Talk:Abney Park Cemetery

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Earlier stuff[edit]

Some great additions going on. And I've some Victorian ones that I want to do too - and I have a whole bunch of new pix (inc the Rev Watts) to break up the text a bit.

But - and I hate all that overwikifying that people do, where everything becomes a jungle of blue hyperlinks - still, might it not be a good idea to link a few of the more unfamiliar concepts to other 'pedia pages? Tarquin Binary 04:29, 9 October 2005 (UTC)

But, in the event, I have added quite a few links, not too many I hope. I created a heading early on so as to move the Contents list up higher. I've also corrected quite a few typos. Pic of Dr Watts moved right because it was going a bit funny on Firefox. But, in fact, I have quite a number of Abney Park pix, including separate ones of Watts and the chapel, less dark I think, than that one, so might replace in which case will alternate left-right to break up the layout.
I think a few more paragraph breaks might be in order too, maybe. And I am shocked that there are no entries for Cruickshank and O'Brien, so redlinked them. Have a short second world war section to add, but will be back with the pix ASAP. Tarquin Binary 17:46, 14 October 2005 (UTC)
Ok, I'm done messing around here. I apologise to whomever it may concern for replacing their images with mine. Ain't an ego thing - those I've uploaded were taken on the same day and around the same time, so there's a consistency of lighting and season that, I think, helps. But this is a wiki so, of course, you can put yours back if you want to. Tarquin Binary 02:07, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
Before I leave this one, really not sure about campo santo - why a Italian term for English nonconformists? Latin I could handle. But let's say 'stet' for now :) Tarquin Binary 02:46, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
The term campo santo was used by the Abney Park Cemetery Company in their brochure for Hendon Park Cemetery in 1903, it is a reference to the famous medieval cemetery in Pisa: Camposanto Monumentale. --JHvW (talk) 17:46, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Later stuff[edit]

Thank you Tarquin. It now reads so very well... and looks excellent too. How certain that the war memorial close to the chapel is solely commemorative of 2nd WW ? Must have a closer look..

Did you supply the copy, :) If so, then I take second place, some excellent material there. I live fairly close by, but I hadn't really delved into Abney Park history to that degree apart from being aware of who Isaac Watts was and suchlike. I just shaped it a bit, is all. Funnily enough, I have been concerning myself with Hackney stuff mostly, and one of the emerging threads I want to deploy elsewhere is the strong history of religious dissent and non-conformism in Hackney and neighbouring parts of northeast London. I like the idea of tieing the area together in this way (though it is not the only theme emerging).
Re: war memorial. There are two things here. I suspect you may be right in the sense that the Abney memorial is dedicated to both wars - if so that needs rewording. But I'm 95% sure the list of the dead is exclusively for WW2, just as that in the library is for WW1. But yes, another check is needed, I absolutely agree. While I'm at it, I'll image the one in the library. Tarquin Binary 21:17, 20 October 2005 (UTC)
Yes to supply of the copy you refer. I have a b/w photo in an old Abney Park Company prospectus (C20th but undated) that shows a (very slighly) different earlier design and have asked the War Grave Commission for any historical background they might have on its design/date. I am a trustee of the park cemetery, my private e-mail is - and I have had an interest in material on the local nonconformity too, collecting some material. Welcome to laise...
Moved your post down so in chronological order - I almost missed it. Anyway, I've got a current pic of the active service memorial, but it's not great and I didn't want to overburden the copy with pics. Indeed it would be interesting to see an earlier shot. Need any more help editing on Abney Park (for example a re-read) and doing pics, please let me know. I was hoping to work on a non-conformist piece later so maybe we could collaborate - but I think you may be more qualified to do the write-up, frankly. (Well, I wasn't just planning on covering non-conformism, there are some other interesting churches/synagogues/mosques in the borough, but non-conformism emerges as the most significant historical thread I think.) Right now, I'm focusing on filling out the pages for Hackney districts, Upper Clapton and Haggerston coming, and I really have to tackle Stoke Newington itself, it's very poor, but I keep putting that one off. But in the process of doing all that, I'm getting visuals that should be useful later on. Tarquin Binary 10:49, 24 October 2005 (UTC)

First & Second World Wars - Memorial Misunderstanding?[edit]

I am rewriting the first paragraph of this section to reflect the description given in the CWGC's website. The memorial is not a local community war memorial to those from the area who were killed, but one commonly erected by the CWGC in major city cemeteries to list servicemen buried in the cemetery whose graves could not be headstoned. These need not have been men from the area but those from beyond who died stationed in that area or in local military hospitals. Neither is it correct to term them killed in action as for most of the both World Wars those killed on operations abroad were not repatriated for burial in their home country. Those buried in such a cemetery in the UK would have died of effects of wounds, illnesses, accidents or even suicides. (Airmen killed engaging enemy planes such as during Battle of Britain, over Britain, could be classed as killed in action.)Cloptonson (talk) 12:37, 27 August 2012 (UTC)

Anyone maintaining the cemetery?[edit]

In the photos, the area appears alarmingly overgrown. I know its supposed to be a place of natural beauty but its still a cemetery, too. It looks like its been borderline abandoned. If you look on Google Earth there's a placemarker showing a tourist photo of the chapel (apparently called Stoke Newington) at the center of the cemetery. Its empty, and derelict, but looks pretty solid. Whats the story on this? --Ragemanchoo (talk) 05:59, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

At the risk of sounding a callous foreigner, the fact is that there is litte money for the upkeep of the cemetery. Most of the cemeteries in the Magnificent Seven are confronted with this problem. Of these cemeteries Highgate, Kensal Green and West Norwood are in reasonable shape and are being fixed up or taken care of by the "Friends movement". Abney Park and Nunhead are in a terrible shape. Brompton is maintained by the Royal Park Service, but is more or less a park and not a cemetery. As it is public, many of the memorials have been badly vandalised. Tower Hamlets is in a bad state but it looks like the "Friends movement" is restoring it. When I was there in februari there were already markers and they were hard at work. Brookwood Cemetery, the London Necropolis, suffers the same problem, although I would still recommend visiting it. As there has been a complaint of "overwikifying" on this page I have not linked any of these cemeteries. It should be noted that these cemeteries were originally privately owned but most of the companies that owned these cemeteries are now bankrupt. If you want to know more about this, you can look at the articles of the individual cemeteries (by clicking on the Magnificent Seven link), or consult a book on London Cemeteries like: Meller, Hugh & Brian Parsons, London Cemeteries: an illustrated guide and gazetteer, The History Press, 2008, ISBN 978-0750946223. --JHvW (talk) 18:07, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

pre history of the cemetery--thomas abney and watts[edit]

Perhaps it's worth mentioning that the Park was once the estate of Sir Thomas Abney, a leading non-conformist merchant and patron of Isaac Watts, who built a "manor" there in the late 17th or early 18th centuries. — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 17:22, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

CfD Proposal to delete Burial by place category[edit]

It has been proposed here to delete the category that links people to their place of burial. Note that the proposer is recommending the removal of the whole tree of categories, not just the the top level categories listed. Ephebi Ephebi (talk) 15:47, 20 November 2012 (UTC)