Talk:Ruchell Magee

This article was nominated for deletion on 23 July 2023. The result of the discussion was no consensus.

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AFD version[edit]

Saving, [1]. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 02:37, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Maile66 a number of the sources mentioned in the AFD were nothing more than passing mentions relative to the more famous Angela Davis, but I've found plenty to expand and reduce the POV. Would you like to have a fresh look now? SandyGeorgia (Talk) 04:07, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Also, might you be interested in assessing the article? I don't know if it's a B or C-class (I've covered every source I can find), but I'm now the main author, so can't assess it myself. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 04:09, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Move proposal[edit]

I believe this article should be moved to Ruchell Magee, his legal name. Initially searching on Ruchell Ciqnue Magee on ProQuest or Newspapers.com was frustrating, as most sources refer to his legal name rather than the nickname he adopted. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:35, 28 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Newspapers.com 37 matches on Ruchell Cinque Magee, but
- 13,054 matches on Ruchell Magee, meaning I've wasted a lot of time here. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:44, 28 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support per COMMONNAME. -Indy beetle (talk) 08:01, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Done, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 13:33, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Lead[edit]

Indy beetle I'm planning to expand the Marin attacks section a bit still, but I'm hoping I can interest you in finishing the lead. (Also, see #Move proposal.) SandyGeorgia (Talk) 18:28, 28 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

PS, I don't know if you're interested in DYK (I don't do DYK), but if you are, the five-fold expansion can probably be met. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 18:29, 28 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

This book appears to have the most detailed account of the Marin County attack itself, which I found while researching Magee. Unfortunately, I don't have a full preview of the most relevant pages, so a request at RX might do us some good. I have no interest in DYK, which I personally consider a toxic and broken system, so I won't be improving an article for that purpose. I'm rather busy this week with RL stuff (new job responsibilities, etc.) so I might not be able to pay too much attention at the moment. -Indy beetle (talk) 08:05, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for all you did, Indy and good luck on new job and all! SandyGeorgia (Talk) 13:16, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Bettina Aptheker is not third-party; she is a friend of Angela Davis;[2] I think we've used the source appropriately, though. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 02:42, 30 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

And I'm noticing quite a few details Berger fails to mention in the chronology of the attack, along with getting some things wrong (Thomas was married to Haley's niece, not daughter). SandyGeorgia (Talk) 17:56, 30 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sigh, I trusted the publishers. -Indy beetle (talk) 06:58, 31 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I've now written Dan Berger (American academic); I think we can still use these sources for uncontroversial bits, with awareness of author predispositions. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 13:45, 31 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

WP:DUE People's Dispatch?[edit]

There are a number of quotes from the "People's Dispatch". Is this WP:DUE? I hadn't heard of the publication. DenverCoder9 (talk) 17:53, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Me neither :) But some of the ideas expressed by them are also expressed in Dan Bergen's Caption Nation book, or at least in the review of it ... SandyGeorgia (Talk) 18:20, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Another question is whether this source should be used, as it directly asks for money. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 21:54, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Inquired at WP:RSN. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 00:29, 30 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I've cut down these portions now, due to marginal sourcing, as we have similar content in higher quality sources, so DUE weight is given based on better sources. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 13:46, 31 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Lead section needs to be rewritten[edit]

I have added the {{Lead rewrite}} clean-up tag to the article because I think the lead section needs rewriting to emphasis the important information about the subject, first. The lead should introduce and summarize an article, highlighting what is most important to know about the subject, not be a small self-contained article in itself. I would suggest keeping the first sentence but the remainder of the lead has the wrong emphasis and may be too much detail as well as reading like a mini article, rather than being a summary. To me it is more important to highlight this person has been imprisoned for most of his life, than how he got there in the first place. I am not saying what facts appear in the lead should not, it is just the presentation and emphasis that seems unbalanced and mis-weighted. See MOS:LEAD. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 01:54, 17 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]