Wikipedia talk:Wikipedia Signpost

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The Signpost

The Signpost feedback

Please use this page for general or technical issues, praise, queries, or complaints.

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Signpost MfD[edit]

(conversation moved from Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Suggestions)

I was going to propose an MfD for Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Tasks/Set, Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Deadline/core and Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Tasks/Colour as it seems like they haven't been regularly used in several years. Alternatively, you could mark them {{historic}} if you wanted to retain them for their page history. What do you think? Liz Read! Talk! 15:24, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

@Liz: No it's in active use—it's a sub-template for {{Signpost assignments}}, the core status matrix at the newsroom. Also, two things: we ask that users not get overly zealous with deleting materials in the Signpost namespace: see this discussion for instance, which resulted in a failed MfD and a truckload of ill will. Things that may seem useless now may come in handy in the future (I just brought article status templates back, something we last used in 2012). Second, this page is our tip line, meant for story suggestions only; more general messages should go to the talk page. Thanks, ResMar 15:32, 1 March 2015 (UTC)
Ok seriously look before you leap. ResMar 15:33, 1 March 2015 (UTC)
One, I've already asked Gamaliel if I could work on the Signpost categorization system and got the okay to organize pages which lack categorization. Issues like this one will come up during that process. Second, I am not deleting anything, I left a note here describing what I found. I realize that it is up to the Signpost staff to determine whether something is in use or not so I will not be putting forth any proposals. If I see a page that looks like it hasn't been used in several years, I'll note it on the talk page then and you all can decide what to do about it. Liz Read! Talk! 15:41, 1 March 2015 (UTC)
@Liz: Contact me on #wikisignpost connect to further discuss. If you are interested in categorization there's a project we're starting soon that will be in your domain. ResMar 15:45, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────Even if those work pages were not currently being used by Signpost editors, it would be apppropriate to mark them as "historical" using Template:Historical, i.e {{Historical}}. I suspect MFD and other deletions have been used sometimes when stuff should be saved. WikiProjects and other Wikipedia-space material should often be kept this way, else we lose our own history of how Wikipedia was built. Workpages and their edit history provide the records of good work done by many editors, keeping them retains our/their ability to document what they did and credit them. So, Liz, if you come across other workpages not being used, don't think they must be deleted. --doncram 05:30, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

I've since deprecated a lot of stuff with Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Templates/Deprecated. ResMar 12:05, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

Internal discussion (2)[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
This is unproductive. ResMar 05:17, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

  • The part Ladies, don't write off the young guys – it can work. - That was Oprah who said it. I take her word for it. --Hafspajen (talk) 07:03, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

.Hey Haf, sorry for reverting you but I thought it would be best to keep it out while we're talking. In my view, and the view of a woman I asked for comment, the last sentence is pretty sexist. While I'm very sure that it was unintentional (really, I can't stress enough that I'm not blaming or mad at you or anything like that), I don't feel that it should be in a description. Is that alright? Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 13:20, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Then I simply have to say, I do not agree. Which part of the :Their marriage was a happy one. Some say this kind of thing never works out. Reality says otherwise. Ladies, don't write off the young guys – it can work. - is sexist? It was maybe a joke, but part of it was serious. I am going to reinstate either way the: Their marriage was a happy one. Some say this kind of thing never works out. Reality says otherwise. -
Can't find ANYTHING offensive with this. Not a word, not one single word of it. About the part Ladies, don't write off the young guys – it can work... - I don't find it sexist at all. I what what is this sexist? ON THE CONTRARY: In this world where people only look for women who are young, beautiful and all guys try to find YOUNG women, who are willing to look up to them because they are like ten years older and so called wiser and measures their value in youth and beauty - our friend Sheikh Mijwal al-Musrab stands out as a shining star. It is a man who married a woman twenty years older than him and made her happy. Excellent. Just wonderful. Every woman, every feminist, every person who cares about a woman should applaud this. It is a man who cared for a woman for what she was, and have seen her with his hart and not with his eyes. And succeeded to won her heart, above all stupid barons, all kings, a princes, a colonels, and counts who never succeed to keep her for long, because she left them. That was no woman who knew nothing about men, I can promise you. I now reinstate the part: Their marriage was a happy one. Some say this kind of thing never works out. Reality says otherwise.' Hafspajen (talk) 18:02, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Sexism or gender discrimination is prejudice or discrimination based on a person's sex or gender. The above is not. Hafspajen (talk) 18:07, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

I move this discussion to Signpost talk. And if you remove this once more I remove all the enrty and leave nothing but: Jane Digby (created by William Charles Ross, nominated by Alborzagros ) This miniature by the artist William Charles Ross portrays the fascinating Jane Digby. - That is what I have to say. Hafspajen (talk) 17:32, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

For one thing, it used the patronizing word "girls" instead of "ladies" before I changed it. The Signpost was two days late waiting for FC and we had to make a last minute call late in the evening our time on Friday, and that was the decision we made. We appreciate and value the time all of you take to create FC as it is an important part of the Signpost, but when it is significantly late we have to sacrifice our time at odd hours as well, and we have to make decisions like this without the luxury of being able to discuss them with you before publication. We are willing to discuss editorial decisions with you in private or in public, but delivering public ultimatums is not professional or appropriate. Gamaliel (talk) 18:00, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Hi Hafspajen, last night while we were in the process of publishing, we noticed that the summary in question could be perceived differently than we know you intended it. After asking for some input from others, we decided it would be best to pare the summary as we did. We certainly do not think you intended it to be "sexist", but as perception is reality, we needed to guard against it being perceived that way. Thanks for understanding. Go Phightins! 18:47, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
You apparently tell me that you didn't afforded the 'luxury of being able to discuss them with ME before publication. But you decided to discuss it among yourselves. Now answer me just one question: Do you, Gamaliel, Ed and the guys deciding this - DO you know if I am a man or a woman? Please answer the question with a simple yes or no. Hafspajen (talk) 19:26, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

go ahead. Hafspajen (talk) 19:27, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

We were all online publishing the Signpost at the same time. The bot is down we had to publish manually, which is laborious and time-consuming, so thankfully others were there to assist me, and we collaborated via a Skype chat. In the process of publishing, someone brought up the passage in question. I have no idea what your gender is and it is irrelevant to the discussion at hand. At the time we did not know or discuss who contributed the language in question (which would have required searching the edit history, something we did not do) so it would not have mattered if any of us knew your gender. Our concerns were not with you, your gender, your thoughts, or your intentions, only the language used. We believe your intentions were positive and not negative. Gamaliel (talk) 19:41, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • You didn't answered the above question. It is not irrelevant in a discussion about being accused of sexism. Not a bit. It is the core of the question. If you don't know - than you all made the sexist assumption that I am a man making derogatory comments against woman.
  • If I am a woman, in that case you three are now forcing me to step up and disclose my gender, to defend myself. Because in that case I can't be making sexist remarks, can I?
  • If I am a man - than I must defend myself as I did above.
  • Wrong in all ways. Either ways - do you wish that I should here and now disclose my gender? If you do, I will. Hafspajen (talk) 19:58, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • @Hafspajen: No, I most certainly made no assumptions about your gender. What I saw was language that could potentially be construed as sexist, something we've been accused of missing, and decided to play it safe. Your gender is, to me, immaterial. Best, Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 20:14, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

  • No, it is not immaterial. Because if a woman wrote the above - it is not sexist. If a man did it, it is. Hafspajen (talk) 20:19, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • No one has accused anyone of sexism. We do not think you are sexist. We disagreed with your choice of language, that is all. At the time we made the decision to change the language, we did not know or care about the gender or identity of the author. You don't have to be sexist to accidentally make a mistake that someone perceives as sexist. Gamaliel (talk) 20:25, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • What Gamaliel said. Someone I trust told me that she thought it was sexist, so I took it off, thinking it was an uncontroversial editorial choice that still had an enormously interesting blurb (that's a lot of affairs!). Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 20:52, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

  • How am I supposed to interpret the words (posted on my talk) : Hey Haf, sorry for reverting you but I thought it would be best to keep it out while we're talking. In my view, and the view of a woman I asked for comment, the last sentence is pretty sexist. If you don't think I am sexist, don't say so. Hafspajen (talk) 20:58, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

(edit conflict) *Firstly, let me thank Hafspajen for all the work undertaken - I'm sure that was also "laborious and time consuming". Please explain how the comment can be perceived to be "sexist" and by whom? As a British female I just cannot see it. SagaciousPhil - Chat 20:29, 21 March 2015 (UTC) And it does come across as Hafspajen being accused as being sexist. SagaciousPhil - Chat 20:32, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

No doubt it was difficult and time-consuming for them, and I have repeatedly praised Hafspajen and others who put together FC for their hard work. Why do you find it so difficult to believe someone would perceive something in FC that wasn't intended by the author? After all, right now you are perceiving an accusation of sexism where there is clearly none. Gamaliel (talk) 20:41, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Well, I beg to differ - and I find your comment and tone unbecoming of an Admin. I'm withdrawing from any further participation in this "discussion", it just reminds me of the way certain areas of SignPost are being used. SagaciousPhil - Chat 20:46, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Well... that's a pretty low bar for being unbecoming of an administrator, no? We're trying to maneuver to protect the Signpost from undue accusations, that's all. Clearly the FC team puts in an enormous amount of work each week, and everyone else—especially content contributors—appreciates that. Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 20:52, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Ask AGAIN: How am I supposed to interpret the words (posted on my talk) : Hey Haf, sorry for reverting you but I thought it would be best to keep it out while we're talking. In my view, and the view of a woman I asked for comment, the last sentence is pretty sexist. If you don't think I am sexist, don't say so. Hafspajen (talk) 20:58, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • She said the sentence was sexist, not its author. That is not the same thing. Gamaliel (talk) 21:01, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • (edit conflict) The sentence was sexist. Not you. I am have written sexist sentences without being a sexist person. These things happen even when we don't intend to. Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 21:03, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Näää. Tell me then how the sentence was sexist. And also who is SHE who said She said the sentence was sexist, not its author, may I ask. Hafspajen (talk) 21:08, 21 March 2015 (UTC)Difficult not to perceive it as such, if someone tell you you write sexist things .
  • Just tell me then how the sentence was sexist. And point me to that discussion you had can't notice any discussion about the topic anywhere, not newsroom or any talkpage. Hafspajen (talk) 21:11, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Was it: Older woman-young guy – it can work? Hafspajen (talk) 21:13, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Was it: Their marriage was happy? Hafspajen (talk) 21:13, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Some say this kind of thing never works out. Reality says otherwise? Hafspajen (talk) 21:14, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • We asked two women about the passage in question. We are not going to divulge their identities without their permission. Gamaliel (talk) 21:14, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • (edit conflict) The use of "girls," which has commonly been used as a demeaning term, and the whole concept of demanding that ladies consider younger men for their marriage possibilities. I'm not going to name who gave me the opinion—it would have a chilling effect. This she read the sentence without any context (read: knowing who authored it) and gave an opinion. That's all. Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 21:15, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Nobody is answering my question (girls were removed when you removed the bit already, and and yes Ladies were an improvement, thank you Gamaliel) :

Was it: Older woman-young guy – it can work? Hafspajen (talk) 21:13, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

− −

Was it: Their marriage was happy? Hafspajen (talk) 21:13, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Was it:Some say this kind of thing never works out. Reality says otherwise? Hafspajen (talk) 21:14, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

− −

YOU can answer it without ever telling me who said it. Hafspajen (talk) 21:18, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
And the context was: Sheikh Mijwal al-Musrab was a man who married a woman twenty years older than him and made her happy. She was forty-six, and he was twenty-six. He was a man who cared for a woman for what she was, and have seen her with his hart and not with his eyes. And succeeded to won her heart, above all barons, all kings, a princes, a colonels, and counts who never succeeded to keep her for long, because she left them all and : Their marriage was a happy one. Some say this kind of thing never works out. Reality says otherwise - Hafspajen (talk) 21:22, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
I didn't think it made as much sense without the following context. That said, I probably could have left the "happy" sentence. Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 22:17, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
  • May I? I think its sexism is marginal (for clarity's sake, this is what we're talking about, I believe), but if I were running the show I wouldn't print it either. Sorry Hafs. Oprah said this? If she did, it was for a very different audience than the Signpost. Besides what I think is marginal sexism, there's tone (but perhaps I'm too formal) and content: it suggests that women always marry men. But yes, "Their marriage was a happy one" could have been left. But let's please realize that "sentence A is sexist" is indeed dependent on context etc., and that no one is accusing no one of being a sexist. Drmies (talk) 22:23, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Women who are forty-six, together with a guy who is twenty-six are often harassed by society and are indeed regularly facing people making derogatory comments against the woman, yes, sexist comments from all the others. Oprah said this, yes - when making a program about women living happily together with younger men. Married, living in serious relationships. AND we also made a lot jokes in the Singpost - before. And some women do marry men, the above example was about a man and a woman, and just how are we supposed to bring in same-sex marriage into it? And before anyone starts that part - I am not against that either. The Swedish church do allow gay marriages. And has woman priests to. All priest-candidates are regularly asked before getting into the program :Do you have anything against to perform blessing or joining together in marriage a gay couple - and if you say, I am against, you are out. Hafspajen (talk) 22:58, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
May I add a few comments? I think this discussion is actually about several different things, and they've all gotten tangled. Regardless of what one thinks of the quote, Hafs has told me that s/he was up all night working on the Signpost - that is, actively editing on WP. If the editors working on the Signpost is indeed a team, it would have been courteous to ask Hafs what s/he thought before removing the quote. Not asking Hafs may have made him/her feel as if s/he were not an equal member of the team. Also, this is the second time in the last few weeks that I've seen hurt feelings and misunderstanding arise out of a rush to get Signpost ready for publication in a very short time. Isn't there any way to work ahead a bit so that there is a little more time for discussion before publication? CorinneSD (talk) 00:44, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
Agree with the above comment. It was told, somewhere above: After asking for some input from others, we decided it would be best to pare the summary as we did. I agree, why wasn't anyone asking me? I was spending my Saturday that in fact I intended to spend a very diffent way, by editing the Singpost. Circa eight- nine-ten something hours. I was up until dawn, fixing this one and putting up the next draft, all night. Here next issue. I could have told you the story THEN; instead of NOW, publicly, as you stated above. And about the rest (not this issue) why - well, my theory is total lack of communication. Nobody knows what the others do or intend to do. Hafspajen (talk) 01:51, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • I thought we were working as a team. I was actively editing all night, so you could have contacted me. I feel it would have been more courteous to ask me before removing the quote than to remove it first and let me find out after publication. Regarding the quote, I do not understand how it can be perceived as sexist. Could somebody please explain to me exactly what in the quote is sexist, and why? Hafspajen (talk) 02:34, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Haf, we can't monitor everything that is added while it is being added. We published only minutes after you finished! We're going to start a dialogue this week to get our houses in order (with regards to communication), and I'm very hopeful that Resident Mario will be able to code a bot to significantly lessen the manual labor you all have to to. As for the sexism, Drmies explains it well above. I'd add that "ladies" and "girls" are words that should be used cautiously. Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 03:16, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
@The ed17: I wouldn't wait for a bot with bated breath, unfortunately the problem looks to be more complex than I initially imagined. Did you know that WP:GO is also updated manually? Since 2004? Wow! Nonetheless I'll look into at the end of this month. ResMar 03:28, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
I mean, I did know, but being clueless in these matters, I did not know would affect the construction of a bot. :-p Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 03:33, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

The above discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.


Statement of facts:

  • The content of an article being written is at the discretion of the writer.
  • The content of articles to be published is ultimately at the discretion of the editor(s)-in-chief.
  • When making significant changes or removals editor(s)-in-chief ought to speak with the writer as part of due process.
  • When this is with regards to material added on-deadline or past-deadline, however, prior consent is not always possible.
  • The removal in this case was minor and in no way impacted the general palatability of the article.
  • Continuing to argue over it will get us nowhere.

If we wish to argue about the issue of communication within the Signpost we can commence it here. ResMar 05:18, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

cf. Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Coordination. ResMar 05:19, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Don't count on me. I agree with the part: The content of an article being written is at the discretion of the writer. The rest - no. Dead-lines occur all the time. If this is not a democratic process, but an announcement about that discussion forbidden, when it takes two seconds to leave a message - I can't agree. On Wikipedia where even admins actions can be discussed, and if editors are not respected but commanded as in the army - no. It was fun, until it lasted. I removed myself from the regular editors. And, a last minor point - nobody did answered the question. Still. The only thing someone told me was that an unknown woman thought it was sexist, without even knowing the context. And who knows, maybe I am a woman myself. If this is true you are loosing the one woman editor you had. Maybe it is true. Maybe it is not true. One never knows. Hafspajen (talk) 12:38, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Haf, just the appearance of sexism—even in passing, and even if only through a quick reading, not a close examination—is undesirable in a community that has a 10–90 gender split and at a time when males have had almost all of the social and economic power in society for a looooong time. Could you be a little flexible on this? I like the humorous vein of FC. Is that your doing? Tony (talk) 12:58, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Partly, yes. Hafspajen (talk) 18:41, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
With regards to sexism, who the hell cares. With regards to communication, we're an online newspaper, we don't do things the same way the rest of the Wikipedia publication does things. It's not that these things can't or shouldn't be discussed, it's that at the end of the day the editor(s)-in-chief have final say. ResMar 16:00, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • In this case, it wasn't even that we wanted the final say, we just didn't know that this change would be so controversial. We would have gladly engaged in a discussion of this change if we knew it would be so objectionable and if there was time before publication. We are, of course, willing to engage in that discussion now, as we have been for the last two days. Gamaliel (talk) 18:59, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • If it was taken so seriously that the the whole bit was cut, then it's serious enough that it should be able to explain it to me when I asked. I never got any strait answer, the issue was dismissed. If you are so afraid that someone *may* read sexism into something, then that is kind of makes my case. And if me - who possible, who knows - could even be a woman - or not - but if -and didn't thought it was sexist, probably it was not that sexist at all. Hafspajen (talk) 18:41, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • The issue was not dismissed; User:The ed17 and I spent a great deal of time yesterday discussing this issue with you. If you still have concerns, we are still willing to discuss this matter with you. User:Go Phightins! will also be contacting everyone involved with FC soon to see what we can do to improve the production of that section. Gamaliel (talk) 18:55, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Well, in that case if you are still listening to me: in my view this sentence was all about the woman having agency. I was recommending women to consider *choosing* young men or at least to *listen to* and *look at* them. The whole point of my sentence was - women *choose*. Most people find it very hard to think of a woman having agency - in their minds the woman gets mobbed by lots of men and the most she gets to do is decide how many times to say no. If you are used to thinking of the man as always doing the asking and not thinking about what the woman might want, maybe you could miss that that's what I *wrote* was chosing - a choice - one's independent capability or ability to act on one's will. For what it's worth, that is what I meant. Hafspajen (talk) 19:31, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
  • @Hafspajen: User:Go Phightins! is attempting to contact you to discuss this incident. Would you please email him? He cannot email you since you do not have email enabled on your Wikipedia account. Thank you. Gamaliel (talk) 20:20, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
There may be movement soon on getting FC set-up botted, but it'll take a while for the code to come together. ResMar 14:01, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
  • I think the whole damned thing is a tempest in a teapot, but here's my opinion anyways. First, AFAIK the general condemnation of the word "girls" is a predominantly American phenomenon (though if I'm mistaken, do be sure to let me know), and thus part of this is quite likely a cultural misunderstanding. (And last I checked, the word was being reclaimed by some circles, such as Riot grrrl, though I doubt it's that mainstream yet)
Second, if our benchmark is "may possibly be construed as sexist", that's way too low: even asking a woman the simple question "When are you getting married?" could be construed as enforcing gender roles by saying that a woman must be wed. "Single Ladies (Put a Ring on It)", by the same standard, could be understood as a sexist song. Yes, we have to draw a line, but "may be construed as (racist/sexist/homophobic/etc.)" is probably not it. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:10, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

April Fool??[edit]

I completely disagree with the vulgar comments made by Adam in this week's FC. Wikipedia is not censored, but does it mean that you can say of scro*** of John Murray, 4th Earl of Dunmore and the like. -The Herald the joy of the LORDmy strength 16:16, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

You... do realize that the content itself regularly includes painted nudes and the like, right? Hell, this very week includes Sardines (Inside No. 9), which is far worse than anything in the issue in that respect. Adam Cuerden (talk) 16:38, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
I am well aware of it Adam and have supported many paintings in FPC. But what is related to the Hafnium and Earl pictures? You can comment on the others of the kind which reveals the nudity, not on the completely unrelated ones. I again say..I DISAGREE...-The Herald the joy of the LORDmy strength 16:51, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
As a possible compromise, could we maybe allude to it instead of mentioning it outright? Gamaliel (talk) 17:16, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
Even Wikitionary says so, which ought to be good. But with signpost, I will say as Gamaliel had it, allusion...-The Herald the joy of the LORDmy strength 17:19, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
It doesn't work as a joke - sporran scrotum are similar - if we don't use the word. Adam Cuerden (talk) 20:06, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
Well. I don't see it as a problematic word, but I'm also not a large fan of gendered jokes. In any case, you may find it funnier to run with the very concept of a kilt, which is silly enough (in American culture, at least). Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 20:12, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
I live in Scotland. Wordplay's one thing.. Adam Cuerden (talk) 20:33, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
People on the streets of Edinburgh
Gosh, took me a while to got it. Um, saying to a Scottish that kilts are "silly", it's the same as saying saying to an American that the Statue of Liberty is silly, or to an Indian that Ghandi had a silly outfit. I am fine now, if puts me back on the redaction list I will edit again, and well, Hafnium as a sex- toy ... Face-grin.svg ..ahem .. well. Huh. You know. Hafspajen (talk) 12:59, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
  • At the Wedding of Frederik, Crown Prince of Denmark, and Mary Donaldson, of the Danish prince, the future Danish king, the relatives of the bride, Mary McDonald were all wearing the McDonald clan's kilt at the wedding, when the guests from the bride's side were filmed there was an endless row of guys entering the reception and all guys were in kilts, actually. check out Mary's dad leading the bride in the church dressed in kilt- It is considered a serious full dress. Something the Scottish are very proud of. When the Danish Queen raised and held her speech at the wedding, saying she is welcoming the family of Mary into the Danish Royal family, Mary's dad held the next speech, in kilt, and said he is now welcoming in turn the Danish Royal Family into the members of the McDonald clan ... it is a serious thing, this, you know. Hafspajen (talk) 13:15, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

No traffic report this week?[edit]

I mean, it's done, it's right there. Serendipodous 15:43, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

We'll be running a non-April Fool's issue this evening with ITM, traffic report, and news. Gamaliel (talk) 15:52, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
@Serendipodous: I put a note in the newsroom and pinged Milowent elsewhere, but I should have pinged you as well. My apologies. Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 16:27, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Serendipodous, thanks for catching. milo_went at is best email to reach me if anything urgent ever comes up. thanks.--Milowenthasspoken 16:53, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

Double and triple delivery[edit]

Hi subscribers, if you've come here to ask why the Signpost was delivered two to three times in the last three hours, we're as mystified as you are. I've left a question at Wikipedia talk:Mass message senders#Multiple sends. Best, Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 07:28, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

SVGs used on content guidance page[edit]

The SVG images used in Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Content guidance should be redone to sync the names with the rows in the graphics. The way they are being done now relies entirely on users' font settings not being very different from those of the editor who added (or last changed) these images. In my browser, the last names are slightly off in the editor-in-chief image and completely off in the regular-features image. Alternative images containing the names exist at File:Signpost Head Editor Timeline.svg and File:Signpost Articles Timeline.svg, but I suppose the font was judged too small to be readable. In that case, perhaps the SVGs with names could be simply converted to PNGs and the names replaced with larger versions. - dcljr (talk) 01:15, 5 April 2015 (UTC)

@Dcljr: I'm afraid I wasn't aware of this issue. The reason I implemented it this way is that it's more useful for readers for me to be able to hyperlink references and names and section names. I tested it on two different platforms, Mac and Windows, and didn't discover issues. Since this appears to be an issue with personal fontage preferences, which to be honest, can and will mess up almost any sufficiently intricate design, I've gone and forced conformance with what my default settings be default. How does it look from your end now? This sort of thing is used in-wiki at times: see for instance {{clade}}. If it still doesn't work right I'll poke around at the village pump. ResMar 03:16, 5 April 2015 (UTC)
Despite my great dislike of hardcoded font settings, I have to admit it seems to be necessary in this case. Works for me now. - dcljr (talk) 03:33, 5 April 2015 (UTC)


The RSS version seems to be broken. Please, fix.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); April 10, 2015; 14:42 (UTC)

@Ezhiki: I sent Yuvipanda a message. ResMar 15:52, 10 April 2015 (UTC)
Thanks; appreciated. I wasn't sure if there was anyone who I could bug directly. Cheers,—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); April 10, 2015; 15:59 (UTC)
Might as well @YuviPanda (WMF) and Yuvipanda: too. ResMar 18:13, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Single page view link in mailing lists[edit]

Hi. In the last couple of issues, in the mailing list version, the link for the "Single page view" has been broken because of a missing underscore: -- However, I can't figure out how that even got there, given that the automated output (Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Coordination#Mailing list output for this issue) just links to the redirect...?? (fwiw, I do appreciate having the exact-issue link, instead of the redirect, for when I occasionally get backlogged and want to read back-issues.) Hope that helps! Quiddity (talk) 16:57, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

@Quiddity: It's a known issue. Jarry wrote the automated tool back when and hasn't updated it to fix this issue. ResMar 21:16, 11 April 2015 (UTC)


Did I spotted a disruption in the signpost at featured content portal? -The Herald the joy of the LORDmy strength 17:14, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Banner has been returned to the page, with noinclude this time to fix the erroneous transclusion. ResMar 17:34, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

And is it still our editor emeritus doing this? Is there, then, something wrong with bot's summary or is it ed himself initiating it? -The Herald the joy of the LORDmy strength 18:57, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

No, Gamaliel published this week. The bot is not maintained so the message has not been updated to reflect that. ResMar 20:21, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Single page version is broken[edit]

The newly posted single page version is broken. Can someone who knows how to set it up please have a look: I see red links and a template loop error. Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single is not much better.--JohnBlackburnewordsdeeds 22:48, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

OK, both seem fixed now (though I had to purge Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single for it to pick up whatever had been changed). Thanks to whoever saw to it.--JohnBlackburnewordsdeeds 23:57, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
We frequently find we have to purge the cache for the same reason. Something to do with the publishing bot, I think. Gamaliel (talk) 23:58, 23 April 2015 (UTC)