Talk:Zia ol Din Tabatabaee

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Birth and death dates

The birth and death dates seem to be flopped. Maybe that is a Persian convention, but I don't think so. I am switching them so the birth year is first, and the death year follows. Crockspot 19:32, 28 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, it turned out that the dates got mixed in with the Persian language tag, causing the dates to flip. Sorted it out. Crockspot 19:36, 28 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

---Confusing content--- The article says he was prime minister of the last Qajar shah and came to power with the Pahlavi-coup? That's cotradicting.

Edits

Hi @Iranianhistory101:. Thanks for expanding this article, but could you please add citations to the stuff you're adding? Atm there is lots of unsourced information (WP:CITENEED). --HistoryofIran (talk) 20:59, 25 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @HistoryofIran. Thanks for your message. Good catch -- I've added citations. But don't hesitate to let me know if you spot anything that needs to be cited. Most of the information is sourced from books and journals. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Iranianhistory101 (talk • contribs) 00:24, 26 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 5 October 2020

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved No consensus to move to another title. Probably best to have an actual target if someone wants to start a new RM. (non-admin closure) Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 19:24, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Zia ol Din Tabatabaee → ? – The spelling in the current title is less common than several other variations. The most common form of the last name is Tabataba'i and this is used in most of the article's sources (Google ngram is hard to use in this case, so perusal is required). The most common first name seems to be Seyyed, but this might violate WP:HONORIFICS. Many sources use the Zia without the ol Din/eddin/oddin. Britannica uses Sayyid Zia od-Din Tabatabaʾi. The article was previously at Zia'eddin Tabatabaee until a move last year with no rationale given and was at Seyyed Zia'eddin Tabatabaee until 2010. At a minimum the last name should be changed to reflect the more common form and the correct pronunciation. — AjaxSmack 00:30, 5 October 2020 (UTC) —Relisting. OhKayeSierra (talk) 22:04, 13 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Pinging recent contributors and discussants . — AjaxSmack 19:36, 5 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@AjaxSmack I agree with this, how can we change the name to conform to more commonly used spellings? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Iranianhistory101 (talk • contribs) 18:20, 6 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I don't consider using Seyyed a violation of WP:HONORIFICS, because: 1. It is officially part of the name. 2. It is very common, as he is simply known as "Seyyed Zia" in Iran. According to the Library of Congress, these variants are known to be used in Englsh [1]:

Ṭabāṭabāyī, Z̤iyā al-Dīn
Ṭabāṭabāyī, Sayyid Z̤iyāʼ al-Dīn
Ṭabāṭabāʼī, Sayyid Z̤iyāʼ al-Dīn
Tabatabai, Ziaeddin
Tabatabai, Seyed Ziaeddin
Tabatabaee, Seyyed Zia'eddin
Tabatabaee, Zia'eddin

Z̤iyāʼ al-Dīn is far from the dialect of Persian spoken in his native Iran (the name is of Arabic origin, not Persian). Ziaeddin (and variants) and Ziaoddin (and variants) are more near. However, Encyclopaedia Iranica uses this form ("ŻIĀʾ-AL-DIN"). We can also get rid of that Din part. I am comfortable with either of these options, but I prefer a transliteration used before by a reliable source. Pahlevun (talk) 07:58, 8 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]