Talk:Ranks in the Boy Scouts of America

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1

Requested move 04 October 2008

Propose rename to Advancement in Boy Scouting (Boy Scouts of America). Article needs to include all other advancement and recognition to pu the rank scheme into context. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 11:04, 4 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 12 October 2019

This discussion was listed at Wikipedia:Move review on 21 October 2019. The result of the move review was Closure endorsed.

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

It was proposed in this section that Ranks in the Boy Scouts of America be renamed and moved to Ranks in Scouts BSA.

Not moved per general agreement below. Kudos to editors for your input, and Happy Publishing! (nac by page mover) P. I. Ellsworth, ed. ^put'r there 04:04, 21 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Links: current log • target log

This is Template:Requested move/end

Ranks in the Boy Scouts of America → Ranks in Scouts BSA – Reflect change in the program name --evrik ^(talk) 16:43, 12 October 2019 (UTC) --Relisting. Sceptre (talk) 23:34, 19 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Support as nominator. The Boy Scouts of America is different than Scouts BSA and Cub Scouting (Boy Scouts of America). The ranks are part of Scouts BSA. --evrik ^(talk) 22:11, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Strike support. You obviously support it. -- Necrothesp (talk) 13:58, 16 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose, per most understandable and common name. Will create a redirect for the proposed name. Randy Kryn (talk) 11:30, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- The program is no longer Boy Scouts, but is now Scouts BSA. --evrik ^(talk) 18:49, 20 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose: the initials BSA have other meanings. Anthony Appleyard (talk) 04:28, 20 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Scouts BSA is not the BSA. --evrik ^(talk) 18:49, 20 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose move. In addition to the common name stuff, this article is dependent on the article for its subject, which remains at Boy Scouts of America. O.N.R. ^(talk) 12:50, 20 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- No, the program is now Scouts BSA. --evrik ^(talk) 18:49, 20 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested move 21 October 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

It was proposed in this section that Ranks in the Boy Scouts of America be renamed and moved to Ranks in Scouts BSA.

Withdrawn by nom. P. I. Ellsworth, ed. ^put'r there 23:49, 21 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Links: current log • target log

This is Template:Requested move/end

Ranks in the Boy Scouts of America → Ranks in Scouts BSA

Support as nominator. Second try - as you can see by these edits, the program name has changed from Boy Scouts to Scouts BSA. I am proposing a change in the article title to reflect this program change.--evrik ^(talk) 16:22, 21 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose and quick close per RM above which was just closed a few hours ago. 'Boy Scouts of America' is the common and most familiar name of the organization. Randy Kryn (talk) 18:38, 21 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment @Randy Kryn:, the first debate was closed prematurely. Have you read the verbiage in the article? Is it correct? If it is, the the title disagrees with the content. --evrik ^(talk) 19:04, 21 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Previously the "mid age" program was named "Boy Scouts" and the organization "Boy Scouts of America" Now the mid-age program is named "Scouts BSA" and the organization remains "Boy Scouts of America". I think that that points towards leaving the title as-is for three reasons:

"Boy Scouts of America" (vs. "Boy Scouts") in the current title is the name of the organization, not the program, and that has not changed. So the article has been named by the organization, not the program. And rightly so, because in many cases the awards/ranks are not confined to the program.
A 2nd reason is that "Boy Scouts" is still a common name for "Scouts BSA"
A third reason is that the ranks are often not limited to the "Scouts BSA" program....it applies to other "older scout" programs. So it would wrong to name it by only one of the eligible programs.

So I guess that that's an "oppose" Sincerely,North8000 (talk) 20:49, 21 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose on procedural grounds. A new RM should not be opened so soon after a previous one reached consensus, unless the nominator has some important new information to present that they think was overlooked in the previous discussion. If you think the earlier RM was closed inappropriately, you can try move review, but I don't fancy your chances in this case. The RM was open for more than 7 days and roundly opposed. Colin M (talk) 20:56, 21 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Name

I'm coming late to this. Looks like to me like this article was misnamed from the beginning. It only applied to the Boy Scouts program of the BSA, thus it should have been named "Ranks in Boy Scouts (Boy Scouts of America), with the parenthetical disambiguation needed because there are many Boy Scout programs. Looking at the above discussions, the confusion is that the Boy Scouts of America is the parent and Scouts BSA, formerly Boy Scouts, is a sub-program. There is an old request above from 2008 that makes that same point. The current title only makes sense if it included the other sub-program Cub Scout, Venturing and Sea Scout ranks, which it obviously does not. With the change in the program name and the main article title changed to Scouts BSA, this article needs to be renamed to Ranks in Scouts BSA. --Eagleinflight (talk) 14:51, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Long story short, the subject is not exclusively in Scouts BSA. To a lesser extent (the upper of these ranks, with conditions) is also in Venturing and Sea Scouts. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 15:58, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

~~North8000 repeats the misconception that has led to the renaming languishing.~~ @Eagleinflight: you can still comment here: Wikipedia:Move review/Log/2019_October#Ranks_in_the_Boy_Scouts_of_America. --evrik ^(talk) 16:13, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

It is a point, but not made in the article. --Eagleinflight (talk) 16:34, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

What is the mis-conception / error in my post? North8000 (talk) 19:22, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Withdrawn, my mistake. --evrik ^(talk) 22:13, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]