Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games

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Review Thread Epsilon: Greek Letter version[edit]

Since the old one up top has reached the top and is getting a little stale (been out for at least a month), I decided to start number five down here. The review thread is turning into a helpful trend, spurring on the completion of FACs and making GANs more noticeable. While a lot of the stuff here will be carried over from upstairs, it will be a more up-to-date version, with a new GA added and a passed GA removed.

  • FAC:
  • Lightning (Final Fantasy) has been nominated since October 6. It has three supports, a passed image review and a completed source review.
  • Please could someone give this the last review it needs? I really don't want this to go down the drain after so much hard work. --ProtoDrake (talk) 10:03, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I'd add that the article's already in great shape, so the final reviewer won't have much work to do. It's been up for well over a month—whoever's free, please don't shaft ProtoDrake by making him go through FAC again. JimmyBlackwing (talk) 22:42, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
  • Three supports is officially enough. The problem - which I discovered and have since solved with Underground - is that there are no supports from people uninvolved with video game articles. (I suspect my involvement in the recent FACs of Luo Yixiu and American paddlefish was part of that threshold.) Try asking around elsewhere. Tezero (talk) 23:07, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
The source review has been done, and apparently it's alright, I just need to wait for the article to pass or fail. --ProtoDrake (talk) 16:57, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
  • Sega Saturn has been nominated since November 16. It has a few comments and one oppose concerning excessive citations.
  • Freedom Planet has been nominated since November 19. It has no comments.
  • GAN:
  • Peer review:
  • Jumping Flash! has been nominated since November 13. It has no comments.

I may have done completely the wrong thing in creating this fifth review thread, but I thought it was the right thing to do. Usual begging threads below and anyone can update this at need. To start, I have two GAs and a lingering FAC. If anyone is willing to tackle any of them, I would be willing to help in some way with one of their projects. --ProtoDrake (talk) 15:58, 11 November 2014 (UTC)

In that case, a few more comments for Freedom Planet would be nice. I was going to nominate Amy Rose as my next FAC, but that's becoming increasingly unstable due to the three Sonic Boom works. For this one, I'll be rewriting the Reception section at some point but have no other plans. Tezero (talk) 16:40, 11 November 2014 (UTC)
Yeah, that's probably a good idea. Between her new character iteration happening, the Boom games potentially coming under fire for being bad, and how feminism/damsel in distress type characters being such a hot-button topic these days, I bet she'll be receiving a lot more coverage soon... Sergecross73 msg me 16:48, 11 November 2014 (UTC)
Second round of comments added for Freedom Planet. Any other users who wish to comment should please do so. --ProtoDrake (talk) 17:00, 11 November 2014 (UTC)
Never mind; it's at FAC now. Comments still appreciated, though! :D Tezero (talk) 19:19, 19 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I would like to point out that Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Requests also has potential articles that can be reviewed to see if they are notable enough for the site. We only have two items left before we're officially done with the year 2011. GamerPro64 21:12, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
  • This is a bit of a dry season for FACs, it seems. If anyone's got a GA they're fairly comfortable with and that didn't just barely slide by on comprehensiveness, now's as good a time as any. Tezero (talk) 19:19, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Article by Game Informer about its editors' favourite soundtracks[edit]

I figured this might be some nice reception, especially for games that might not discuss soundtrack much, or might even help with soundtrack articles. Soundtracks mentioned include:

[1] — Preceding unsigned comment added by ‎209.169.219.170 (talkcontribs) 21:15, 11 November 2014‎

The National Museum of Play[edit]

I have a call with the director of The National Museum of Play tomorrow. I contacted him a while ago about getting access to rare magazines but the idea is also to kindle a partnership, see how we might be able to work together. If anyone wants me to ask about anything in specific, let me know? czar  06:06, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

I don't have any specific questions, but please let us know how that goes. It would be neat to get ahold of sources that would help in expanding games from the 90's, there's plenty of Genesis/N64 era games I'd expand if I had access to more sources, for instance... Sergecross73 msg me 15:01, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
@Sergecross73, let me know if there are specific games/mags you're looking for—might be good to have some ideas for a pilot czar  16:45, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Czar - Sega platformers like Ristar, Bubsy and Earthworm Jim-related articles are all ones that I feel I've taken about as far as I can with what sources are available. I work a lot on Nintendo platformers, and Sonic related ones too, but they've been re-released and remade so many times in modern times that it's generally easy to dig up stuff on them. Virtual Boy games would be interesting too, if there's anything interesting there... Sergecross73 msg me 18:28, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Czar I'm trying to do a units sold column in the List of home video game consoles. If you can get numbers for the earlier generation consoles that'd be great.GeneticOS (talk) 23:41, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
  • So a few updates: (1) When we're having trouble finding those rare mag articles in the future, we can use the museum (a.k.a. The Strong) to lookup materials if we have the citation (more exact the better). Let me know if you're into this but the gist is to first search that they have the mag in their library holdings and then to email their staff. We don't want to inundate them though, so yeah let's talk about this if you want more info. I definitely plan to use it so I can write more on pre-90s games. (2) Their collection of 3D materials is also online, if you're interested. Mainly toys. (3) They don't really handle digital stuff, but I'm going to talk to Jason Scott about getting some backup on the number of gaming sites going down and how we can keep archives accessible in the future (it's one thing to have Internet Archive backups for current refs, but another to be able to find new articles in those archives that we haven't used). (4) Depending on the number of scan requests we have, I might apply for a grant to work on other history of play stuff there and scan what we need so the burden isn't on their staff. Perhaps let's keep a list somewhere of low-priority citations we want filled? (5) The search continues for a full run of Famitsu... czar  01:07, 19 November 2014 (UTC)
    • Are there any plans for a large scale digitization/scanning project at the Strong Museum? Maybe with the Internet Archive? If so, arcade trade publications such as Play Meter and RePlay would help fill some gaping holes in our arcade game reception sections. Both magazines are still in publication though, so there's probably some legal involved too. - hahnchen 20:02, 19 November 2014 (UTC)
They don't have the staff for it, but Jason Scott works for the Archive and they continue to add to their scanned mag collection. JS didn't have much to say by way of projects that index reviews or how to handle offlining sites, other than that Archive Team is already on the big ones. Not sure how to help with that. Might be worth asking JS if he has those mags and whether they're on the slate to be uploaded. czar  22:53, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Need a little advice regarding citing a Youtube Takedown notice[edit]

So in an article I'm working on one individual had a youtube video taken down due to a false DMCA claim (the video in question was later reinstated) but the reactions to said takedown are of significance. That said no major websites seem to have covered the takedown, the most we have to confirm it occurred was the individual posting a censored version of the takedown notice and subsequent dismissal from their emails with the private information regarding the claimant censored. Would the proper protocol here be to ask that the emails be forward to wikipedia commons to be used as a source, similar to what we've done for voice acting claims?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 15:14, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

If the reactions to the takedown have received reliable coverage then surely they at some point acknowledge that a takedown happened? Sam Walton (talk) 15:43, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
That's the thing, the mainstream media made no comment on the takedown that I can find, only commentary by sources that would be the equivalent of citing someone's personal blog and screenshots of the emails in question.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 15:49, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
If the mainstream media didn't cover the takedown then there's no reason we should. Some context might help though, I'm having to speak in generalities here. Sam Walton (talk) 15:57, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
More pertinently, I don't see why we'd be able to cite YouTube users' reactions. Random people on YouTube are not reliable sources. Tezero (talk) 16:22, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Well I'm trying to establish a timeline with the origins of GamerGate, and one thing that's been glossed over are the two videos Mr. Baldwin tweeted a response to spawning the hashtag were in turn responses to another video being taken down by a DMCA claim. Said video, posted by youtube user MundaneMatt, was hit by a copyright claim by Quinn according to the emails from youtube. I feel this is significant to paint it less as a one-sided issue, as it shows while the matter did start with Quinn, she played the part of being aggressive in this as well (nobody in the history of the internet has ever responded well to a DMCA).
Really hope that came out right, I'm still trying to read through a lot here at once.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 16:30, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
I rather suspect that using a primary source to achieve 'neutrality' isn't going to go down well at that article and I'd suggest you try to find some third party coverage of this. Sam Walton (talk) 16:36, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

If the mainstream media didn't cover the takedown then there's no reason we should.

This is the answer. Gets even more complicated if the content of the video brings in BLP issues. If the media responded to the takedown, you need only acknowledge that something was taken down. I wouldn't go into any more detail if the media outlets didn't find it important to do so czar  16:44, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
But right now we are, in the current incarnation of the article, mentioning the two video responses to the takedown and Baldwin's twitter post, but ignoring the cause and effect chain that led up to it:
  • Video in question that was taken down then restored: [2]
  • Reaction video by InternetAristocrat stating outright at the beginning he had no plans to post these but DMCA action occurred: [3]
  • Baldwin posts links to videos, spawning GamerGate hashtag: [4]
We're arguing for a neutral tone here, but ignoring the original thing that caused the chain of events seems to imply that Quinn got haymakered out of the blue, changing the tone complete. There has to be a means to ascertain the existence of the claim and time it occurred, because I can't honestly believe in all these years of wikipedia similar hasn't happened.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 16:51, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Quick question, because I really haven't been following the gamergate thing, but aren't there 'timeline' news articles out there which document the whole ordeal from the start? If so, do these not mention it? Sam Walton (talk) 16:55, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
To be honest I have yet to see any, some don't even mention the videos Baldwin link to and several seem to disagree on just how the order of events actually occurred. The New Yorker article even mentions harassment occurring for *18 months* before GamerGate started, but I'm having trouble turning up sources showing that as well or the exact cause for that.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 17:01, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
In that case I'm strengthened in my opinion that saying anything in the article to the effect of "this is how it started, look see here at these videos and notices" constitutes undesirable original research and shouldn't be included. I'd recommend taking this discussion to the talk page for the Gamergate article however. Sam Walton (talk) 17:11, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

I'm honestly wary about taking any discussion to the GamerGate article's talk page for now as the discussions there seem to have broken down. That said I did manage to find a forbes article discussing the matter here: [5]. Not sure if augmenting it further with having a copy of the emails to commons, but I think this should suffice for a sentence referencing the fact. Thank you for the help guys, it's useful to have a zero point to clear one's mind and keep things on the right track.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 17:16, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

AllGame Alert![edit]

Lately I went to the AllGame website here and got this message: "We're sorry to announce that after many years of celebrating the world of video games, AllGame has run out of quarters. The site will be shutting down on Friday December 12th." It seems that AllGame will suffer the same fate as Official Nintendo Magazine, so if there are any AllGame links that need archiving, now's the time to do it before next month! And archiving must be done NOW! --Angeldeb82 (talk) 17:24, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

Here is the listing of all the links there from Wikipedia. Fortunately, we've got a bit more time than for ONM, so the 3002 pages (including talk archives, userpages, etc) should be able to be taken care of. Supernerd11 Firemind ^_^ Pokedex 17:37, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Dang it, not another one. Ah, well, I'll recommend using WebCite rather than the Wayback Machine as it's not subject to the ignominious robots.txt. Tezero (talk) 17:53, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Wow, that sucks, I use that one alot. Is there any reason why all these sites are going out of business? Is this world of infinite little blogs and social media just too much to compete with? Sergecross73 msg me 18:02, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Well, it's okay to archive AllGame links with the Wayback Machine, as long as the AllGame site now allows crawlers. I've archived one AllGame link as an example here. --Angeldeb82 (talk) 18:42, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
I'd recommend putting them all through archive.today as well, and keeping a list of the archive URLs you make in a notepad file. You know, just in the off chance that in 2 years time, the Wikipedia community comes to its senses and gets over the FUD surrounding that website. It's better to maintain security and avoid putting all your eggs in one archival website basket. The blacklist ban for archive.today hasn't been lifted yet, but that doesn't mean it won't be lifted in 2016 if I complain loudly enough. --benlisquareTCE 13:25, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
Oh crap... Well, I guess I'll have to start backing up my featured lists. Just lovely; AllGame has been a fantastic resource and now we have to lose it. Red Phoenix let's talk... 23:51, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
WP will not accept archive.today links (it was a former archive site that caused problems). Stick to webcite. --MASEM (t) 00:06, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
(See Wikipedia:Using archive.today) --MASEM (t) 00:09, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
I wasn't suggesting to use archive.today within Wikipedia articles right now, it can't be used since it's on the blacklist. I was pointing out that if the AllGame website will be shut down, it would make sense to archive its pages on more than just the one archival website, before the pages are all finally lost forever. Can you guarantee me that WebCite will still exist in 5 years time? The long-term prospects of WebCite look uncertain at best. Archive.today might be on the blacklist now, but the blacklist is not carved in stone, and future community discussion might change that; in the prospects that change might occur, it would be of no harm to double-up on archiving any website that will be shut down, so that the same content is duplicated on multiple archival websites—ensuring redundancy prevents permanent information loss.

Wikipedia:Using archive.today is based on Wikipedia:Archive.is RFC which was a flawed community discussion which failed to address multiple issues. Wikipedia:Archive.is RFC 3 was closed on the basis of numbers rather than the validity of arguments. I assure you that I will not be letting the matter to rest, and will bring up the matter again in 6 months time, once everyone has had the time to mature up and get over the non-existant boogeyman fear that's been spread around. There is no reason to be putting all trust in WebCite when it could potentially close down; having multiple archive websites to rely on means that if one shuts down due to funding problems, another one can still be used as fallback. --benlisquareTCE 04:39, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Damn it, this would be so much easier if we could just upload old versions of sites to Wikimedia directly. Tezero (talk) 04:58, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
Or if archive.org didn't retroactively adhere to robots.txt. Sometimes I think we'd be best off by just taking screenshots of the sites and uploading them to imgur/flickr/dropbox. --PresN 07:53, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
Which reminds me- if archive.org hasn't archived something, if you try to find an archive there it will let you archive-on-demand the page like webcite. Just in case you guys didn't all know that. --PresN 07:55, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
Well, if we took screenshots of websites and uploaded them to image hosters, then obviously there's going to be someone who will complain about verifiability since an image can be modified by anyone, and that opens up another can of worms. Presently, we trust websites such as WebCite and archive.org out of good faith, but I don't think the same level of good faith would work for editors in general creating their own captures of webpages. --benlisquareTCE 09:34, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
I'm telling you, please stick to the Wayback Machine at the Internet Archive website. It's much safer this way. Trust me. --Angeldeb82 (talk) 00:13, 19 November 2014 (UTC)
To be clear, I generally only use WebCite when the Wayback Machine isn't an option, like for sites with robots.txt or that are about to get shut down. I'm open to the idea of archiving in multiple places; I was silent to the original suggestion because I thought he was saying that we should simply alternate between archiving sites rather than doubling up, which would increase the chances of some content being lost. Tezero (talk) 00:47, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Permanently archiving videos[edit]

Is there a way to do this? I ask because online videos, especially on YouTube and game review websites, are frequently taken down deliberately or made obsolete by website restructuring, and I'm worried because a few articles I've taken to GA or FA status use videos as sources. Are there any archiving tools that would take care of a video even if the original embedded link goes dead? Tezero (talk) 22:07, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

I know some archiving service (Wayback Machine?) recently made a bunch of Flash versions of old arcade games available, they might also know something about videos. Supernerd11 Firemind ^_^ Pokedex 22:49, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Running With Scissors needs improvement[edit]

Please someone consider overhauling the RWS page to make it more encyclopaedic. I'm way too busy as the moment. Willhesucceed (talk) 17:43, 15 November 2014 (UTC)

Please don't post here asking other people to do something while explicitly stating that you're not going to. It comes across as condescending- that you think our time is worth less than yours. --PresN 17:58, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
Perhaps we could take the attitude that this is simply an important page we should be aware of (though I only know the name from the old parents' adage and the Weird Al album) that ought to be improved. I personally don't care a whit about the Postal series and I've got other projects at the moment, both on and off Wikipedia, but perhaps some of us do. Tezero (talk) 18:07, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
I certainly understand PresN's sentiment though. At any point there's a million articles that need cleanup. It's a little careless to say "Hey, I find this important to fix, but important enough to do anything about personally. Fix it up for me." Sergecross73 msg me 18:17, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
Oh, I completely agree. I'm only wondering if something worthwhile can't be salvaged from it. Tezero (talk) 18:33, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
Actually, now that I think of it, we do have WP:Reward board. This past winter, I saw that someone was offering a free copy of Terraria for anyone who brought one of a list of survival games to GA status, so I accepted the offer (with Don't Starve) and now I have both Terraria and a cool new indie survival game I'd never have learned about otherwise. The reward doesn't necessarily have to be large, but if it matters that much to you... Tezero (talk) 18:36, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
I literally don't have a half hour to myself, which is why I suggested it here, but it turns out I'm actually being condescending. Is there a reason you had to interpret my comment negatively? Willhesucceed (talk) 15:41, 18 November 2014 (UTC)
@PresN:?
I'm sure you didn't mean to be condescending. But all three other people in this thread took it the same way: "There are 10000 VG articles that need fixing, and all of you have your own projects. But here's an article that I care about... but I'm not going to fix it. Fix it for me." Sorry for interpreting it negatively instead of just ignoring the thread, but really, your presentation needs some work- if you had said "Here's this article that needs some work, is anyone interested in fixing it with me?" you probably would have gotten some hits, but actively stating that it wasn't a priority for you but it should be for other people isn't really a winning strategy. I do apologize for responding, though- better to say nothing than to be rude. --PresN 06:07, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

Raising possible concern[edit]

So I happened to stumble across a GamerGate Wikia page. And I must say, it likes calling out names. Just letting everyone here be aware of this in case something goes down. GamerPro64 00:31, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Interesting. If my only claim to fame there is being a member of a Wikipedia task force that uses a logo based on a game by someone who would later take up the anti-Gamergate side, I must be doing something right. Tezero (talk) 00:41, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
My only mention was...my involvement in discussions of Lucia Black's topic bans?! That's considered a GamerGate related incident? That's...bizarre. Sergecross73 msg me 04:35, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
I'm thinking it has something to do with Lucia opposing the Fez icon for the Indie Games task force. And Fez was made by Phil Fish. And Phil Fish is Anti-GamerGate. It's like six degrees of Bacon here. GamerPro64 04:43, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
If it helps looking at the history page, it's being edited by a fistful of anons and two regular editors. I wouldn't take it as "Oh lord GG hates these guys!" Other than Ryu haven't seen hardly anyone else mentioned on twitter at least.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 14:58, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
I closed that discussion and didn't get a mention. I'm a bit sad. -- ferret (talk) 15:12, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Proposal to stop using Fez as the WP:INDIE icon[edit]

  • As much as I abhor the idea of leting our choices be dictated but such circumstances, I'll ask WPVG (and specifically Czar: could we not use Fez's icon (or any other specific-game icon) for the Indie Taskforce? I originally leaned that way too but felt that Lucia had argued so combatively about it that there was no way I could convince you all; but now, the circumstances have changed dramatically, and I think it is even more wise to carefully consider the implications of connecting the Indie Taskforce to a specific game, especially one surrounded by such controversy. ☺ · Salvidrim! ·  07:36, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I don't think it is surrounded by controversy. Phil Fish is, but he's developed a public persona far divorced from Fez unusual for an indie game designer. Tezero (talk) 08:15, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I think that's a bit extreme. Fez is hardly an anti-GG mascot or something. I assumed that the Wikia was just written by someone who has a love for semi-related rambling trivia, and someone will eventually rewrite that out for being too unimportant and off topic. Or maybe I'm just too used to how Wikipedia works, but I don't think GG was mentioned once in the discussion they reference... Sergecross73 msg me 14:43, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I'm not a fan of Fish nor his antics, but the icon's fine. As much as Phil may like to have people think he was the one-man-army behind it, it was still a team effort and possibly a reminder to him at least that he's yet to top himself. I can take a bit of comfort in the latter.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 14:58, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
  • Wasn't this all before GG was a thing? I'm unaware of it being used as a mascot for anything related to GG at all, so I'm disinclined to agree with changing it. -- ferret (talk) 15:15, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I believe so, yes, so there's also that, if this ever did become an actual problem. Also, like Kung Fu Man above, I'm not a fan of Phil Fish as a person, and I've never even played Fez. I just supported the icon because its an important indie title and it made good for a small, simple icon. Sergecross73 msg me 16:30, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I would keep it. The controversy regarding Phil Fish should not automatically be inherited by Fez simply due to his involvement. Also, simply because Phil Fish is anti GamerGate should not mean that the character Fez is automatically an anti GamerGamer gate icon either.--69.157.253.160 (talk) 18:50, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Sega Saturn FAC[edit]

Considering the previous FAC lacked sufficient support to nominate, I would appreciate comments from the community. Regards,TheTimesAreAChanging (talk) 06:56, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Super Metroid selling "at least one million units"?[edit]

I think I need some help from anyone on Super Metroid. Some IP user was going into a habit of adding in that the game is "selling at least one million units" without providing a source that backs it up. I listed some revisions of the IP's behaviour:

I don't know if some IP tries to do this again, and I'm not sure where this "one million units" coming from... -- Hounder4 14:04, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

Protected for a week. See if you can get anything out of the IP about it now... Sergecross73 msg me 14:37, 18 November 2014 (UTC)
It seems to be that the IP has responded to my message, as seen here (revision), explaining about his edits. I hope the discussion I put up (Talk:Super Metroid#The game selling "at least one million units"?) would draws his attention. Post your comments there. -- Hounder4 23:15, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

Video game requests[edit]

Hi everyone, quick reminder that the requests page has a lot of article suggestions ready to be written! I've stopped slacking and gone through the latest few months of requests to take out any which definitely weren't notable & added some sources for those which likely or definitely are to help get them started. Sam Walton (talk) 16:21, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

WP:VG/DATECAT[edit]

While reading over the article guidelines page, I came over the following guideline at WP:VG/DATECAT:

  • If the game only has a November 2014 or a Q4 2014 type date and a citation, add the game to Category:Upcoming video games scheduled for 2014.
  • If the game has a release date that is a full date that contains day, month and year and a citation from a reliable source, then also add the game to the appropriate year category e.g. Category:2012 video games.

There seems to be discrepancy between what the guideline says and what editors are actually doing; for example Category:2015 video games currently only contains two entries despite plenty of 2015 video games having a "full" release date. Instead, editors (including me) add "Category:Upcoming video games scheduled for XXXX" to all upcoming games, regardless of full release date, and then replace it with "Category:XXXX video games" after the game actually releases (thus "Upcoming video games scheduled for XXXX" cats contain only upcoming games, and "XXXX video games" cats contain only games already released). Personally, I believe the guideline should be changed to reflect this, as A) it's clearer this way (and even these "full" release dates are susceptible to change at a later date) and B) it's what editors seem to be already doing. Thoughts? Satellizer (´ ・ ω ・ `) 12:40, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

I think this is a sensible proposal, the way the guidelines propose seems counter-intuitive. Sam Walton (talk) 13:07, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

I wrote the original wording four years ago, it was a compromise at the time as people wanted to put unreleased games in the year category and it was also the start of pushing for valid references for any form of date. I've been BOLD and changed the wording to:

If anyone disagrees please change it back, but I don't think this needs a discussion if its how people are operating now. One request though: Can we leave a couple of articles in Category:2015 video games as it seems pointless to delete it as an empty cat, only to re-create it next month. - X201 (talk) 14:37, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, wording's much better now. However, I've added {{empty category|hide=true}} to Category:2015 video games as a preventative measure against deletion (shouldn't happen though, as it does contain a subcat) and moved the two articles in it out as directly going against policy may not be the best idea in my opinion. Satellizer (´ ・ ω ・ `) 07:08, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
Its not a policy. - X201 (talk) 07:15, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
Guideline, I mean. Satellizer (´ ・ ω ・ `) 07:19, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
Upcoming being a subcat solves my worry about the cat being deleted so that's that I think. - X201 (talk) 08:56, 20 November 2014 (UTC)