User talk:Jimbo Wales

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Tanks

Thanks for giving me his welcome. You were very kind. Augusto Antonio (talk) 14:29, 17 August 2010 (CEST)

It is reaffirmed by Jinbo

You kept silent the question. It is thought that the silence agreed positively.Do you abandon the authority of Wikipedia?　Is it agreed that the authority of Wikipedia Foundation is not applied to Wikipedia Japanese?Do you approve it for a domain donation[1]? It is your responsibility that makes an excuse. Japanese community is thought that you approved them. You should announce the excuse in Wikipedia Japanese.--山吹色の御菓子 (talk) 12:44, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

You already got a reply from Jimbo here. The discussion was moved to the archives to make place for new discussions. --Enric Naval (talk) 15:37, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

Japanese community was resolved by the answer.The remark of Jinbo was translated by sysop. "Jinbo does not participate in Wikipedia Japanese". "I am not interested in Wikipedia Japanese". User_talk:Jimbo_Wales/Archive_63#Annulment_declaration_of_Wikipedia.27s_principles_and_Wikipedia:Policies_and_guidelines_in_Japanese_edition_3--山吹色の御菓子 (talk) 17:24, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

I am very interested in Japanese Wikipedia. I am unable to read Japanese and therefore unable to participate directly. That is not the same as "not interested". I requested that several Japanese Wikipedians contact me separately to explain what I am being asked, because I really do not understand what you are saying. For example, when you talk about a "domain donation" I do not know what you mean.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 17:27, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

A trademark of "wikipedia" is used for the e-mail address of ja:Wikipedia:Info-ja　info-ja@wikipedia.jp.Jimbo contributes the trademark of "Wikipedia" or does the use permission. The person in charge of ja:Wikipedia:Info-ja possesses negotiation rights, and can protect the modification and the page of the content of the description. They disclose a use history and the IP address of each user to the police organization.--山吹色の御菓子 (talk) 04:46, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

You need to explain clearly what the issue is with Japanese Wikipedia. What exactly is occurring there that you think requires attention? The Wikimedia Foundation owns ja.wikipedia.org, as it does all other Wikipedias. They are not about to cede it to someone else. Fences&Windows 02:12, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

Where are the other Japanese Wikipedians, User:山吹色の御菓子. We need to hear from them. --62.25.109.195 (talk) 17:14, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

I did not plan it.It has been executed by sysop since about 2004. I opposed their ideas. Neither Japanese community nor syspo have the idea of consenting to the interrogation. This is because it is a decision by the vote by Japanese community. You (acceptable the deputy) should participate in Japanese Wikipedia if you want to question it. You are recommended to participate in thisja:Wikipedia:Help_for_Non-Japanese_Speakers. --山吹色の御菓子 (talk) 03:42, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I recommend you post here in Japanese as we can not understand your English. There are plenty of people here who can translate your Japanese into English. ···日本穣^? · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WikiProject Japan! 04:31, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

If you and someone can translate, the report is written in Japanese. --山吹色の御菓子 (talk) 16:11, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

ja:User:山吹色の御菓子 has been blocked indefinitely on the Japanese Wikipedia since 7 July following a discussion here: ja:Wikipedia:投稿ブロック依頼/山吹色の御菓子. His English is not good (and my Japanese is a thousand times worse!) but I suspect he is complaining about those who blocked him. 86.156.83.96 (talk) 20:09, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

This is totally beside the point, but I have to say that I really get a kick out of the image used in the indefblocked user template on the Japanese Wikipedia. -- Ed (Edgar181) 20:29, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I wrote brief explanation at jawp[2] about the situation based on my understanding. Related pages are ja:Wikipedia:投稿ブロック依頼/山吹色の御菓子(google trans) and ja:Wikipedia:コメント依頼/山吹色の御菓子(google trans) . User name "山吹色の御菓子"(a Japanese euphemism for 'bribe'.) is translated as "angel of the bright yellow cake" in google trans. --Was a bee (talk) 00:29, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Thank you, Was a bee, 86.156.83.96 (talk) 01:32, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

They do not answer the first problem.Japanese Wikipedia doesn't have the policy in the block. As for syaop, the authority use is unlimited in principle.The argument is performed by a vote. --山吹色の御菓子 (talk) 16:04, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

My sock puppet case

Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Hinata I need you to checkuser me please. Thanks for the understanding. Hinata talk 14:38, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

Please? Hinata talk 18:19, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, Checkuser is not for establishing innocence, however useful that might be to you, and although Jimbo could technically do this, in practice he does not. If a CU user decides that a check is appropriate, it will happen. Meanwhile, if you have nothing to worry about, I'd sit back and relax. The truth, as far as can be ascertained, will out, and in the absence of cogent evidence, you should not worry. Rodhullandemu 00:29, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I know Jimbo Wales is a checkuser and all.. but I have to protect myself from it. They are signing their posts with my name. And trying to for me to get blocked. Its a hassle. Hinata talk 11:48, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I can see from the SPI page that you are exonerated; such unnecessary accusations re indeed "a hassle". However, we are not so unsophisticated here as to fail to realise that this sort of thing happens from time to time. All I can suggest is that if you are innocent, and know that for a fact, you have little to be concerned about. Rodhullandemu 01:44, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Never mind, it is over anyway. But.. will somebody teach me how to type Japanese correctly with the Microsoft software I have? I had to use the Windows XP Software CD to do it, but it is interesting. Sorry for the changing of the subject. Hinata talk 14:47, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Threats from the JIDF

Hi Jimbo, in case you have not been informed, "David Appletree" aka User:Einsteindonut the founder of the Kahanist Jewish Internet Defense Force has been using sockpuppets to make on-wiki threats [3] and [4] to disrupt the operation of Wikipedia once he is community banned. Appletree has been careful to protect his real identity, but should these threats come to fruition, I can provide information on sources that have disclosed his real name and they can presumably provide contact details should the Foundation decide to take legal action against him.--Peter cohen (talk) 17:15, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

I think it far more likely that you will be blocked for making personal attacks than that the Foundation would take legal action against him.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 17:19, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

For the record, I'm not a "Kahanist" and neither is my organization. Somewhere on the JIDF site, I have explained that while Rabbi Kahane is an influence, I hardly know everything about the man, what he has said, written and done. While sometimes we post some of his material, we also have posted Bob Marley videos. Does that make me a Rastafarian? And we've posted stuff from the Beastie Boys. Does that mean I support the wide variety of political and religious views they have? Like many people out there, I have diverse interests and influences. For anyone to focus on just one and claim that they are the embodiment of my views, or the views of the JIDF, is shallow, and wrong. Futhermore, if the Wikipedia Foundation needs any information from me for any legal matters, I'm sure that there are legal channels that can be taken. Lastly, I'm tired of baseless allegations about me and my organization on this site. Just because there's a handful of pro-JIDF sockpuppets out there, it doesn't mean they are all me, all the time. While I might have had access to some of them upon occasion for an edit here or there, I'm currently working all this out with Wikipedia itself, privately, through ArbCom. I'm here now to represent and defend myself, and my organization in order to answer questions, fully adhering to WP's rules and policies to the best of my ability. I believe my mainpage editing will be kept to a minimum, but I think that I could be a valuable contributor to the project in that way as well. If WP wishes to believe that I'm a one-man disruption force or that I directed all the problems that have been happening in the name of, and in defense of the JIDF, and keep my contributions and insight into my work and self, completely off the site, that will be their decision to make. At least now, and in my own name, I will be accountable for my own edits and they will be representative of only me, and I will act as an official representative of the JIDF on Wikipedia. I don't need random anonymous sockpuppets causing trouble for me, my organization, or for Wikipedia. --DavidAppletree (talk) 12:05, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

As far as I can tell that would be an incredibly silly thing to do. I have convinced myself in the past (1) that the JIDF is openly attacking the Wikipedia community in an attempt to censor/embellish the JIDF article, and (2) that the one "attack" against the JIDF that it tends to react most strongly to is the allegation that it is a one-man operation. (I am not sure if this allegation ever made it into the article in any form, but the user who is behind the JIDF accounts such as Einsteindonut generally goes ballistic when it comes up in Wikipedia-internal discussions.) Connecting the dots, it appears that the JIDF is a one-man operation, by someone with severe ego problems, probably thinking of himself as an internet super-hero.

You may not know this, but Peter Cohen once made it onto a hate list that was posted on the JIDF website and which also includes FayssalF. [5] See Talk:Jewish Internet Defense Force/Archive 12#Final quote and link to JIDF Guide to WIkipedia Editors for some of the context. The post by a likely Einsteindonut sockpuppet (deleted by Spartaz) was an attempt to defend this edit, which introduced the hate list as a reference into the article. Hans Adler 20:12, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

None of that justifies insults and personal attacks on Wikipedia.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 14:54, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. To follow your logic, what we should do when faced with an organisation trying to attack us is 1) goad them on by suing them, thus giving publicity to their problems and claims and 2) ban them and ignore them completely, which historically has done oh-so much to keep people away. Ironholds (talk) 19:16, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

I am not saying that it justifies insults and personal attacks. But you are attacking an active, constructive member of our community for stepping over a line while over-reacting to a self-promoter who has been trampling over several lines repeatedly in the last years, and who is basically invulnerable because he doesn't care about the fate of any of his incarnations. I doubt that this is what you are trying to do. It seems to me that you have at least two reasonable options:

• Rebuking Peter cohen publicly and simultaneously making it clear that you understand the real origin of the problem and that you support assertive action against the self-promoter(s).
• Telling Peter cohen quietly to stop over-reacting, while not really examining the case in detail, or without bothering to do anything about Einsteindonut or his current incarnation User:WPYellowStars. (Btw, I am not sure why so far no admin has bothered to block this account for the blatant WP:USERNAME violation – offensive and trolling –, which is being reaffirmed by the huge image on the user page. Instead, the SPI case is apparently being ignored. That may well be the kind of thing that causes such over-reactions.)

But rebuking Peter cohen publicly while apparently ignoring the root of the problem (sorry if I missed something – if you have said something about that it may not be sufficiently visible) is not a good reaction because it's counter-productive w.r.t. the ultimate goal of improving our social climate and retaining productive editors. Hans Adler 22:51, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

I think it's fairly clear for all the world to see that the problem has been or is being addressed - community ban, constant sockpuppet blocks, so on, so forth. In fact, if as you say there's nothing that can be properly done about the sockpuppeteer, what more do you expect? The point is that 1) improving our social climate rarely involves giving editors free reign (either through lack of a public slap on the wrists or completely ignoring them) to post longwinded and offensive diatribes as Peter has done, 2) Peter completely failed to appreciate he's in the wrong with my message, while the pileon of "seriously, dude, over the line" messages seems to have had some impact (which supports the idea that a private message would have been pointless) and 3) the ultimate goal of retaining productive editors does not involve carte blanche. Peter has publicly stated that he feels his GA and FA contributions and all the other fancy schmancy article contributions he has, compared to the "wiki-crimes" of the other editor, means that he can do what he likes, when he likes. The sockpuppeteering is so obvious and awfully executed that it can be easily cleared up, and no edits are unrevertable. If, as you say, our ultimate goal is to improve our social climate and retain productive editors, I think allowing the idea that certain editors can, as a result of their article contributions, do and say whatever the hell they want with immunity to gain credence, is a far greater threat than a guy with a rotating IP address. Ironholds (talk) 13:00, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Well stated, Ironholds. I believe Peter Cohen and other editors like him represent a serious threat to this project and I'm glad Mr. Cohen is on Mr. Wales' radar. --DavidAppletree (talk) 07:32, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

The nerve. This account was created 8 hours after Georgewilliamherbert marked the account User:Einsteindonut as community banned. Hans Adler 08:52, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Let me be clear, DavidAppletree; I consider you and people like you a serious threat to the website, I find your politics despicably, and your tirades amusing. I just don't think personal attacks are going to help anything. Ironholds (talk) 10:19, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Note that I have referred this to arbcom for advice. Spartaz ^Humbug! 10:21, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Where, what element, and have you informed participants? Ironholds (talk) 10:34, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Specifically the account of DavidAppletree and since it concerns off-wiki communication and personally identifying information I am sure you will understand that I cannot go into it further. That's why I referred to arbcom. Spartaz ^Humbug! 10:36, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Are you atheist???

Here is quote: [6] "The atheist Jimmy Wales was a lead founder of Wikipedia. Please feel free to contact the atheist Jimmy Wales"... If you are atheists, then I stop editing wikipedia from today as I undertand its goals opposing God. However if you are not atheist - then I may have some hope for theistic wikipedia... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.132.239.216 (talk) 17:42, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

Hi Jimbo. If you are wondering what the hell this is all about, the best route into this unedifying spectacle is Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Hare Krishna. Basically this guy thinks we have a grudge against his religion because his POV and poor quality content is up for deletion. I would like to make him understand that there is no grudge and that good quality writing on religious subjects is very welcome but I don't think I am getting through. --DanielRigal (talk) 18:32, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

While I agree that the IP's comment was rude and uncalled for, and Jimbo's religion is irrelevant as far as Wikipedia's goals are concerned (to create the most comprehensive encyclopedia of knowledge ever created); I must however point out that bad English, poor grammar, and not following our procedure's when in good faith trying to contribute does not make someone's contributions unneeded nor unwanted. Please work with contributors who dont live up to your "standards", poor quality can be fixed and is not a reason to dismiss contributions made in good faith. POV is another issue, and yet we have plenty of POV-pushers who end up in the long run making contributions (though I would never call them good) that are kept around. Perhaps a mentor is in order if this IP wishes to truly help the encyclopedia.Camelbinky (talk) 19:28, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

The nerve of some people to not believe without evidence in an invisible BFF in the sky. Unbelievable! - WAS 4.250 (talk) 20:34, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Coatrack, meet closet: Disgruntled IP. Gwen Gale (talk) 11:51, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

You should know about this.

A few weeks ago, there was a proposed hook on DYK (did you know) about the FBI seal along with a picture of it.

I thought that the mechanics of WP were progressing with nobody stepping back and thinking what was better for Wikipedia overall. It was going through the usual process which would have resulted in it being on the front page. I, therefore, notified you not to intervene but for you to be able to use your wise thinking and understanding of the big picture of Wikipedia to offer advice.

Today, I bring to you a different matter, possibly less profound. There are lots of editors with conflicts of interest. We ignore them. However, if companies have a conflict of interest or people with identifiable corporate links, we jump all over them and often block them. This is not very equal treatment of people. I proposed that everyone should disclose their potential conflicts of interest. In doing so, the reliability and reputation of Wikipedia is increased.

Scientific journals do this all the time. If a Dow Chemical chemist writes an article about chemical X, even if Dow Chemical does not make it, the chemist will have a disclosure in their article saying "Francisco Gomez, Ph.D. receives support from the American Chemical Society and is on the speaker's bureau for Varian X-Ray systems".

People say that they don't want this. They say it is impossible. It is easily possible. One of many ways is to add a tab at the top of the article that says "disclaimers" or "disclosures" or "possible conflicts of interest". If someone edits the Russian Army article, they would say "Editor X, I am a member of the French Army" or "Editor Y, I am employed by a supplier of parts to the Russian Army".

If the consensus is that editors don't want this, then they are supporting the idea that it is ok to have undisclosed conflicts of interest. Wikipedia can live with it but Wikipedia's credibility would be greatly enhanced with better ethics and disclosures. If you have a profound idea, let us know! I will not post the links to the VP to avoid accusations of canvassing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Suomi Finland 2009 (talk • contribs) 17:23, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

One problem is that editors will fiercely resist self regulation and don't want disclosures. That is the nature of the beast. Suomi Finland 2009 (talk) 01:03, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

We already have this; a talkpage tag noting something along the lines of "some editors may have a conflict of interest on this subject". Ironholds (talk) 13:01, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

And it's not like there would be a way to police that everyone was telling the truth. And impossible to track for IPs since they change. §hep^Talk 16:53, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

In most cases I have encountered it seems that the more well meaning people either declare COI, when they know about it, or simply are easily identified by their chosen names. The problem is that anyone with a name such as "BerteosOfAragorn" or "MrBigBen" are fairly anonymous and are unlikely to be identified as COI. Often it is the non-obvious persons that create the biggest hullaballoo with "They have COI - they cannot edit here!" when in reality it seems to me that these same pointers of fingers edit fairly obviously high percentage of single subject pages and yet do not declare COI themselves.

Although this may be true, and it is true that this can be a major problem, it is impossible to identify COI editors who are not declaring COI and have fairly nondescript names. It seems impossible to ensure any COI policy would work apart from supporting the people they pick on, ensuring neutrality, accuracy of sources and information, and other such guidelines are followed to make sure that any COI is kept to a minimum.

Then there is the matter of COI being used incorrectly to prevent editors from contributing - if we are going to ask for expert input "Attention from an expert is needed" it seems that these experts would be possibly the most COI persons to ask lol - and yet in many cases the best persons to edit are those involved in the field or company. As long as their input is scrutinised and accurate then these problems of COI should not exist. I think that it is a little, pardon me for saying this and no offence intended whatsoever, naieve to think that you will get a declaration out of someone with COI who was possibly going to be POV - and these are the very people who do the most damage.

It is an unfortunate and necessary evil as COI does not, in many cases, mean POV. COI/POV will always exist but it is only when they are misused/unbalanced that they affect negatively and only with diligent and accurate editing do we stand a chance of negating these two particular evils.Chaosdruid (talk) 01:50, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Revenue sharing on wikipedia

There is a discussion that you should consider, sir. Right here. Donald Schroeder JWH018 (talk) 03:48, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for Your Message to Persians!

Dear Mr Jimmy Wales, thanks for your message and congratulations to Wikipedia Persian users which recently reached their 100,000th entry! :) --Shayan7 13:00, 28 August 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shayan7 (talk • contribs)