Talk:Don Black (white supremacist): Difference between revisions

Content deleted Content added

Inline

Revision as of 14:34, 27 August 2023

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

Biography Start‑class

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
Start	This article has been rated as Start-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.

United States Start‑class Low‑importance

	United States portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. Template Usage Articles Requested! Become a Member Project Talk Alerts United StatesWikipedia:WikiProject United StatesTemplate:WikiProject United StatesUnited States articles
Start	This article has been rated as Start-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Alabama Start‑class

	Alabama portal This article is part of WikiProject Alabama, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to Alabama on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit this article, or visit the project page to join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.AlabamaWikipedia:WikiProject AlabamaTemplate:WikiProject AlabamaAlabama articles
Start	This article has been rated as Start-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.

Discrimination Start‑class Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Discrimination, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Discrimination on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.DiscriminationWikipedia:WikiProject DiscriminationTemplate:WikiProject DiscriminationDiscrimination articles
Start	This article has been rated as Start-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the importance scale.

Crime and Criminal Biography Start‑class Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Crime and Criminal BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyCrime-related articles
Start	This article has been rated as Start-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Archives

Archive 1

RfC

BAn RfC: Which descriptor, if any, can be added in front of Southern Poverty Law Center when referenced in other articles? has been posted at the Southern Poverty Law Center talk page. Your participation is welcomed. – MrX 16:39, 22 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

White supremacist label

Considering WP:BLP, is there just cause to describe him as a white supremacist? If he describes himself in this way, then it makes sense, however if he does not, it is a violation of BLP. Not even David Duke is described as a white supremacist in the lead of that article. Laval (talk) 17:00, 16 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It is not against BLP to describe him as a White Supremacist if there are multiple reliable sources that do that. It might be a good idea to provide attribution and his own selfidentification as well.User:Maunus ·ʍaunus·snunɐw· 17:20, 16 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

While it might not technically be against BLP, I fail to see how the sense in titling this page like his detractors, especially when we already have the Don_Black_(white_nationalist) page. It hurts the page's WP:NPOV. I propose we transfer the content of this page to there, and instead make this the redirect. This will make the page more impartial and further Wikipedia's interests.

Please give me your thoughts. TheDaJakester^{User talk:TheDaJakester} 21:50, 17 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

No, because he's known primarily as a white supremacist, and the purpose of the parenthetical disambiguation description is to describe him accurately, not to rehabilitate his public image by using a euphemistic substitute. Rockypedia (talk) 01:18, 18 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Is "Nazi" short for "National Socialist" when used as part of the phrase "Neo-nazi" or otherwise?

Not in English. Only when used in reference to the actual Nazi party of actual Germany. According to the OED this usage is historical:

1. A member of the National Socialist German Workers' Party (now hist.); a member of any similar organization. Also more generally, usu. in pl.: the German government or armed forces in the period 1933–45 (now hist.).

whereas the meaning in this article, the current meaning according to the OED is:

2a. In extended use: a believer in or sympathizer with the aims or doctrines of Nazism or any similar doctrines. Also more generally: a person holding extreme racist (esp. anti-Semitic) or authoritarian views, or behaving in a brutal and bigoted manner.

The definition of "neo-Nazi" doesn't even mention the party:

A. adj. Supporting or imbued with neo-Nazism or its characteristic attitudes, behaviour, ideologies, etc.

— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 21:02, 14 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Family

Let us remove the details about his family: BLP and out of the scope. Zezen (talk) 06:19, 10 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to one external link on Don Black (white nationalist). Please take a moment to review my edit. You may add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it, if I keep adding bad data, but formatting bugs should be reported instead. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether, but should be used as a last resort. I made the following changes:

Attempted to fix sourcing for http://www.splcenter.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Derek-Black-letter-to-Mark-Potok-Hatewtach.pdf

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}).

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—^{cyberbot II}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 22:19, 29 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Don Black (white nationalist). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}).

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 06:19, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 3 external links on Don Black (white supremacist). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090818043205/http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/Don-Black/background.asp to http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/Don-Black/background.asp
Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.floridatoday.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=%2F20071219%2FBREAKINGNEWS%2F71219044
Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20081225195221/http://www.adl.org/poisoning_web/black.asp to http://www.adl.org/poisoning_web/black.asp

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 11:47, 12 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Don Black (white supremacist). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120722051636/http://www.adl.org/main_Extremism/Derek-Black.htm to http://www.adl.org/main_Extremism/Derek-Black.htm

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 20:01, 20 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Change title to "Don Black (White Power figure)"

White supremacy is not a notable trait. Black is important because of his influence and connections in a broader social movement. 2603:7000:D03A:5895:244F:F822:E837:F619 (talk) 13:07, 26 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sources dictate whether a trait is notable, how is it not notable? "White Supremacy" as well, can be considered a movement. FutureFlowsLoveYou (talk) 13:20, 26 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I tend to agree with Future. Don Black is mainly notable due to his WS activities. DN (talk) 20:09, 26 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

But he's not notable for his white supremacy. He's notable for using white supremacy and evangelical Christianity to justify war against the federal government. This is why him being a former mercenary should be in the first sentence. Being racist in and of itself isn't notable and it shouldn't get you a Wikipedia article. 2603:7000:D03A:5895:9881:3137:D82D:5A49 (talk) 14:34, 27 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@@ Line 97: / Line 97: @@
 :Sources dictate whether a trait is notable, how is it not notable? "White Supremacy" as well, can be considered a movement. [[User:FutureFlowsLoveYou|FutureFlowsLoveYou]] ([[User talk:FutureFlowsLoveYou|talk]]) 13:20, 26 August 2023 (UTC)
 :I tend to agree with Future. Don Black is mainly notable due to his WS activities. [[User:Darknipples|DN]] ([[User talk:Darknipples|talk]]) 20:09, 26 August 2023 (UTC)
+::But he's not notable for his white supremacy. He's notable for using white supremacy and evangelical Christianity to justify war against the federal government. This is why him being a former mercenary should be in the first sentence. Being racist in and of itself isn't notable and it shouldn't get you a Wikipedia article. [[Special:Contributions/2603:7000:D03A:5895:9881:3137:D82D:5A49|2603:7000:D03A:5895:9881:3137:D82D:5A49]] ([[User talk:2603:7000:D03A:5895:9881:3137:D82D:5A49|talk]]) 14:34, 27 August 2023 (UTC)