Talk:Irrational Games

Deep Cover

I created the link for "Deep Cover (Game)" but I can't create the page because of restrictions. If someone does create the page, you should consider using pictures from this link - [1]. The link is good as of March 18, 2006 & contains probably the most pictures anyone is ever going to see of this long-since cancelled game.

Also, this is a link where someone briefly talks about both Deep Cover & The Lost - [2]. Enjoy. -68.118.192.39 14:50, 18 March 2006 (UTC)-

A mistake

Boston and Canberra studios are co-creating BioShock—Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.109.48.17 (talk • contribs)

I recall Ken Levine saying that somewhere, but can't remember whether it was in an interview or a forum post.--Drat (Talk) 13:00, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

While it is true that Canberra studio is contributing to BioShock, they are also working on an unanounced title of their own.58.169.31.119 03:22, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Article name

Should this article be either split into 2, or moved into 2K Games article? The teams are now part of a larger company and are separate entities. --86.155.20.51 20:30, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

I also think the two should be split.Gamerzworld 20:33, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

I don't think its worth being split, it would just create 2 stubs even smaller than the current one as there is so little information. X360 10:32, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

The article should neither be split nor merged with 2K. Nothing has actually changed aside from the name. -144.138.89.155 16:11, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

2K Australia vs 2K Boston vs Irrational Games

This article states Irrational Games was briefly known as 2K Boston and 2K Australia, but Irrational Games is now JUST the boston developers. The Australia developers are still 2K Australia. [3] 65.112.20.22 (talk) 18:17, 18 February 2010 (UTC)

Seeing as how the boston developer is named Irrational Games, The canberra developer is named 2K Australia, and Ken Levine has stated they are working on seperate projects, it might be a good idea to turn this page into "Irrational Games, LLC", with a new "Irrational Games" page seperate from a new "2K Australia" page which can both refer to "Irrational Games, LLC" for information about the studios pre-buyout. [4] 76.24.118.33 (talk) 12:48, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

I've clarified this article and the 2K Marin article in the wake of 2K Australia not being renamed back to Irrational, and then being merged into 2K Marin instead, based on the above article plus [5]. Better? Crispy (talk) 11:55, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

Reopened?

So according to this: http://irrationalgames.com/studio/careers/ Irrational are hiring again. Does this mean that the studio has been subject to some strange necromancy and we can safely say that it's no longer defunct and is instead functioning as some slimmed down entity or something? I know conjecture isn't our business, but defunct businesses typically don't hire programmers and IT personnel. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.184.99.85 (talk) 20:14, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

I agree with this. You can check their website for an IT Manager, and a Senior AI Programmer position as of January 2015. I've edited the lede from 'was' to 'is' as you don't hire Gameplay AI programmers if you don't plan on making a game. This information can be supported by plenty of verifiable news blogs as well. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tehdef (talk • contribs) 17:12, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

They (Irrational Games team) are closed. But, Take-Two didn't delete the studio website. Unlikely 2K Australia and 2K China. Tanisho4Real (talk) 12:27, 14 April 2016 (UTC)

No, really, they're not defunct

See here: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-12-11-irrational-games-hiring-board-hints-at-narrative-based-open-world-fps — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.228.32.79 (talk) 21:09, 11 December 2015 (UTC)

Are they really still under T2/2K?

I can't find any info on that Blackbird256 (talk) 10:52, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

Levine has been quoted that T2 led him to keep his reduced-size IG under T2 rather than start up anew in one of the refs in this article. Also, T2 filed a trademark on Ghost Story about 5 months ago, And if all it was was a change of name, then they would still be a T2 company. There is a chance they aren't but nothing right now suggests otherwise. --MASEM (t) 14:32, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

I see. Thanks! Blackbird256 (talk) 15:15, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

Separate pages for Ghost Story and Irrational Games?

Irrational games shut down in 2014. Ghost Story is a new company founded by ex members of Irrational. Some websites have reported this as a rebrand/restructure but that does not seem to be accurate to how this is seen internally. From the FAQ on the Ghost Story website: "The Irrational Games studio was closed in 2014.", "The studio was founded by a group of former Irrational Games developers," "As a new studio we are excited to be working on our maiden game!"

The two developers should have separate pages in the same manner as Looking Glass Studios was a separate article to Irrational.

References

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Arials101 (talk • contribs) 12:16, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

It's unfortunately vague exactly what happened, and we really go by business entity aspects. From that angle, the business division never closed down (the 15 there pulled salary, and they were hiring; you can't do that in a void) and remained in TakeTwo, and yesterday was just putting their division back on the map as the same business division of Take Two but under the new name. From Levine's game development angle, they absolutely did "close down" Irrational, and the FAQ for Ghost Story strongly implies they want to have their story appear different from Irrational. And then you have their official announcement tweet: [6] which blurs the issue more. We need more clarity to what the business nature happened, and if it does prove out that GSG is a completely new business entity than IG, then we definitely should split off them. --MASEM (t) 14:30, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

And this article from Gamasutra [7] confirms my idea what's going on: "Although technically a rebrand, Ghost Story is for all intents and purposes a new studio, with the majority of the Irrational team having moved on back in 2014 when Levine chose to downsize and restructure following the launch of BioShock Infinite." I do think it is fair to consider if we should separate IG from GSG, even though the business aspect did not chance. --MASEM (t) 14:42, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

• IG is a historical entity at this point and it's too early to tell how much history GS will share with it. I'd leave the article as IG and incubate GSG separately.  czar 17:08, 24 February 2017 (UTC)
  • If we do this (and I am not against it, I'm thinking more tech details), would we then say "IG was..." or "IG is..."? Clearly GSG gets linked in this conceptual IG article. --MASEM (t) 01:16, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

    I would use past tense and then explain the continuity of the business aspects czar 05:25, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

    • Makes sense and the more I think about it, the better it would be to treat IG and GSG as different entities. Baring any opposes, I will work to split these out tomorrow. --MASEM (t) 23:16, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

• I have done the split and there's probably more cleanup, but one thing is that the Talk:Irrational Games ended up as a redirect to Talk:Ghost Story Games, which I think is fine since I think there will be articles that affect both, and makes one place to talk about. If this is considred a problem, I can do the necessary moves to fix that. --MASEM (t) 17:35, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

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Location

The article currently claims that GSG is located in Westwood, MA, and the website also lists (though also just) a PO box address in that location. However, according to the company filing, it is located in Quincy, MA. Are there any additional sources on the matter? Lordtobi (✉) 21:35, 21 September 2017 (UTC)

If the filing has that, please use that. I think Westwood was where IG was HQ'd, so it would have seen natural for GSG to maintain that HQ, but if they say they founded in Quincy, then use that. --MASEM (t) 21:52, 21 September 2017 (UTC)

Parent editwar

@Shafj00 and Lordtobi: Please stop edit warring and discuss. Present sourcing as to whether GSG is organized under Take Two directly, or under 2K games. GSG is not a new corporate entity, so it likely matches how Irrational was. Legal documents should be able to show this. -- ferret (talk) 18:20, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

I'll point to the section above, where Levine specifically talks about how Take Two/2K said that they'd offer him to keep the subsidary division under them. The one like that Shafj00 is focusing on "self-publishing" in the GSG FAQ cannot be taken to mean they are independent from TT/2K at all, only that they will publish their own games. Doesn't change the business relationship they have with TT/2K has. --Masem (t) 19:08, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

I concur with Masem above, the company was simply renamed and received a new logo, it is still the same legal entity, so the corporate structure will not have changed. I'll note, though, that legal filings are rarely a help in such things, as Take-Two-owned companies usually only list Take-Two personnel in their filings, not the manager of the direct parent company or the studio's own management (cf. Rockstar's studios' legalities). Lordtobi (✉) 19:15, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

Re: Direct parent

I've been thinking about this a bit, and although the lines are still blurred, I think 2K should not be put as immediate parent unless we have to sourcing to back this up (because currently, we do for neither parent). First of all, when Irrational started restructuring, Levine stated that he wished to start a "smaller, more entrepreneurial endeavor at Take-Two" (emphasis mine). When the rebranding came about, Ghost Story made the appearance as if it was a completely new foundation, rather than a rebranding.

Previously, it has been stated that, because the company (the legal entitiy also) has "just" been rebranded, 2K would still be the legal parent, however, Take2's legal subsidiaries are of a flat hierachy, with all being on the same level under Take2 as Rockstar, 2K and others are (see Take2 annual report subsidiary listings). Irrational was previously a subsidiary-by-management to 2K, but this does not seem to be the case anymore. 2K also does not list GSG's job offerings.[8] This would add up to the absence of any 2K branding on GSG's website, the absence of GSG's logo on 2K's website and the rather weak "self-publishing" claim (although the studio is yet to publish a game). Regards. Lordtobi (✉) 23:36, 25 December 2018 (UTC)

Source

• https://web.archive.org/web/20001215053200/http://www.voodooextreme.com/article.taf?articleID=73