with Ecuador, but it took until 1995 for the final demarcations to end one of the longest territorial disputes in the Western Hemisphere.

Suggestions are welcome.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 22:09, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Flag of Peru

There seems to be a dispute over the flag of Peru in the article. I don't really know which is more appropriate according to Peru's law (the civil or the state ensign), but perhaps it is worth discussing here in the talk page?--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 04:34, 26 August 2011 (UTC)

Hello, this issue has already been discussed but, as this page archive's seem to have been pruned, I'm pasting the discussion below. --Victor12 (talk) 13:03, 26 August 2011 (UTC)

• 
• 

I wonder which of these should be used on the infobox --Andersmusician $ 05:37, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

After reading Flag of Peru it seems to me we should use the first one as that is the National Flag (Bandera nacional) as opposed to National Ensign (Pabellón nacional) which is the one with the coat of arms in it. Besides there is no need to show the coat of arms twice, side by side. I've changed the pic accordingly. What does everybody else think? --Victor12 17:18, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

It's been changed to state flag again. The national flag seemed fine to me, but not to everyone it seems. Can we put the national flag here and wait for more reactions before changing it again? Eric Bronder 04:43, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Oops, I've reverted before checking this out. I'm sorry, I won't change the flag anymore until there's a clear consensus. --Victor12 11:46, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Sorry Victor12, my phrasing was a bit off. I noticed someone else changed it from national to state flag and i remembered this discussion, so i made the note above. I think we should change it to the national flag as has been the flag shown for the last two months. But to prevent someone from changing it to the state flag again i added the note to end the discussion and create "jurisprudence". ErickAgain 16:22, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

The National flag is by far the most probable one to be encountered by people, be it on television, sporting events etc. The state flag is to be used by the government only. We also do not use the military flag. If we reach consensus we can change it back to the one we decide upon now, by refering to this discussion. ErickAgain 16:22, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

I agree we need jurisprudence. I'd also go for the national flag. As a further argument, the Constitution says "The national symbols are the flag with three vertical bands, in red, white and red, and the coat of arms and the national anthem established by law". --Victor12 16:48, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

As Erick said, the non-insign flag is more recognized everywhere, so I support the "normal" flag on infobox from this point of view. --Andersmusician VOTE 05:12, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

This touches on the concern I raised here. The national flag is used for sports teams, yes or no?

eae 02:00, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

I don't agree with the point of "jurisprudence" in Wikipedia, as consensus is subject to change. Nonetheless, the points raised in the discussion are quite valid. I'd like to add that this article isn't just about the Peruvian state, but about Peru as a whole: Geography, culture, demographics. The only two sections state-related are Government and Regions, and maybe also History and Etymology. Something else I'd like to note is that, in the past (not sure how long back), the state flag was the only other flag option aside from the war flag, but the civil flag eventually was made separate to the state flag (to represent both private organizations and civilians). This mainly concerns sports-related matters (old Peru national football team mentions, such as in the 1930s World Cup, are going to have the state flag since that was the official flag for them at the time, while new mentions of the team will have the civil flag since they are a non-government organization).--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 13:28, 26 August 2011 (UTC)

Abortive plan to relocate the capital city?

The edition of the BBC programme "World's Most Dangerous Roads" set in Peru [5], broadcast on 20 September 2011, was based on a spectacularly dangerous journey to the once-planned new state capital, at the geographic centre of the country. The disastrous re-location plan never materialised. But it is surprising that there is no mention of the subject in any of the Wikipedia Peru articles. 109.154.156.195 (talk) 17:17, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

I am not sure in what article this would be relevant information. If you have or find enough reliable sources on the matter you could certainly create a new article on it; but it would probably be an orphan unless you associate it with a particular government and other capital relocation plans.

That the matter is not anywhere here in Wikipedia shouldn't be "surprising" as the subject you bring up is the one that lacks much discussion even within Peru.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 00:15, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

I'm not sure that "discussion within Peru" is necessarily the best criterion for the inclusion of material in this article. You might find this source interesting: [6]. It seems perfectly reliable, although in the form of a blog. Perhaps some of the material might usefully be added to this article and/or to the article on Fernando Belaunde Terry? Thanks. 109.153.213.48 (talk) 17:41, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

"Discussion within Peru" is nothing more than an indirect way of explaining that the subject's notability is low even in Peru. The only people interested in this subject would either be biographers of Belaunde Terry (or historians of his presidency) and probably architects (city planners). Hence, the link you provide should probably be used to include information within the Fernando Belaunde Terry article, as you propose.

The question of whether this information should be included in this article (Peru), I still incline towards the negative. Just ask two questions: Why is this important for Peru? and Did this have any relevant consequences on Peruvian history? In the end the capital remained at Lima, and really no one even remembers Belaunde Terry attempting to make a change. Compare this to Brasilia, for instance, which did have a huge impact on Brazil during its construction and a long-lasting impact on the nation's future.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 20:54, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

I think you are probably right. Although Belaunde Terry's efforts are long forgotten, from the BBC programme it would seem that the main lasting effect has been in the road network that was forged to try and realise his failed dream. This will probably continue to be further developed as time goes by, even without any new capital to connect to. I would guess that Belaunde Terry and his cronies were probably greatly inspired by Brasilia. Many thanks. 109.153.213.48 (talk) 21:10, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Official Languages

I did add Quechua and Aymara as official languages as stated in the Peruvian Constitution of 1993... I speak Quechua... --Giraldezjota (talk) 07:16, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

As you can read in article 48 of the current Peruvian Constitution Son idiomas oficiales el castellano y, en las zonas donde predominen, también lo son el quechua, el aimara y las demás lenguas aborígenes, según la ley. This situation is already explained in a note in the infobox. --Victor12 (talk) 13:50, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

There exists a Languages of Peru article. I propose to edit this into the note in the infobox so that others may find it, read it, and possibly expand it. I will edit it in for the time being, but if anyone disagrees feel free to revert the edit and discuss. Best regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 21:43, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

There needs to be a header in both official languages. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mattk0516 (talk • contribs) 22:24, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Official languages vary by region. Spanish is all that is needed.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 23:27, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Discrete subgroups?

A sentence in the introduction stated:

"The Peruvian population, estimated at 29.5 million, is multiethnic, including Amerindians, Mestizos, Europeans, Africans, and Asians"

There are a few issues here that are debatable. First, this presents the Peruvian population as if it could be split into several discrete entities. (I have no problems, in general, with the word "multiethnic", except when -- as seems to be the case here -- it is used to reinforce an impression that society can in fact be divided into separate "ethnicities"; this is never fully the case, and in Peru's case it is rather far from the truth.) Now, while racial discrimination is certainly still a part of the realities of life in Peru, it is also the case that Peruvians live in a very mixed society; there are, say, class lines, but these have at most a 'correlation' with phenotype.

Key points:

• Very few Peruvians descend from a single human group.
• Putting "mestizo" alongside other groups does not solve the problem. "Mestizo" denotes a separate caste, if you wish, which did exist in Colonial times, or a more vaguely defined social stratum that had some reality in much of the highlands up to the mid-20th century. (Even in the highlands, your mileage could vary; in my perception, society in, for example, Cajamarca tended to perceive itself mostly along the lines of 'vecinos' vs. 'campesinos', where the latter could very well be of largely Spanish extraction.)
• The notion of "ethnic group", as a popular concept, is arguably a mid-20th Anglo-Saxon invention that did not have much currency in Peru until very recently.
• Shortly after independence, the Republic abolished the notion of a division of citizens into two separate bodies of "Indians" and "Spaniards", at least in the official ideology. Of course, reality lagged far behind for a long time; still, this classical liberal notion of citizenship - not the notion of "ethnicity" - was the ideology inculcated at school.
• Race has not, as far as I am aware, used in the census for half a century. (This is why the "Indian/White" percentages sometimes given are from so far back.)
• Peruvians are not Europeans, Africans or Asians; they can *descend* from Europeans, Africans or Asians.
• "European" linked to the controversial page "White Latin American". It is a reality of life that having a light complexion (preferably associated with some money) will get you classified as "white" in some people's minds, and this will affect your life in some (possibly both positive and completely unwelcome) ways. However, stating that "White Latin Americans" are an objectively existing, well-defined group is much more controversial. There are people who imagine themselves to be white, surely... Feketekave (talk) 16:52, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Your opinions, while interesting, are not what matter in the article. The introduction is nothing more than a summary of what is presented in the article. The first paragraph of the Demographics section is what contains the relevant information to this particular paragraph in the introduction. I included the term "Mestizo" because not only is it still used in Peru (and other parts of Latin America; and even by the CIA as can be seen in the Mestizo article), but because I do believe that most Peruvians fall into that category (from personal experience; of course, the larger number still being the Amerindians). However, as you challenged it and the term is not validated in the Demographics section, then I removed it as well.

Taking your point into account, what I find an easy solution the matter would be to include "descendants of" after the word "including" (i.e., "The Peruvian population, estimated at 29.5 million, is multiethnic, including descendants of Amerindians, Europeans, Africans, and Asians). Alternatively the following can also be used: "The Peruvian population, estimated at 29.5 million, is multiethnic, including people of Amerindian, European, African, and Asian descendency". I hope this satisfies your thoughts. Best of wishes.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 17:35, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Either of the last two formulations is an improvement of the current version, though "descendency" should really be "descent". It would seem even better to have a formulation that does not seem to include the fact - on which we seem to agree - that most Peruvians have more than one kind of descent. What about "... is multiethnic; Amerindian, European, African and Asian descent are all significant" (or: common)? Feketekave (talk) 17:39, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

- and, by the way, talking about broader issues is unavoidable. Critical analysis of data (by you or by me) is essential in any sort of writing, and cannot be brushed aside as mere "opinion". As the article Mestizo itself shows, 'mestizaje' is a very complex notion, involving not just 'racial' but cultural mixing and a particular kind of national identity. Feketekave (talk) 17:41, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Incidentally, the "ethnic groups" percentages in the infobox are extremely debatable (as is the notion that such clearly defined things exist nowadays...). Yes, it is sourced - to the CIA World Factbook (which has a frankly bad reputation; it is not a scholarly source). More damningly, the figures seem to come from the 1940 census! (As I was saying before - it was the last census in Peru in which people were defined in this fashion, and so it is what is often used by foreign sources looking desperately for percentages.) Feketekave (talk) 17:46, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Regarding your argument, I am not brushing it aside (and pardon me if you got such an impression). It is exactly because I understand what you are presenting (and I do agree with your central point) that I do not deny that a change is indeed necessary. What I am trying to avoid is solely having our opinions change an FA-class article. If you can provide reliable sources to "strenghten" (for the sake of redundancy, remember that I already agree with your point) your proposal, that would be a much better stand from which to discuss the situation.

I am assuming that whoever reviewed the article (to give it the FA-class), must have seen and accepted the CIA World Factbook. Per WP:AGF, of course.

Your proposal is going on the right direction. I do not like the wording of it (in terms of sentence structure), but if you think that is the best you can come up with, then I would not oppose you adding it. I think that it fits in better with the information in the demographics section (which does not explain what exactly happened to the immigrants). Nonetheless, a source could come in handy. Best of wishes.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 23:33, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Hello. Regarding the demographics subsection I noticed that the images in the section comprise of a black Peruvian and two white Peruvians. I believe it is undue weight to have two pictures of white Peruvians while there are none of Indigenous Peruvians (who represent a large part of the population) and Asian Peruvians (who have influenced modern Peru greatly). Could someone please explain to me why the page is currently set up this way? V.S.Gonzalez (talk) 02:05, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

It's not intentional. The pictures are meant to display current notable Peruvians (in a world sense, not just Peru). The image of Maria Julia Mantilla should no longer be on it since her notability has diminished, but no one has found a better image so far. If you can find a better image of a current non-white notable Peruvian (preferably a female), then go ahead and change it. The image should preferably have a left-leaning angle, but a forward picture (like the Vargas Llosa one) is good as well.

So, as you can tell, it's a complicated matter. Perhaps you might wonder why we are using current notable Peruvians? I was the one that made the change as, whichever way you look at it, using "notable" or "non-notable" individuals are discriminative forms of stereotyping a society. In other words, it's equally stereotypical to pick a "notable" or a "non-notable". What makes the difference is that the "notables" are actually relevant persons (most people looking at the article can click on their names and learn more about them), whereas "non-notables" do not have that option.

Finally, please do not include any currently-active political figures (especially possible presidential candidates). Best regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 02:41, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 8 April 2012

literature, and music

tipical dances

Mistertravel (talk) 23:41, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

 Not done. If you have specific suggestions, please bring them forward. CMD (talk) 04:57, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Peru is no longer a G-15 Member

{{edit semi-protected}} Their official member-roster found here - http://www.g15.org/gfmembers.html - does not list them, and I have found sources such as this website by the Harvard Model Congress of Europe - http://hmceurope.org/programs/group-of-fifteen - reporting Peru's decision to drop from the G-15. I would have removed Category:G15 Nations from this article, but it is still protected after being featured. Can someone please do this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.83.185.60 (talk) 10:31, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Removed, thanks. Materialscientist (talk) 10:41, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

About Ethnic groups

According to Unicef and Universia amerindians are 30% - 32% of the population and mestizos are 47% of the population. Please change the statistics. --KobainCRSTN (talk) 01:24, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

According to the CIA World Factbook, which has updated its statistics in 2012, the numbers currently depicted are correct. The study you present from UNICEF is an estimate, and the source from where it cites it mentions that the minimum indigenous population is 25% and maximum is 48%. No other estimate is made for the other ethnic groups in Peru. The source of Universia does not seem reliable. Regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 02:07, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

I wonder what's the source for the CIA Factbook numbers... National census in Peru have not asked for race since 1940. --Victor12 (talk) 20:58, 1 August 2012 (UTC)

True. If the source is not reliable, the infobox section could simply be removed. It's worse to have incorrect information in the article than to have no information at all. Regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 22:55, 1 August 2012 (UTC)

Should we remove it? --Victor12 (talk) 20:11, 12 August 2012 (UTC)

I would not be against it. Nevertheless, if this is removed, the article would also need to change the following: "The majority of the people in Peru are Amerindians, mostly Quechua and Aymara, or mestizos who are of mixed white and Amerindian ancestry." This is cited with the CIA source as well. Perhaps this can be changed to: "According to the CIA World Factbook, the majority of people in Peru are Amerindians [...]." Regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 23:58, 12 August 2012 (UTC)

I think we should remove both as they are derived from an unreliable source for Peruvian Demographics. --Victor12 (talk) 20:24, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

Introduction improvement

I feel that a special mention should be made of Lake Titicaca in the intro of this article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.231.172.215 (talk) 06:10, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

Why do you think Lake Titicaca should have a special mention? Regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 06:36, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

It is the highest lake in the world. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.231.172.215 (talk) 06:38, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

Do you really think that such a "fact" (in reality, it's the highest navigable lake in the world; other lakes exist which are in higher grounds) is relevant to the Peruvian nation?--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 17:17, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

ok man... It isn't required.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.231.172.215 (talk) 19:14, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

Something to improve

Hello everyone, and out-of-package newbie from Peru. As long as i knew, the must a Admin to keep an eye so I will say: Someone can help?

The fact: On the 2nd line of the Cultures / history, one entry get my attention, the one about the culture "XXXX" (cannot recall it) who had Caral and others.

There is incorrect. !st. That is no the name of that "fantastic" culture, who remains unknow... and NOTHING is older than Caral in all the continent.

Don't know if someone is there, I will try sandboxed-style, but im stay too long today.

This will be my 1st grain of sand but will be happy if someone can fix that. Until next visit, best regards.

Forgot the signature. Sorry.

Tuzito (talk) 22:39, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

The usage of the common English name "Norte Chico Civilization" is prefered over "Caral Civilization." Archaeological discoveries are temporary and subject to change, and what is currently the "oldest known" civilizations can (and usually will) change overtime. For example, prior to Caral, the Olmecs were the oldest known complex civilization in the Americas. Of course, it also is important to note that older sites exist in the Americas. With these things in mind, there is no need to mention such a trivial matter into this particular article. Regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 23:30, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

Adding a voluntourism section

I want to add a "voluntourism" or NGOs as Peru is one of THE most popular places for international volunteers. This link could be very helpful: http://www.go-volunteerabroad.com/volunteer-in-peru Gotravelabroad (talk) 18:33, 17 May 2012 (UTC)gotravelabroadGotravelabroad (talk) 18:33, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Please do not add a voluntourism (or volunteerism, depending on what you meant) section to this article.

However, it would be a fantastic contribution to Wikipedia if you could create either of the following (or both):

• Voluntourism in Peru (click on this red link and start writing!)
• Volunteerism in Peru (click on this red link and start writing!)

Peru is certainly one of the most popular spots for volunteer work, and the encyclopedia would benefit from contributors such as yourself who are interested in expanding on the topic. Regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 19:03, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Why No Mention of Shining Path Insurgency?

Is this article a marketing piece? Why no mention of the Shining Path Maoists and the major drug trade they use? Even Wikipedia acknowledges this is an issue in Peru: [[7]]

And other references: http://www.economist.com/node/21562244 http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304543904577398041485810740.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.171.190.119 (talk) 00:08, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

The Internal conflict in Peru is mentioned in the last paragraph ("During the 1980s, Peru faced a considerable external debt, ever-growing inflation, a surge in drug trafficking, and massive political violence.").--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 02:08, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Energy and Science + Technology Sections

Previously, the "Energy" and "Science and Technology" sections were removed, "Energy and Technology information can go in Economics section." In which case, the content was re-added. However, this was removed citing "vandalism?" Assistance please.. Twillisjr (talk) 02:54, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

The information from technology and energy can be included into the economics section as long as it is properly cited. Subsections are not necessary. "Vandalism" is mentioned as several prior warnings were already given for this to be considered a WP:GF edit. Please use your sandbox (User:Twillisjr/sandbox) for test edits. Regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 03:17, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Ethnicity section missing in the top-right box for Peru

Other South American countries have an ethnicity section whereas Peru does not. Here's what it should have: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/pe.html

Ethnic groups: Amerindian 45%, mestizo (mixed Amerindian and white) 37%, white 15%, black, Japanese, Chinese, and other 3%

Languages: Spanish (official) 84.1%, Quechua (official) 13%, Aymara (official) 1.7%, Ashaninka 0.3%, other native languages (includes a large number of minor Amazonian languages) 0.7%, other 0.2% (2007 Census)

Religions: Roman Catholic 81.3%, Evangelical 12.5%, other 3.3%, unspecified or none 2.9% (2007 Census) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:15C0:66A3:2:21A:4DFF:FE40:38FF (talk) 07:01, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

Numerous statistics exist about this ethnicity, all with varying results. Due to the sensibility of the subject an unreliable data, this article does not present the ethnic group numbers. Regards.--MarshalN20 | ^Talk 16:41, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

Peru is bordered by-

I think the Pacific is to the West and Brazil is to the East. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.10.230.169 (talk) 17:49, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 January 2014

Purple trolls have invaded Peru once in 10000 years. 207.164.143.34 (talk) 17:04, 23 January 2014 (UTC)

 Not done - Vandalism - or very poor teaching at College Jean-de-Brebeuf - Arjayay (talk) 17:23, 23 January 2014 (UTC)

External links modified

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Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion:

• Plaza Mayor de Lima, Perú.png
• Plaza de Armas de Arequipa, Perú.png
• Plaza de Armas de Chiclayo, Perú.png
• Plaza de Armas de Cusco, Perú.png
• Plaza de Armas de Trujillo, Perú.png

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 00:37, 11 February 2019 (UTC)

Dammit know the recent image spamming would cause a problem.... will work on replacing these.--Moxy (talk) 01:22, 11 February 2019 (UTC)