User talk:GeneralNotability

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Not sure what to do with a user conduct problem? This is a good place to start.

TryDeletingMe SPI

If clearer evidence emerges later, can a second SPI be open? I feel sure the new editor is TDM. Ktrimi991 (talk) 23:39, 31 July 2021 (UTC)

Ktrimi991, yes indeed, if you find stronger evidence in the future you may re-file. I recommend Blablubbs's User:Blablubbs/How_to_file_a_good_SPI for tips on how to file a concise SPI with strong evidence. GeneralNotability (talk) 14:18, 1 August 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for your response and the link with tips. I was aware before filing the SPI [1] that it is hard to prove the connection as long as two accounts have never edited the same article. Idk, maybe only someone with experience in Balkan stuff would see the point I tried make: a Balkan editor with years of experience knows that in practice it is extremely unlikely that two different Australians would edit at the same time Serb nationalist stuff, Middle East wars and air travel-related articles. Anyways, I think that for now the best thing for me is to move on and focus on other things. Thanks again. Cheers, Ktrimi991 (talk) 10:42, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

Tech News: 2021-31

Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Recent changes

• If your wiki uses markup like <div class="mw-content-ltr"> or <div class="mw-content-rtl"> without the required dir attribute, then these will no longer work in 2 weeks. There is a short-term fix that can be added to your local wiki's Common.css page, which is explained at T287701. From now on, all usages should include the full attributes, for example: <div class="mw-content-ltr" dir="ltr" lang="en"> or <div class="mw-content-rtl" dir="rtl" lang="he">. This also applies to some other HTML tags, such as span or code. You can find existing examples on your wiki that need to be updated, using the instructions at T287701.
• Reminder: Wikimedia has migrated to the Libera Chat IRC network, from the old Freenode network. Local documentation should be updated.

Problems

• Last week, all wikis had slow access or no access for 30 minutes. There was a problem with generating dynamic lists of articles on the Russian Wikinews, due to the bulk import of 200,000+ new articles over 3 days, which led to database problems. The problematic feature has been disabled on that wiki and developers are discussing if it can be fixed properly. [2][3]

Changes later this week

• When adding links to a page using VisualEditor or the 2017 wikitext editor, disambiguation pages will now only appear at the bottom of search results. This is because users do not often want to link to disambiguation pages. [4]
• The new version of MediaWiki will be on test wikis and MediaWiki.org from 3 August. It will be on non-Wikipedia wikis and some Wikipedias from 4 August. It will be on all wikis from 5 August (calendar).

Future changes

• The team of the Wikipedia app for Android is working on communication in the app. The developers are working on how to talk to other editors and get notifications. You can read more. They are looking for users who want to test the plans. Any editor who has an Android phone and is willing to download the app can do this.
• The Beta Feature for Discussion tools will be updated in the coming weeks. You will be able to subscribe to individual sections on a talk page at more wikis. You can test this now by adding ?dtenable=1 to the end of the talk page's URL (example).

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe.

20:45, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

Sockpuppet of Stubes99

Hello. Can you please also block this blatant sock that restored the edits of a sock you just blocked? [5][6]. Thanks in advance. 86.120.251.61 (talk) 21:40, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

Looks like ST47 got them. GeneralNotability (talk) 16:04, 4 August 2021 (UTC)

Unfortunately he creates one sock after another. A new illegal account is active and I reported it too at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Stubes99 ... 82.78.61.100 (talk) 19:24, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

Return of a sock

Hello there, a sock you blocked seems to have returned [7], making the same edits on this article [8]. They've also requested discussion be made on the talk page similarly [9] [10] Magherbin (talk) 18:10, 5 August 2021 (UTC)

Magherbin, yup, that looks like them, thanks for letting me know. Blocked them, semi-protected the page for a few months. GeneralNotability (talk) 00:34, 6 August 2021 (UTC)

User:GeneralNotability, it looks like them again editing the same articles [11] Magherbin (talk) 20:35, 15 August 2021 (UTC)

Magherbin, think that's a different sockpuppeteer active in the topic area, but still a sock. Blocked. GeneralNotability (talk) 00:46, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

]

New sockpuppet account

Hi GN,

Could you take a look at this [12] account? Looking at its edit history [13], it's an obvious sock and I'm pretty certain that it is the same person as in this SPI case which you dealt with a while ago. The account was created on the same day as that report (also the same day the article Hanbok was protected), and the edit patterns are exactly the same.

Thanks in advance! Esiymbro (talk) 13:54, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi Esiymbro, I think you're right. Blocked. GeneralNotability (talk) 18:57, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

Recent IBAN block

This is a violation of it as well to my eyes. DuncanHill (talk) 00:21, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

DuncanHill, I just added a followup comment linking a bunch of edits in the past hour that have violated it, but thanks - I'll hang onto that link in case anyone says this was a one-off. GeneralNotability (talk) 00:31, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, I couldn't face pulling up any more but it wouldn't surprise me if there were. DuncanHill (talk) 00:33, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

I know I confused the two -- an indef block & a ban -- but that was because I feel the only solution in this case is a ban. As I said in this thread, for at least 15 years he's been going thru this cycle of being a valuable editor, encountering some incident that upsets him, getting himself banned, then creating another account & coming back to do it all again. (I suspect he's already created another account by now.) That's simply not healthy. Banning him might be the best thing to do for him -- as well for the encyclopedia. I hope, if he returns, people look at this longer history of behavior before acting. That's all I have to say about the matter. -- llywrch (talk) 18:56, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

llywrch, understood, I mostly wanted it clear that I had not tried to impose a ban (since there are very few situations where an administrator can unilaterally ban someone - almost all bans are based on community consensus). GeneralNotability (talk) 20:37, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

Fair enough. I just wanted to point out that there's a bigger story here which many are not aware of--& this lack of knowledge has been repeatedly exploited. -- llywrch (talk) 22:02, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

I'm sure that if GeneralNotability were aware of the backstory they would not have threatened to block BHG for what she said about AAW. DuncanHill (talk) 22:27, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

That was a stupid and cruel block. I can only assume you were motivated by profound ignorance. DuncanHill (talk) 22:46, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

@DuncanHill: No, that was a justified block in my opinion. ~TNT (she/they • talk) 22:47, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

GeneralNotability is aware of at least some of the backstory, but AAW/Chris.sherlock/etc. is not the only target of BHG's personal attacks, and even if they were, the correct way to deal with someone harassing you is not to sink to their level, and being uncivil to someone being uncivil to you is still uncivil. Two wrongs do not make a right.. Regardless, GeneralNotability is sick and tired of people who think it's okay to belittle and insult other editors in any situation, and GeneralNotability has acted in accordance with his understanding of WP:5P4, WP:NPA, and WP:CIV. GeneralNotability (talk) 22:51, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

(ec)Do you, General Notability, and you, TheresNoTime, REALLY want AAW's history brought up at length and in detail on wiki? Because that is what it will come to. I don't want to do it, but by gum I bloody well will if this harassment of one of the few editors with the decency to stand up to him continues. DuncanHill (talk) 22:53, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

You'll notice that AAW is currently under an indefinite block for their own behavior. And again: AAW is not the only editor whom BHG has engaged in PAs against. This is not an "AAW vs BHG" issue (and if anyone thinks that I'm defending AAW, do take a moment and check who blocked them last night), this is a general "BHG's behavior towards other editors" issue. GeneralNotability (talk) 22:57, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

I noted your threat to block BHG for her accurate descriptions of AAW's behaviour, under his numerous accounts. DuncanHill (talk) 23:00, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

And so, if that formed any part of your decision to block her, which the block log implies, then his behaviour is up for examination in the review of your actions. DuncanHill (talk) 23:02, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

I also note that despite being informed of it, you did not remove his personal attack on her from his userpage. DuncanHill (talk) 23:03, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

Oh for goodness sake. Incivility has no place on the project, period, and more admins need to apply that. Roll on the UCOC. It's daft to make this a she said/he said thing - if everyone was a bit more bloody civil this wouldn't have happened, would it? ~TNT (she/they • talk) 23:06, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

If civility were really a thing AAW would have been banned ten years or more ago. He accused me, via Wikipedia email, of (Redacted). Arbcom knew. And still he got every get out of jail free card going, and still people bear grudges against those who stand up to him. You'll forgive me if I think there's a shed-load of hypocrisy here. DuncanHill (talk) 23:13, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

@DuncanHill: And that's truly awful to hear, honestly. Why wasn't that dealt with? We should ask those questions and demand answers. All incivility should be dealt with - that, this and all the rest of the crap people get away with ~TNT (she/they • talk) 23:17, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

@TheresNoTime: It was "dealt with" by revoking email access (never applied to his later accounts) and him agreeing never to return. Which he did. Everyone goes on about his mental health problems, and it gets his some of his attacks on me suppressed from his talk page, nobody (save BHG and Geoff) ever gives a damn about the mental health problems he quite deliberately inflicted on others. DuncanHill (talk) 23:20, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

I'm mindful not to derail this conversation on GeneralNotability's talk page, but I respect your statement nobody [...] ever gives a damn about the mental health problems he quite deliberately inflicted on others. This is a good point, and something my own 'real life' experiences can attest to; you are always accountable to your actions regardless of your mental state. The editor should be held accountable for the disruption they have caused (and I believe it looks like they have?) ~TNT (she/they • talk) 23:27, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

NB. I'm getting a smidge irritated at the application of suppression in regards to all of this. Very fine line between useful oversight and that uneasy feeling. I urge my esteemed colleagues to consider the optics. ~TNT (she/they • talk) 23:29, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

I will be bringing up this thread with the other Arbs, as I do believe it will be useful going forward in deciding how we handle these situations in the future. There are previous discussions and internal consensus regarding a few issues which are driving the current round of suppressions, and we are also discussing those matters and how they can potentially be codified and/or clarified, without bringing too much attention to any specific instance. I'm happy to discuss this further elsewhere (to not clog up GN's talk page as mentioned). Primefac (talk) 23:34, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

Who redacted my truthful comment? Why? Who hasn't had the decency even to tell me they did it? DuncanHill (talk) 23:36, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

@DuncanHill: I'm not sure I can tell you who, but I do disagree with it as stated. I do however respect and welcome the message by Primefac above - these things are not very well defined and I do know we tend to err on the side of caution ~TNT (she/they • talk) 23:39, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

@TheresNoTime: @Primefac: There's nothing "civil" about redacting someone's truthful comment and not even telling them who did it. DuncanHill (talk) 23:46, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

I do apologise, DuncanHill, that was me redacting the content; I had written a few different replies before settling on the one that got posted here, and in one of them I did mention I had removed the text on the basis that it was private information from an email between the two of you. Somehow that sentence managed to get dropped. Being true does not mean something must be said, or kept, though. As I said above and will restate for the record, I will be bringing your thoughts and comments here to ArbCom for further discussion and reflection; in my opinion things got very out of hand very quickly and we need to be better about how we deal with such things in the future. Primefac (talk) 23:51, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

@Primefac: It was raised with Arbcom at the time, and I recall raising it again later. It was not an email "between the two of [us]" it was an unsolicited email from the then account of AAW - I think I'm right in saying he was blocked at the time (he's had so many accounts I hope you'll forgive me for not recalling the username off the top of my head)). After all this time, biting my lip for years, and going out of my way to avoid embarrassing AAW I really cannot let it stand any longer. Arbcom, or at least the Arbcom of the time, are complicit in his attacks -as are all the admins who threatened or blocked those who stood up to him. There are also suppressed attacks on me and an admin on his talk page now, I will require access to them if any case is bought involving him and me. I'm not angry with you Primefac personally, (I do understand the difficulty of re-drafting to suit everybody) just with a fucking useless system that protects abusers and victimises their targets. Feed that back to Arbcom too. DuncanHill (talk) 00:01, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

Lot going on here, brief responses:

• DuncanHill, you are correct that I left a PA in place; I saw the diff adding it and acknowledged, but I did not remove it. I have generally held back from redacting all but the most over-the-top offensive attack statements (I didn't even ask that of BHG, only that she strike her comments). And I have no problem with AAW's behavior being reviewed (though, obviously, I'm not going to bring up the suppressed bits myself). I don't exactly care for them either.
• Primefac, you're welcome to have that conversation here, and I'll note for my TPWs that I actually sent ArbCom an unhappy email last night about that suppression (mostly on the grounds of the suppressed content not being covered by OSPOL - I have no problem with its removal, I just want the written rules to agree with how things work in practice).
• Everyone: yes, I originally said I would block if BHG did not strike her comments about AAW. I stand by saying that. In my eyes, her comments went beyond "description of behavior" and into "attacks". Then I read even more of the ANI thread and, feeling that this is a major and currently ongoing problem chose to expand my block rationale from "civility violations against AAW" to "civility violations against several people." Had she struck those comments, I would not have blocked her (since that would be moving the goalposts) but would instead have commented in the thread. The fact that she has been harassed by AAW is deplorable and inexcusable, but we cannot meet incivility (or perceived incivility) with incivility of our own. I am starting to get quite tired of us as a community allowing editors to be assholes to each other simply because they are "productive". GeneralNotability (talk) 01:28, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

How many years did you wait before taking action against AAW? How many minutes for BHG? DuncanHill (talk) 01:33, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

DuncanHill, I'm sorry, but I'm dumbfounded by that statement. Years? I've had the sysop bit for something like a year and a half now and wasn't around for most of Chris.sherlock's drama. I !opposed their unblock at AN...what, two years ago now? (in case you go looking, it's under my account's old name). After I was privately informed of the IBAN violation, I spent about fifteen minutes checking their recent contribs, deciding that yes this was absolutely an IBAN violation, talking to a couple fellow admins to make sure I wasn't completely out of line, and then blocking. In contrast, I spent most of this afternoon staring at ANI and going back and forth on how to deal with this, even before I posted to ANI. This was not a spur-of-the-moment decision by any means. GeneralNotability (talk) 01:46, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

(ec)So what's your old name? I really don't have the time to keep track of people who keep deciding to be someone else. I've never been anyone else. DuncanHill (talk) 01:51, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

My old username was creffett, and to save you the further time required to look it up, my !vote was as follows: Oppose for now: The unblock request is still missing the essential parts: understanding what they did wrong and convincing us (well, the reviewing admin) that they'll do better. I see a history of their contributions followed by some combative behavior. I respect their significant past contributions to the project, but I'm definitely a "nobody is above the law" type. Oppose, potentially revisited if they at least meet the minimum requirements for an unblock request. Probably not the response you're looking for, since I was not familiar at the time with all of the drama surrounding Chris.sherlock, but my point is that I didn't exactly invite them back. GeneralNotability (talk) 01:55, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

If you knew the history you would hate yourself. You were warned, and you did not attempt to find out why. DuncanHill (talk) 02:25, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

Tech News: 2021-32

Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Problems

• You can read but not edit 17 wikis for a few minutes on 10 August. This is planned at 05:00 UTC. This is because of work on the database. [14]

Changes later this week

• The Wikimania Hackathon will take place remotely on 13 August, starting at 5:00 UTC, for 24 hours. You can participate in many ways. You can still propose projects and sessions.
• The new version of MediaWiki will be on test wikis and MediaWiki.org from 10 August. It will be on non-Wikipedia wikis and some Wikipedias from 11 August. It will be on all wikis from 12 August (calendar).
• The old CSS <div class="visualClear"></div> will not be supported after 12 August. Instead, templates and pages should use <div style="clear:both;"></div>. Please help to replace any existing uses on your wiki. There are global-search links available at T287962.

Future changes

• The Wikipedia Library is a place for Wikipedia editors to get access to sources. There is an extension which has a new function to tell users when they can take part in it. It will use notifications. It will start pinging the first users in September. It will ping more users later. [15]
• Vue.js will be the JavaScript framework for MediaWiki in the future. [16]

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe.

16:18, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

Feedback request: Maths, science, and technology request for comment

Your feedback is requested at Talk:Pythagorean triple on a "Maths, science, and technology" request for comment. Thank you for helping out!
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Arbcom notice

You are involved in a recently filed request for arbitration. Please review the request at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case#BrownHairedGirl and, if you wish to do so, enter your statement and any other material you wish to submit to the Arbitration Committee. As threaded discussion is not permitted on most arbitration pages, please ensure that you make all comments in your own section only. Additionally, the guide to arbitration and the Arbitration Committee's procedures may be of use.

Thanks, Ritchie333 ^{(talk) (cont)} 14:26, 10 August 2021 (UTC)

Acknowledged. GeneralNotability (talk) 14:29, 10 August 2021 (UTC)

Comment

Interested in your comments at User talk:Zhimon. 331dot (talk) 15:40, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks. I think it's worth a shot, at least. 331dot (talk) 15:49, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

day ending in y

Hi. I hope you, and Oreo the doggo are doing well.
I didnt understand your comment regarding y. I asked you about it right there in the ANI, but surprisingly, I forgot to sign the comment; thus failing the ping. Would you please explain it? Thanks. —usernamekiran (talk) 21:18, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

@Usernamekiran, all days end in y, so the comment was that editors pushing caste issues is nothing unusual. —valereee (talk) 21:35, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

@valereee oh! A day ending in y. lol silly me. Thanks for the explanation
PS: my signature is way cooler than yours. —usernamekiran (talk) 21:47, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

(talk page watcher) And it's much easier to say and remember than "all months ending in y, h, l, e, t, and r"! BilCat (talk) 23:18, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

Reporting an NPA violation

Hi, I am here to report an NPA violation, a user posting "Get AIDS and die" in Chinese, here. I would hope it warrants a block. Have a great day.--NØ 13:53, 15 August 2021 (UTC)

MaranoFan, yeah, that's not okay. Issued a temporary block. GeneralNotability (talk) 01:03, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

cmt

Just for the record I think it was perfectly reasonable to block a user who has a history of incivility that no one has been willing to address because they're so important to the project. JMO, but if it had been someone unimportant with otherwise the exact same history of incivility, no one would have complained about the block and no one would have unblocked. That's pretty much the issue right there. —valereee (talk) 13:27, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks Valereee, I appreciate it. GeneralNotability (talk) 13:35, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Stubes99

Please take a look at Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Stubes99, a blatant sock-puppetry case that is open for 10 days. You blocked a previous illegal account and I think you are familiar with this editor now. 86.120.179.32 (talk) 17:21, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

Handled. GeneralNotability (talk) 01:41, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for your action, I appreciate it. I reverted all of his / her edits to discourage ban evasion. However I was not able to undo the edits from https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Iaaasi&action=history because of automatic protection. 86.120.179.182 (talk) 06:09, 18 August 2021 (UTC)

Tech News: 2021-33

Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Recent changes

• You can add language links in the sidebar in the new Vector skin again. You do this by connecting the page to a Wikidata item. The new Vector skin has moved the language links but the new language selector cannot add language links yet. [17]

Problems

• There was a problem on wikis which use the Translate extension. Translations were not updated or were replaced with the English text. The problems have been fixed. [18][19][20]

Changes later this week

• A revision tag will soon be added to edits that add links to disambiguation pages. This is because these links are usually added by accident. The tag will allow editors to easily find the broken links and fix them. If your wiki does not like this feature, it can be hidden. [21]
• Would you like to help improve the information about tools? Would you like to attend or help organize a small virtual meetup for your community to discuss the list of tools? Please get in touch on the Toolhub Quality Signal Sessions talk page. We are also looking for feedback from tool maintainers on some specific questions.
• In the past, edits to any page in your user talk space ignored your mute list, e.g. sub-pages. Starting this week, this is only true for edits to your talk page. [22]
• The new version of MediaWiki will be on test wikis and MediaWiki.org from 17 August. It will be on non-Wikipedia wikis and some Wikipedias from 18 August. It will be on all wikis from 19 August (calendar).

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe.

19:25, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

SPI Investigation

Hi, GeneralNotability. I'm running an SPI investigation here: [23]. If you please, you may review it (I have evidence). Israell (talk) 00:10, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Israell, handled - sorry, not the result you're probably hoping for, but the article in question has been protected for a few days at least. GeneralNotability (talk) 01:40, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Obvious evader

Hi. I was going through 223.178.74.91's contributions from Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Satish Raman Nair you just closed.. I think 122.173.233.203 is an obvious continuation of the the evasion. It is on the same ISP in India, though different geolocation in India, but geo isn't always reliable inside countries. 122.173.233.203 is picking up on 13 August where 223.178.74.91 left off on 11 August, and is editing the same articles and expanding them (interaction tool).--Eostrix  (^{🦉 hoot} _hoot🦉) 06:44, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Eostrix, I concur. Blocked. GeneralNotability (talk) 14:46, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Feedback request: Wikipedia policies and guidelines request for comment

Your feedback is requested at Wikipedia:Universal Code of Conduct/Enforcement draft guidelines review on a "Wikipedia policies and guidelines" request for comment. Thank you for helping out!
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HI , I have some questions and I hope if you can help me , thank you , Hamaredha (talk) 21:18, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Hamaredha, don't ask to ask, just go ahead and ask your questions. GeneralNotability (talk) 01:29, 18 August 2021 (UTC)

Arbitration case request declined

Dear GeneralNotability: The BrownHairedGirl arbitration case request, to which you were a named party, has been declined. For the Arbitration Committee, KevinL (alt of L235 · t · c) 07:46, 18 August 2021 (UTC)