Talk:Chinese nationality law

Talk 1

This article needs all mention of PRC-specific instances of "China" converted, then the cleanup tag can be removed. Elle _{vécut heureuse} ^{à jamais} (Be eudaimonic!) 04:02, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

What are the regulations on obtaining passports for Taiwan residents? It's possible, as Chen You-hao escaped to the US on a PRC passport after Taiwan issued an arrest warrant for him.--Jiang 06:18, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Does "China" need to be converted? Because in whatever definition (include Taiwan or not), PRC still treat those people as Chinese citizens (at least unilaterally) and we are talking about the nationality law of PRC here. Hunter 11:17, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes but a distinction needs to be made between references that are to the PRC itself and references that are regarding China as a whole. Btw, regarding "ethnic Chinese" — can that be clarified, because would then this be a racial policy ... ? Elle _{vécut heureuse} ^{à jamais} (Be eudaimonic!) 13:13, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

I believe adding a sentence explaining what China means in this context would be the best? Because changing China -> PRC hardly reflect what the law says. For the "btw part", if you mean that the nationality law of PRC says that only ethnic Chinese (in general) can become its citizen then I am afraid that's true. You can see this from the English translation in the external links. Hunter 14:26, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes, but I assume that includes the 56 nationalities, because AFAIK they are not "ethnic Chinese" (in the sense of Han Chinese). Elle _{vécut heureuse} ^{à jamais} (Be eudaimonic!) 22:08, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

I just added a template to Wikisource. Speaking of Chen You-hao getting a PRC passport to flee to the US, I have also heard of ROC passports issued to mainland democratic activisits after the Tiananmen Square protests of 1989. Due to PRC and ROC claiming each other's administered territory, PRC nationals are also considered ROC nationals and vice versa. However, anyone publicly saying that s/he is a national of the PRC and the ROC is likely to be questioned about the loyalty as the PRC and ROC have serious political conflicts.--Jusjih 22:34, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Chinese nationality

I think the use of "ethnic Chinese" in this article is too ambiguous as to whether it means han Chinese or Zhonghua Minzu (it should mean the latter)--Jiang 11:10, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

The official translation of the Nationality Law itself uses the term "of Chinese nationality" instead of "ethnic Chinese". --Jiang 19:16, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes, though when I originally created this article I thought it would be confusing for readers who are not familiar with how the "nationality" term used by the PRC, since such definition is very different from how it is used elsewhere. From what I interpret, the term "nationality" used by the PRC government is equivalent to "ethnic". --Hunter 19:21, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

"Chinese ethnicity" implies a single ethnic group. Han Chinese would be an ethnic group. "Chinese nationality" is supposed to transcend ethnic groups. I don't know if there is a clean way of dealing with this. --Jiang 19:23, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes I am aware of such definition by the PRC government. I'd propose adding a footnote to clarify the definition used. Hunter 19:30, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. but we should use the term consistently in the article--Jiang 02:30, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

I just looked at the [ http://news.xinhuanet.com/legal/2003-01/21/content_699250.htm original Chinese text] and the term "Chinese nationality" as translated has nothing to do with Zhonghua Minzu. The term being used, 中国公民, can also mean "Chinese citizenship" and has nothing to do with ethnicity. The article is wrong... --Jiang 02:36, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes.. but then according to the terminologies of the PRC government, nationalities is used in place of ethnic groups, am I right? — Instantnood 20:48, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

This is "Chinese Nationality" singular and not a translation of Zhonghua Minzu. Please take a look at the original Chinese. --Jiang 00:51, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

I just read the nationality law again, my understanding now is: "Chinese national" -> 中国公民 "Chinese nationality" ->中国国籍. So I think I should have said the official translation of "Chinese national" is equivalent to "ethnic Chinese" in the context of thie article.--Hunter 03:46, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

公民 and 国籍 have nothing to do with ethnicity. Ethnicity is associated with a common genealogy or ancestry: there are multiple ethnicities within China. Although Chinese nationality policies may be de facto racist, nowhere is it stated up front that yellow skin qualifies someone for citizenship. We should stop using the phrase "ethnic Chinese" in the article. --Jiang 04:06, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

公民 -> citizen (commonly used in western countries) or natinoal (used by Chinese government). In this context it stands for national and I believe the definition should be as same as the one stated in Nationalities of China#Nationalities: "Although most of the nationalities can be seen as ethnic groups, the correspondence is not one to one.".

I understand that it is not really one to one equivalent, but if the article uses "Chinese national" in place of "ethnic Chinese", it would be rather confusing for English readers because the term usually means "nationality". (See National). --Hunter 05:23, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

I don't see why you keep bringing up ethnicity. 公民 (citizen) and 民族 (ethnicity/nationality) are some very separate concepts. The latter is not relevant here. --Jiang 07:13, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I think I was wrong. Sorry for so much trouble, I just interpret it from the English version (didn't had the Chinese version on hand when I created this article) and the usage of the word by the Chinese government. I'll update the article shortly according to the Chinese version. --Hunter 08:55, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Chinese nationatliy vs PRC nationality?

To follow how it is officially used. I know some of you may consider it to be POV but since the CHN of ISO 3166-1 alpha-3 characters are designated for PRC, and the nationality field of its passports are "Chinese". For Taiwan, they used TWN and print Taiwan on the nationality field. I think there is no problem in saying its Chinese natinoality. --Hunter 19:27, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm not specifically opposed to using "Chinese nationality" as the government does, but "PRC citizen"/"PRC national" is more congurent with Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Chinese).--Jiang 02:30, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Overseas Chinese as "ethnic Chinese"

As long as they keep their Chinese names, and are willing to give up a passport, but born outside the PRC, and whose parents do not hold Chinese nationality (let's say, third or fourth or fifth generation, etc. like most Chinese Singaporeans or many Chinese-Americans in the US) what is the context of this issue? Are they counted as "not ethnic Chinese" or...? (Not that I'd trade in my passport, just out of curiosity for legal matters.) Elle _{vécut heureuse} ^{à jamais} (Be eudaimonic!) 06:10, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Prior to 1980?

What provision is there legally to define chinese nationality before 1980? In other words, what legal instrument defined all Chinese nationals as PRC citizen beginning in 1949 upon PRC's creation? What about prior to 1949? what legal status did Chinese nationals had before 1949? What if they were born under Qing Empire, in the mainland or otherwise?

I think there should be a seperate article for "Chinese nationality" in general. --Kvasir 04:03, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Citizenship for Arabs in China?

I am not clear on the section that describes citizenship for Arabs to be problematic or complicated. There is a statement that points out the issue of Egyptians, Libyans, Mauritanians, Omanis, Algerians and Tunisians who are born in China in reference to citizenship. Are there high intermarriage rates between these groups and Chinese? Can someone please clarify any possible misunderstinding I may have in reference to this Passage?

[User:Brian] 02:01, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure why arabs are singled out either. I'm sure this is the case for other strict jus sangunis countries as well. Do we really need to list all the applicable arab countries, seeing that is probably a small proportion of foreigners in China. --Kvasir 10:12, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Hmm. Well maybe the person who authored this section of the article could elaborate why he/she wrote what they wrote? It certainly deserves a bit of explanation to say the least.[User:Brian] 5:05, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Dual citizenship

Make a new section dual citizenship, and mention that the government is often unaware that one might have become a dual citizen. Jidanni 11:41, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

loopholes

are there any loopholes to getting chinese citizenship without giving up your current citizenship from another country? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.109.229.205 (talk) 23:39, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Only in the case of HK and Macau as far as I know. Their own Basic Laws have made special provisions before the handovers in 1997 and 1999 respectively to allow would be Chinese nationals to keep whatever foreign citizenship they have beyond the handovers. Despite having foreign citenship, they would only be recognised as Chinese citizens in the SAR and China. This also means Chinese nationality is lost automatically when naturalising as foreign nationals after 1997 and 1999. --Kvasir (talk) 10:45, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

You can "keep" your foreign citizenship after you are naturalised as a Chinese national, just that your foreign citizenship will not be recognised by the PRC in China and its SARs. Don't know if naturalisation as Chinese national requires renunciation of one's foreign citizenship, but if the foreign country does not allow renunciation then in theory you are still citizen of that country in the eyes of that country (as long as that country allow dual citizenship). --Kvasir (talk) 10:51, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

taiwan

since china doesnt consider taiwan to be a country, can a person potentially hold both a prc and taiwanese passport? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.105.134.113 (talk) 00:03, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Also does the law apply theoretically to people of Taiwan? --Kvasir (talk) 16:08, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

How do Taiwan citizens apply for PRC citizenship? Are they automatically eligible?