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"In the early twentieth century the home of the Cimmerians in the Caucasus led to their association with the ancient Aryans."

Whatever is meant, it ought to be expressed clearly.

S. — Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:{{{1}}}|{{{1}}}]] ([[User talk:{{{1}}}#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/{{{1}}}|contribs]])

User inserted "Ukraine and" into the who lived in the south of modern-day Ukraine and Russia,. This sentence doesn't look consistent - if they lievd in the south of modern-day Russia, then they could live in the north of modern-day Ukraine. Despite it is possible that Cimmerians lived in territory of modern Ukraine too, I don't have documental evidences of this, and I wouldn't rely on words of who is known for his biased Ukrainian nationalistic and often misleading changes. Therefore I revert insertion of Ukraine here. [[User:Drbug| Dr Bug ]] 11:30, 3 Jul 2004 (UTC)

This sentence doesn't look consistent - if they lievd in the south of modern-day Russia, then they could live in the north of modern-day Ukraine.
Please note
Physical Map of Europe.jpg
Perhaps You forgot the Crimean peninsula is a part of Ukraine?
I'm really tired by you Ukrainian nationalists. I didn't mean that Crimea is a part of Russian Federation.
I have fixed the article, now it should look fine. [[User:Drbug| Dr Bug ]] 21:37, 3 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Removed totally unsubstantiated edits presented as fact[edit]

I reverted Moosh 88's edits that stated the following:

1. The Cimmerians were an ancient Indo-European, who are believed to have been of Thraco-Phrygian origin.

  • We don't know for sure that they spoke anything like what we would call a Indo-European language, although if you have evidence that they did, or that they were Thracians, it would be relevant. Actually, the king name Sandakhshatra with -khshatra ending does seem to be Indo-European, but of the Indo-Aryan (satem) family, not Thracian or Phrygian (centum). Even so it is premature to conclude that the people were Indo-Europeans from this, since foreign-imposed kings often had such names, eg the Mitanni... More solid research needs to be added, not speculation.

2. The Cimmerians moved to the south of modern-day Ukraine (Crimea and northern Black sea coast) and Russia (Black Sea coast and Caucasus), a little after 1200 BC from an unknown location.

  • More speculation. Cimmerians are not mentioned in any records until the 8th century (see article).

3. Some scholors {sic} believe that the Cimmerians either came from Hungary or Romania or, less hypothetically, inhabited those countries as well.

  • Ok, this admits that it is speculation, so we might be able to stick this further along in the article, but probably not in the intro.

4. The Scythians took over the area around the 8th and 7th century BC.

  • Actually, this traditional view is based mainly on Herodotus, but it has been more recently called into question, so all sides of the story need to be presented. Codex Sinaiticus 22:04, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)

5. something to speculate/ponder: I am 13 and did research in the Cimmerians. Most of their tools were crafted from wood or bone!

6. THEY WERE SERBS ?! It is written Cimmeri where the arrow shows in cyrillic script!!! Please, check this option! There are some Serbian epic ethno poetry which in verses describes "our people" going back to India and meeting disaster there. And those songs were kept from one generation to other in vocal form. And is there any chance that Serbi —> Serboi are anyhow connected with Cimmerians?!

Cimmerians Britannica[edit]

Per people's information I found this in Britannica 2006:



member of an ancient people living north of the Caucasus and the Sea of Azov, driven by the Scythians out of southern Russia, over the Caucasus, and into Anatolia toward the end of the 8th century BC. Ancient writers sometimes confused them with the Scythians. Most scholars now believe that the Cimmerians assaulted Urartu (Armenia) about 714 BC, but in 705, after being repulsed by Sargon II of Assyria, they turned aside into Anatolia and in 696–695 conquered Phrygia. In 652, after taking Sardis, the capital of Lydia, they reached the summit of their power. Their decline soon began, and their final defeat may be dated from 637 or 626, when they were routed by Alyattes of Lydia. Thereafter, they were no longer mentioned in historical sources but probably settled in Cappadocia, as its Armenian name, Gamir, suggests.

The origin of the Cimmerians is obscure. Linguistically they are usually regarded as Thracian or as Iranian, or at least to have had an Iranian ruling class. They probably did live in the area north of the Black Sea, but attempts to define their original homeland more precisely by archaeological means, or even to fix the date of their expulsion from their country by the Scythians, have not so far been completely successful. One theory identifies them with what is known to archaeologists as the “Catacomb” culture. This culture was ousted from southern Russia by the “Srubna” culture advancing from beyond the Volga just as the Cimmerians were ousted by the invading Scythians, but that upheaval took place in the second half of the 2nd millennium BC, and a gap of several centuries separates it from the appearance of historic Cimmerians in Asia. Some authorities identify them with “Thraco-Cimmerian” remains of the 8th–7th century BC found in the southwestern Ukraine and in central Europe; these may perhaps be looked upon as traces of the western branch of the Cimmerians, who, under fresh Scythian pressure, eventually invaded the Hungarian plain and survived there until about 500 BC

Cimmerian names[edit]

The Cimmerians are alluded to in Homer, the Bible, and Herodotus, who don't have much to tell us. The Assyrians confirm their existence, movements, alliances, and invasions of Urartu, Phrygia, Lydia, ect. They considered the Cimmerians especially dangerous, but didn't give details why. They noted their on-off alliances with the Medes, Scythians, Babylonians, Syro-Hittites, and Thracians (a tribe called Treres). They recorded three royal names which may be in an East Iranian language; they may have migrated west centuries before the Scythians, their language developing in a different way. They might've ruled over non-Indo European northern Caucasian, Crimean, Maeotian tribes. Or they might've spoken their own Indo-European language, or something like Thracian, or Dacian, or a southern branch of proto-Baltic/Slavic. We don't know, and we'll never know, but as one of the legendary lost peoples of history plenty are those who envy over their legacy. Herodotus recounts some kind of civil war, or duel between aristocrats, near the Dniester, provoked by approaching Scythians from the east. According the Herodotus, the Scythians were chasing them. They crossed the Caucasus, and ended up in Mannae. Mannae at the time was a destination for deportees of the Assyrian empire (like the Israelis) and like most armies in those days the Cimmerians probably commanded anyone within their influence. A Roman reference to the Cimmerians puts them near the Amazons and Hyperboreans, north of the Caucasus - this could've been a Nakh speaking tribe as "Kham" means nation in their tongue. Lots of people have tried to get the meaning of "Cimmerian". It might be a place name ("winterland", "borderland", "misty land", "home between seas") or collective name ("archers", "company of mortals", "united riders", "heavenly riders", "standing unit", "lucky mortals", "mobile unit (nomads)") "united greats", "united riders"). Or it might be a Semitic name for nomads ("front to back/completions").

A few Cimmerian names have been preserved on tablet. Most are Eastern Iranian, some are Semitic, some are hard to tell. Some record dealings with Babylonian companies, the Murashu family in particular. They date from after the capture of Babylon in 612 BC. Dēmiši. Sakita. Terijama. Taddannu. Tiriparna. Tiribaza. Ušuka. Tatakka. See Encyclopedia Iranica for more.