Talk:Fist Crushing a U.S. Fighter Plane

Sculpture in name of article

Greetings, I've reverted your move at Fist Crushing a U.S. Fighter Plane. The move was not taken up on Discussion at all despite this being an active topic, and further you mispelled "Sculture" in your name change. I disagree that "sculpture" has to be in the title; we don't have a page called Mona Lisa Painting, or David Statue, and we don't entitle book articles Tale of Two Cities Book, so I fail to see why "Sculpture" should need to be in the title. If you disagree, please raise the issue at the article's Discussion page and we'll see where consensus leads. MatthewVanitas (talk) 13:18, 23 March 2011 (UTC) originally posted here

Sorry for the misspelling. Unless Muammar Gaddafi gave this sculpture a name (like all the other works of arts you mentioned above), I would think that the word sculpture needs to be in the article name. Otherwise, the entire phrase is a description rather than a proper noun for what is being featured in the article. Victor Victoria (talk) 13:27, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

I've reverted the move again, as there has been no consensus for a move demonstrated here on the Discussion page. No evidence that anyone other than Victor Victoria believes the title should be Fist Crushing a U.S. Fighter Plane Sculpture. Please do not move the page without a clear consensus for a move. MatthewVanitas (talk) 18:11, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Since no one raised objections, that means there is a consensus. I've already stated my reason to add the word sculpture. Nobody has given reasons against it other than "no consensus". It's now time for you to give clear reasons against.

I suppose YOU raised an objection, but I've fully answered your objection in that unless there is an official name to the sculpture, a description of the sculpture is not enough as an article title, and you need the word "sculpture" in the title. Victor Victoria (talk) 14:12, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

You've stated a belief, but you haven't linked any MOS or policy page to support that. We don't seem to be agreeing, and nobody else seems to have weighed in, so what say we take it to WP:WikiProject Arts or someone and ask for their insight on the naming process? MatthewVanitas (talk) 02:42, 28 March 2011 (UTC)

You can take this anywhere you think more eyes will look at it, that would be OK. All I can say is that I think by adding the word "sculpture" we are in better compliance with the neutrality requirement. Here is a quote from WP:Article titles#Neutrality in article titles:

Conflicts often arise over whether an article title complies with Wikipedia's Neutral Point of View policy. Resolving such debates depends on whether the article title is a name derived from reliable sources or a descriptive title created by Wikipedia editors.

Ideally, we should give the article the name Ghaddafi gave the sculpture, in the same way as we use Saddam's name for the Hands of victory Victory Arch article. Given that we do not know the name Ghaddafi gave the sculpture, by adding the word "sculpture" to the article we make it less ambiguous and less of a "descriptive title created by Wikipedia editors". Victor Victoria (talk) 12:04, 28 March 2011 (UTC)

esquire calls it: "Fist Crushing U.S. Fighter Plane". is that a reliable source? do you have a reliable source with "sculpture"? what is the naming policy for works of art?

sculpture - [1]

no sculpture; and sculpture [2]

no sculpture [3] [4] 98.163.75.189 (talk) 01:51, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

I moved it today before seeing the above discussion. If "sculpture" is needed in the name then it should be "(sculpture)", not capitalised as if it was part of the name of the work. – Fayenatic London 16:41, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

A better name

Many Arabic sources call this "نصب بيت الصمود" (House of Resistance Monument) since it is located in on the entrance of Gaddafi's residence bombed by the US in 1986. The house has been since called "بيت الصمود" (House of Resistance) and the monument erected somewhere in the 1980s was often refereed to it.--Rafy talk 22:13, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

If you have a WP:Reliable source noting the use of this Arabic name (regardless of the language of the source itself), it'd be great to add that to the lede like so: ({{lang-ar|نصب بيت الصمود}}, ''House of Resistance Monument''). So far as the actual article title, per WP:COMMONNAME article titles should be the most common way a given item is referred to in English. Unless English-language newspapers/books call this structure "House of Resistance Monument" then the actual title shouldn't change. Though personally I'd be interested in hearing any suggestions on title since media articles frequently mention it but don't tend to title it. MatthewVanitas (talk) 13:35, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

[5]; [6]; [7] 98.163.75.189 (talk) 02:05, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

Here is the only RS I found calling it "House of Resistance Monument", Others I found were mostly forums and facebook pages.--Rafy talk 00:42, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

File:ScreenSHot Gadahfi airplae sculpture.JPG Nominated for speedy Deletion

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