Talk:Masao Koga

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Naming order

@CurryTime7-24: Hello! In regards to Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Japan-related_articles#Name_order, is "Koga Masao" the most common naming order in the corpus of English language sources about him? So far the only working English URL in this article uses "Masao Koga"

Thanks, WhisperToMe (talk) 04:09, 29 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Clearly this topic is some kind of personal obsession of yours that you've already made your mind up about a long time ago. So why are you asking me these disingenuous questions? —CurryTime7-24 (talk) 04:20, 29 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I'm asking this question in good faith. As it is addressed in the Manual of Style (and has been so for years - you are welcome to read the previous discussions about this!), it is an issue that has come up over and over and over again. It is not a disingenuous question. There is a generally established procedure on deciding name order for people on Wikipedia. WhisperToMe (talk) 04:25, 29 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I doubt your sincerity, especially given that you seem to know the MOS well (at least on this matter). Because if that's what it says, then you already knew in advance that your preferred outcome was assured. Which made your question pointless. —CurryTime7-24 (talk) 04:36, 29 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I did not know in advance. That is because I hadn't yet run a check on his name in the various English-language academic/scholarly databases (Google Books, EBSCOHost, JSTOR, Google News). Google Books for the query: '"Masao Koga" composer' versus '"Koga Masao" composer'. I figured there would have to be more than one English language source about him in existence. I just didn't have the time to explore the question yet. Unfortunately Newspapers.com isn't available right now, so I can't run a check on that one. My understanding is that newspapers tend to use Western order while many academic/scholarly books (especially those in Asian Studies) tend to use Eastern order. Newspaper Archive shows various newspaper articles using "Masao Koga", while various books on Google Books using "Koga Masao" tend to be of an academic nature. Either way, I think the beginning criteria is mixed, so I am using other ways to determine the main name order.

In regards to criterion #2, Britannica (which uses Eastern order) doesn't seem to have an article on Koga (this I didn't know in advance!), and I'm not sure if any academic specialist encyclopedias count as a "a generally accepted English encyclopedia"???, so I think that #1 (if Koga endorsed such in his lifetime) and/or #3 (otherwise) are covered by these: This music album on Amazon uses "Masao Koga" as does this album. However... I am aware the music museum in Tokyo uses Eastern order. Perhaps if any films or media released during his lifetime (the museum would surely have these, but they don't have an e-mail address posted!) used "Masao Koga" in English, then he would have endorsed the usage and that would count as #1. Because he died in 1978 (when lastname first was uncommon for Japanese names in English), I think "Masao Koga" would most likely be the form in criterion #1. WhisperToMe (talk) 18:17, 1 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]