Talk:Pencarrow

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This article was created or improved during the "The 20,000 Challenge: UK and Ireland", which started on 20 August 2016 and is still open. You can help!

To be added..

Built around 1730 from the estates own quarry stone.^[1]
Owned by Stapleton family then Serjeaux family before the Molesworths^[2]
Historic England listing^[3]
British Listed Building entry^[4]
Own website^[5]

^ Hitchins, Fortescue; Drew, Samuel (1824). "History of Cornwall". The History of Cornwall: From the Earliest Records and Traditions, to the Present Time, Volume 2. Penaluna. p. 216. Retrieved 13 August 2016.
^ Lysons, Daniel (1814). "Cornwall". Magna Britannia: Cornwall Volume 3 of Magna Britannia: Being a Concise Topographical Account of the Several Counties of Great Britain. p. 82.
^ "Pencarrow". Historic England. Retrieved 13 August 2016.
^ "Pencarrow House, Egloshayle". British Listed Buildings. Retrieved 13 August 2016.
^ "Welcome to our family home". Pencarrow: House & Gardens. Retrieved 13 August 2016.

Not the primary topic

There are a three Pencarrow articles on Wikipedia and a pageview analysis shows that this isn't the primary topic. I shall move it (probably tomorrow) to make way for a dab page. Schwede 66 09:11, 30 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

A slightly longer term analysis is by no means as clear in supporting your preferred option. I think that to move it less than one day after not even bothering to make it clear to watchlisters that you are actually proposing a move is very poor. You should revert yourself. DuncanHill (talk) 18:06, 30 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The building is called Pencarrow House, why on earth has it been moved to Pencarrow Mansion???? 18:54, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 31 October 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved. Closing this in favor of moving the pages largely because this is the reversion of an undiscussed move. (closed by non-admin page mover) Calidum 20:10, 24 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Pencarrow House → Pencarrow
Pencarrow → Pencarrow (disambiguation)

– I moved this page earlier today to make room for a new disambiguation page. As I stated in the item above, this isn't the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC based on page view analysis. Note that this link covers roughly two months worth of data up until 29 October (the last day where "Pencarrow" referred to the house. Note also that "Pencarrow Heads" was a redirect until yesterday that got some daily views, too; this is an article as of earlier today. I am aware that there is a further Pencarrow Heads in Cornwall (no idea whether it's well-known). Either way, the analysis as is has "Pencarrow" at 10 of a total of 23 views of all the Pencarrows. I thought that all this is rather uncontroversial and hence I moved the article without discussion but User:DuncanHill does not concur. I shall therefore put this case to the community on behalf of DuncanHill so that the community can weigh in. Schwede 66 09:18, 31 October 2018 (UTC)--Relisting. B dash (talk) 11:19, 9 November 2018 (UTC)--Relisting. SITH (talk) 12:25, 16 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose as the this isn't the primary topic in my view. Schwede 66 09:18, 31 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support as the page view analysis I posted in the section above shews, the house (when it was at Pencarrow) got more than twice as many views as the other candidates over a 90 day period. I would note that owing to the opposition of seasons between Cornwall and UK, and the fact that people are more likely to search for holiday and outing destinations (whether historic houses, or landscape features) in Summer, the choice of October for a viewing analysis is likely to favour a Southern Hemisphere place. Perhaps figures for a whole year would be better. The electoral division was a short lived entity, the head is called Pencarrow Head, and the lighthouse is called a lighthouse. I would be interested to know too if many - or any - incorrect links to Pencarrow were found when the article for the house was there. If there were many then it would incline me to accept that the disambiguation was necessary, if there were not then it would seem to be disambiguation for disambiguation's sake. I will add that it would have been much better for Schwede66 to have made a proposal before moving, rather than making the move he wants, refusing to revert, and then making a proposal in which he does not believe. I think making a proposal in order to make the very first !vote an oppose is a bit off. DuncanHill (talk) 10:51, 31 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
There was one for the hamlet. Crouch, Swale (talk) 11:12, 31 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. I know the "hamlet", it's barely that (even by Cornish standards). Basically a farm and its associated buildings that are now houses. DuncanHill (talk) 11:28, 31 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

DuncanHill, I invited you to put a formal move request forward but since you weren't doing it, I thought I better do it myself. I'm sorry to hear that doing so (and then, naturally, voting first) is yet another reason for you to be upset. I think there were one or two links pointing to the house that were meant to point to one of the New Zealand articles (e.g. this one). Schwede 66 11:18, 31 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

There's nothing wrong with a bold move, but if opposition then develops, it's usually best to revert to the stable title first and then make the proposal. Station1 (talk) 08:20, 1 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Well just like Hagley Park, this move could only be reverted by an admin or page mover, however Schwede66 is an admin. Crouch, Swale (talk) 09:49, 7 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Weak oppose If there was a PT, I think it would indeed be the house, but the house appears to be sometimes known as "Pencarrow House" (from a simple Google search), so WP:NATURAL may apply (and the views don't indicate a clear PT), however the OS and the Listing call it "Pencarrow" so it could go at Pencarrow, Egloshayle. Pencarrow Head is in Lanteglos parish, although there is currently no content in that article, there is content about a short walk by the National Trust. I don't think over the (at least 3) places of this name, there is a clear PT. Crouch, Swale (talk) 11:00, 31 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support as a reversion of an undiscussed move. There are only two articles currently on WP that could reasonably be titled "Pencarrow", this one and Pencarrow (New Zealand electorate). Of the two this one is the WP:primary topic, and would still be even if Pencarrow Head were included. - Station1 (talk) 08:20, 1 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment If disambiguation is kept, then do we think it should stay as Pencarrow House, or be Pencarrow, Egloshayle, or something else? Even if DAB isn't kept, the Commons category should be disambiguated, as should Pencarrow Head. Crouch, Swale (talk) 09:49, 7 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]
It certainly should not be "Pencarrow, Egloshayle", as that is a name somebody made up one lunchtime, not one actually used. It may be in the civil parish, but nobody would answer the question "Where is Pencarrow?" by saying "Egloshayle". DuncanHill (talk) 15:03, 7 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Using the civil parish is the usual DAB when there are multiple places in the same district (since mainland Cornwall is all 1 district). I assume you think that the current title is best if it remains disambiguated. Crouch, Swale (talk) 15:09, 7 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I think "Pencarrow" is the best title, and "Pencarrow House" the least-worst alternative. DuncanHill (talk) 15:13, 7 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose it's a house. The others aren't. In ictu oculi (talk) 13:57, 16 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

[1] Hitchins, Fortescue; Drew, Samuel (1824). "History of Cornwall". The History of Cornwall: From the Earliest Records and Traditions, to the Present Time, Volume 2. Penaluna. p. 216. Retrieved 13 August 2016.

[2] Lysons, Daniel (1814). "Cornwall". Magna Britannia: Cornwall Volume 3 of Magna Britannia: Being a Concise Topographical Account of the Several Counties of Great Britain. p. 82.

[3] "Pencarrow". Historic England. Retrieved 13 August 2016.

[4] "Pencarrow House, Egloshayle". British Listed Buildings. Retrieved 13 August 2016.

[5] "Welcome to our family home". Pencarrow: House & Gardens. Retrieved 13 August 2016.

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